From olaf at interactivelink.nl Sat Feb 1 02:40:28 2003 From: olaf at interactivelink.nl (Olaf Molenveld) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:50 2004 Subject: [NM] cooperation asked References: <008901c2c94a$d4650bb0$0100a8c0@olaf> <3E3AB722.7BF260EF@netzradio.de> Message-ID: <003a01c2c9de$5754e7a0$0100a8c0@olaf> thanx, i will take a look into these..... i am especially interested in techniques that try to model phase-shifts and distortions in certain frequency-ranges, distortion created by the needle-tracing, and resonance/feedback paths in certain freq ranges created by resonance in the cartridge and/or tone-arm...i've plenty of information about these...but some of it is quiet scientific.. Olaf ----- Original Message ----- From: chris To: Olaf Molenveld ; Nord Modular Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 6:49 PM Subject: Re: [NM] cooperation asked > Has been done by ? > > Cheers, > Chris > > Olaf Molenveld wrote: > > > > Hello people, > > > > i am looking for someone to cooperate on a "vinyl emulation" patch for the > > nord modular. I have a lot of information and ideas, collected from the > > internet, and from my own experiments. Now i want to use this to create a > > patch that can be used to recreate the vinyl characteristics of sound on an > > incoming audio signal in the NM. I am afraid i don't have enough DSP and > > audio experience to fully recreate my ideas and info in the NM, so it would > > be very nice to hook up with someone who does and/or i can discuss ideas > > about this with....so if anyone's interested in this email me privately at > > olaf@expansions.nl > > > > Thanx, Olaf > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > [Header] > Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 > 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 1 600 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 > [/Header] > [ModuleDump] > 1 > 1 4 0 28 > 2 40 0 17 > 3 32 0 21 > 4 68 0 7 > 5 25 1 7 > 6 69 0 10 > 7 84 0 14 > 8 91 1 14 > 10 50 1 29 > 11 37 1 12 > 12 91 2 13 > 13 44 1 27 > 14 19 1 25 > 15 31 2 20 > 16 54 2 22 > 17 52 2 24 > 18 38 2 11 > 19 91 3 10 > 20 37 2 9 > 21 2 0 0 > 22 62 0 3 > 23 18 1 0 > [/ModuleDump] > [ModuleDump] > 0 > [/ModuleDump] > [CurrentNoteDump] > 64 0 0 64 0 0 > [/CurrentNoteDump] > [CableDump] > 1 > 2 6 0 1 7 0 0 > 2 6 0 1 11 0 0 > 2 6 0 1 20 0 0 > 0 21 1 1 23 1 0 > 0 21 0 1 23 0 0 > 0 23 0 1 22 0 0 > 0 22 0 1 2 3 0 > 2 20 0 1 18 0 0 > 1 19 0 1 14 2 0 > 2 12 2 1 19 1 0 > 0 17 1 1 2 2 0 > 2 8 2 1 12 1 0 > 1 12 0 1 14 1 0 > 0 15 0 1 16 0 0 > 2 18 0 1 17 0 0 > 0 16 0 1 17 1 0 > 0 10 1 1 13 1 0 > 0 13 0 0 13 1 0 > 0 13 0 1 2 1 0 > 0 14 0 1 10 0 0 > 1 8 0 1 14 0 0 > 2 11 0 1 8 1 0 > 1 7 0 1 2 0 0 > 2 4 1 1 6 0 0 > 0 2 0 1 3 0 0 > 0 3 0 1 1 1 0 > 0 1 0 0 1 1 0 > 1 5 0 1 8 0 0 > 1 12 0 0 8 0 0 > 1 19 0 0 12 0 0 > [/CableDump] > [CableDump] > 0 > [/CableDump] > [ParameterDump] > 1 > 1 4 3 0 0 0 > 2 40 9 50 76 16 65 100 100 100 100 1 > 3 32 15 0 0 87 127 120 91 90 117 96 122 127 96 0 0 0 > 4 68 2 27 1 > 5 25 8 99 2 64 0 0 0 0 64 > 6 69 1 3 > 7 84 3 0 5 0 > 8 91 19 42 98 32 47 124 109 0 127 88 25 62 105 106 44 126 98 15 0 0 > 10 50 3 96 14 0 > 11 37 1 51 > 12 91 19 31 107 34 30 55 46 120 102 111 107 75 25 92 108 100 54 15 0 0 > 13 44 1 0 > 14 19 3 127 126 127 > 15 31 1 69 > 16 54 1 0 > 17 52 11 89 56 76 0 56 97 74 97 56 3 2 > 18 38 1 73 > 19 91 19 25 107 2 61 85 29 26 91 11 18 37 107 124 68 67 34 15 0 0 > 20 37 1 83 > 22 62 2 0 27 > 23 18 2 0 64 > [/ParameterDump] > [ParameterDump] > 0 > [/ParameterDump] > [KnobMapDump] > 1 1 0 17 > 1 2 0 2 > 1 2 1 5 > 1 2 2 8 > 1 2 3 11 > [/KnobMapDump] > [CustomDump] > 1 > 10 1 0 > [/CustomDump] > [CustomDump] > 0 > [/CustomDump] > [NameDump] > 1 > 1 K. v.d. Maarel > 2 Mixer1 > 3 Filter Bank1 > 4 TurnTable > 5 LFOB1 > 6 ClkDiv1 > 7 Needle > 8 CtrlSeq1 > 10 FilterC1 > 11 LogicDelay1 > 12 CtrlSeq1 > 13 GainControl1 > 14 Mixer2 > 15 Noise1 > 16 Quantizer1 > 17 Multi-Env1 > 18 Pulse1 > 19 CtrlSeq1 > 20 LogicDelay1 > 21 AudioIn1 > 22 Overdrive1 > 23 X-Fade1 > [/NameDump] > [NameDump] > 0 > [/NameDump] > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > [Header] > Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 > 0 127 0 127 1 0 0 1 4000 2 1 0 1 1 1 1 0 1 0 0 1 1 1 > [/Header] > [ModuleDump] > 1 > 3 4 1 40 > 4 103 2 40 > 5 103 0 40 > 6 84 1 6 > 7 103 2 36 > 8 103 0 36 > 11 1 1 12 > 13 84 1 16 > 14 2 1 0 > 16 51 2 12 > 17 51 0 12 > 18 51 0 4 > 19 51 2 4 > 34 18 0 32 > 35 18 2 32 > 36 43 1 34 > 37 43 1 10 > 38 43 1 20 > 39 21 1 24 > [/ModuleDump] > [ModuleDump] > 0 > [/ModuleDump] > [CurrentNoteDump] > 64 0 0 52 29 1 > [/CurrentNoteDump] > [CableDump] > 1 > 0 16 0 1 39 1 0 > 0 17 0 1 39 0 0 > 0 39 1 1 35 1 0 > 1 36 0 1 35 2 0 > 1 36 0 1 34 2 0 > 0 39 0 1 34 1 0 > 0 14 1 1 35 0 0 > 0 14 1 1 19 2 0 > 1 6 0 1 19 3 0 > 1 6 0 1 18 3 0 > 0 14 0 1 34 0 0 > 0 14 0 1 18 2 0 > 1 37 0 1 19 1 0 > 1 37 0 1 18 1 0 > 0 18 0 1 17 2 0 > 1 13 0 1 17 3 0 > 1 13 0 1 16 3 0 > 0 19 0 1 16 2 0 > 1 38 0 1 17 1 0 > 1 38 0 1 16 1 0 > 0 34 0 1 8 0 0 > 0 35 0 1 7 0 0 > 2 11 1 1 13 0 0 > 2 11 1 1 6 0 0 > 0 8 0 1 5 0 0 > 0 7 0 1 4 0 0 > 0 4 0 1 3 1 0 > 0 5 0 1 3 0 0 > [/CableDump] > [CableDump] > 0 > [/CableDump] > [ParameterDump] > 1 > 3 4 3 127 0 0 > 4 103 5 99 71 45 0 127 > 5 103 5 99 70 42 0 127 > 6 84 3 0 72 0 > 7 103 5 60 76 64 0 127 > 8 103 5 60 75 64 0 127 > 13 84 3 0 74 0 > 16 51 10 0 0 0 0 0 127 0 1 0 0 > 17 51 10 0 0 0 0 0 127 0 1 0 0 > 18 51 10 2 0 0 0 0 127 0 1 0 0 > 19 51 10 2 0 0 0 0 127 0 1 0 0 > 34 18 2 127 64 > 35 18 2 127 64 > 36 43 2 127 0 > 37 43 2 42 1 > 38 43 2 15 1 > 39 21 9 0 33 10 0 36 24 0 0 0 > [/ParameterDump] > [ParameterDump] > 0 > [/ParameterDump] > [MorphMapDump] > 61 0 56 94 > 1 16 3 3 127 1 16 8 0 127 1 17 3 3 127 1 17 8 0 127 1 18 3 2 127 1 18 8 1 127 1 19 3 2 127 1 19 8 1 127 > [/MorphMapDump] > [KnobMapDump] > 1 3 0 0 > 1 6 0 1 > 1 6 1 4 > 1 13 0 7 > 1 13 1 10 > 1 36 0 17 > 1 37 0 8 > 1 38 0 11 > 1 39 2 13 > 1 39 3 14 > 2 1 0 3 > 2 1 1 6 > 2 1 2 2 > 2 1 3 5 > [/KnobMapDump] > [CustomDump] > 0 > [/CustomDump] > [CustomDump] > 1 > 16 1 0 > 17 1 0 > 18 1 0 > 19 1 0 > [/CustomDump] > [NameDump] > 1 > 3 Main Outs > 4 EqLoMid R > 5 EqLoMid L > 6 Lo-Env > 7 EqHiMid R > 8 EqHiMid L > 11 Keyboard > 13 Hi-Env > 14 Audio Input > 16 Hi - Right > 17 Hi - Left > 18 Lo - Left > 19 Lo - Right > 34 FX/Orig Mix L > 35 FX/Orig Mix R > 36 Original/FX Mix > 37 Warm > 38 Tinny > 39 Compressor1 > [/NameDump] > [NameDump] > 0 > [/NameDump] > From nord_modular_conf at mkv.mh.se Sat Feb 1 03:53:14 2003 From: nord_modular_conf at mkv.mh.se (Nord_Modular_Conf) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Soundscape in G Message-ID: Great! I used this patch in slot D. //Per Mattsson -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: soft glassvibra.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2090 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030201/363ce0bc/softglassvibra.obj From richard at chorlton.com Sat Feb 1 06:51:09 2003 From: richard at chorlton.com (Richard) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Soundscape in G References: Message-ID: <002201c2ca01$5cfda520$7659063e@richardw98tcli> I'm liking this patch a lot too Per! I'd like to set it up as a very slow and not to predictable noodle triggering different pitches - anyone got any advice as to how I should trigger it? Its a new area to me so I need to to be simple! Richard ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nord_Modular_Conf" To: Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [NM] Soundscape in G > Great! > > I used this patch in slot D. > > //Per Mattsson > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 1 06:59:41 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] TCP: Choice of scripting language In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030130173515.00b94020@63.202.202.154> References: <000301c2b88c$5f4e62a0$9002a8c0@in.nuxeo.com> <11448703752.20030104104252@yefrewenchi.com> <003701c2b4a3$9087e810$3fcc96c1@Xochiquetzal> <1573294136.20030105062012@yefrewenchi.com> <018b01c2b57a$b5e81a80$0b01a8c0@INLINE1> <001801c2b588$775739a0$7c53c950@TWISTIE> <15242019611.20030106065532@yefrewenchi.com> <000301c2b88c$5f4e62a0$9002a8c0@in.nuxeo.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030130173515.00b94020@63.202.202.154> Message-ID: <194174301993.20030201065941@yefrewenchi.com> On 1/30/2003 Ron Stephens wrote: > Mind sharing with us which tool that is? > THANKS! Adobe GoLive 6 http://www.adobe.com/products/golive/main.html (A pupil of mine used to work there so I got it for $25!!!) -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From alex.bennett at attbi.com Sat Feb 1 09:59:48 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] top 3 fav film scores References: <10f.1dcd633f.2b6c575e@aol.com> Message-ID: <004001c2ca1b$b6851d20$a90dec0c@attbi.com> 2001: A Space Odyssey. The sound is often more important than the picture in that movie, psychologically. From kadrock at pipeline.com Sat Feb 1 10:14:47 2003 From: kadrock at pipeline.com (Atom) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] sort of (OT) sample CD/pad sound In-Reply-To: <188158198938.20030129105247@yefrewenchi.com> References: <001501c2c636$66787860$640314cf@euphonix.com> <188158198938.20030129105247@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: Kofi- that looks like it! Thanks!!!! BTW... I tried to isolate the pad... used PEAK on the mac. basically I looped it, found good cross points. And then I tried a DSP function called "convolver" ... I forget what it means to "convolve" something but that somehow removed most of the noise! What the?! It needs some EQ but it's usable (at least in my semi-lo-fi murky world of music making). Huh. cheers, Atom At 10:52 AM -0800 1/29/03, Friday's Child wrote: >On 1/27/2003 Atom Atom wrote: > >> hey there NM people, >Hi > >> I don't usually buy sample CDs, or never actually... but I'm dying >> for this pad sound. I found this mp3 demo a while back, I think the >> CD is called Twisted FX >Would this by any chance be it? >http://www.midi-classics.com/f/f16274.htm > >-- > >With every good wish, >K(ofi) B(usia) -- _______________________________________________________ .MELANGE.electronic.music. http://www.melange.org .media/scoring/art/design. "Talking about art is like dancing about architecture." - David Bowie _______________________________________________________ From ico at pruts.nl Sat Feb 1 13:08:48 2003 From: ico at pruts.nl (Ico Doornekamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Looking for micro in NL Message-ID: <20030201210848.GA2245@pruts.nl> Hi all, Due to a lack of space on my desk I'm looking for a second hand micromodular in the Netherlands. Does anybody know a cheap one for sale, or anybody selling one him(her)self ? From Terryfunken at aol.com Sun Feb 2 03:00:55 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] top 3 fav film scores Message-ID: <147.95ad943.2b6e5467@aol.com> In a message dated 1/2/03 6:02:15 pm, alex.bennett@attbi.com writes: >2001: A Space Odyssey. The sound is often more important than the picture > >in that movie, psychologically. > > Alex, I agree with you, but the soundtrack for 2001 (like many of Kubrick's flicks) wasn't specifically written for that film, so imo in this case the film is more important than the soundtrack- but in Kubrick's case, it's the only time i've ever listened to Johan Strauss where the music of Strauss made perfect sense!! Also I think Lygetti's compositions would have been less well known if it wasn't for this film. I think 2001 is the only space film I have seen where there is acknowledgement that in space (in a vacuum) you can't hear anything. I think there is a greater impact in the fact that when they are floating in nothingness, you don't hear a single noise apart from the sound of breathing- I think that this-imo- is even more disturbing psychologically than the spooky tones of Lygetti, and the fact that it's the only time you can sit with 100 or so people in a cinema- and not hear a single noise from the audience. I always found this extremely disturbing!. (Incidently, 2001 is the code on our house security alarm!!- hmmm, if I get done over now, I can point my finger at code404!!!! heh;) While we are on the subject of Strauss'es, have you ever heard '4 last songs' by Richard Strauss?- I think this is proof of the power of 'classical' music (although it's not classical, because of the time it was written- but then i'm just being a dumb nerdy nit-picker- sorry! hehehe!|;) Tom :-) From robnet at wxs.nl Sun Feb 2 09:09:31 2003 From: robnet at wxs.nl (Robert van der Kamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Ftp archive password? Message-ID: <200302021809.31489.robnet@wxs.nl> Hoi, ik probeer de zip versies van de nieuwe workshops te downloaden van de ftp archive. Onder linux gaat het best, maar onder windows word ik om een password gevraagd die ik niet kan verzinnen. Wat moet ik hier intikken? Bedankt, Robert From robnet at wxs.nl Sun Feb 2 09:18:19 2003 From: robnet at wxs.nl (Robert van der Kamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Ftp archive password? In-Reply-To: <200302021809.31489.robnet@wxs.nl> References: <200302021809.31489.robnet@wxs.nl> Message-ID: <200302021818.19709.robnet@wxs.nl> Sorry, I wasn't thinking! English!! I can't find the password for the FTP archive when trying to download the zipped versions of the workshops. Can anyone help me? Thanks, Robert From Terryfunken at aol.com Sun Feb 2 09:30:51 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> There was quite an interesting piece in yesterday's "Guardian" newspaper which I think some people might find interesting (especially all you pianist's out there! http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,886739,00.html if you can't find the link, the try; www.guardian.co.uk/arts then, type in the search box; "Composer reinvents the Piano" Debussy anyone? Tom :-) From ico at pruts.nl Sun Feb 2 09:59:55 2003 From: ico at pruts.nl (Ico Doornekamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Ftp archive password? In-Reply-To: <200302021818.19709.robnet@wxs.nl> References: <200302021809.31489.robnet@wxs.nl> <200302021818.19709.robnet@wxs.nl> Message-ID: <20030202175955.GB2245@pruts.nl> > I can't find the password for the FTP archive when trying to > download the zipped versions of the workshops. If you are referring to the Nordsynth.zevv.nl site, that's not using FTP but plain HTTP. Just go to http://nordsynth.zevv.nl If you refer to the synthcom archive, I don't know... From dpa_dvsn at slami.ru Sun Feb 2 05:52:00 2003 From: dpa_dvsn at slami.ru (Slami DPA division) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Fretless bass guitar patch wanted Message-ID: <004901c2cac2$42a0dd20$1200a8c0@aha.ru> Hi, everybody on NM-list! There were some fretless bass guitar (Karplus-strong type or so) model patches on list some time ago, can you attach some now, please? best vishes! Phil mix2r@ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030202/7cd72fe7/attachment.htm From valis at ucla.edu Sun Feb 2 11:05:15 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (Valis Vitalis) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] Ftp archive password? References: <200302021809.31489.robnet@wxs.nl> <200302021818.19709.robnet@wxs.nl> Message-ID: <3E3D6BEB.8040907@ucla.edu> I was there the other day and i believe I used Modular as the username and Nord as the password and got in. vV Robert van der Kamp wrote: >Sorry, I wasn't thinking! English!! > >I can't find the password for the FTP archive when trying to >download the zipped versions of the workshops. > >Can anyone help me? > >Thanks, >Robert >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. > > > From brendanheading at clara.co.uk Sun Feb 2 11:39:05 2003 From: brendanheading at clara.co.uk (Brendan Heading) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:52 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? In-Reply-To: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> References: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> Message-ID: In message <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com>, Terryfunken@aol.com writes >There was quite an interesting piece in yesterday's "Guardian" newspaper >which I think some people might find interesting (especially all you >pianist's out there! What's this got to do with the synthesizer being dead ? That's hyperbole. Clearly the synthesizer exists for reasons other than microtones and alternative tuning. Heck, the vast majority of synthesizers out there (including our beloved Nord) do not allow you to use alternative tuning tables. -- Brendan Heading, Belfast, Northern Ireland Caill do chl? agus faigh ar ais ?, agus n? h? an rud c?anna ?. From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Sun Feb 2 13:06:15 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] Sound of the memorymoog Message-ID: Borrowed a Memorymoog from a friend for the weekend. The typical thing about it is that the filter tends to give all sounds a little a reverberated character, quite typical for the ladderfilter. Most other filters give some sort of 'right in your face' effect, but this synth is definitely special here. Bad thing is that it makes the sounds sounding a bit outdated, fast sequencing memorymoog sounds doesn't seem to work very well, but the padsounds are beautiful. So I made a patch trying to capture a bit of the reverberated character. With some delay line tricks it sounds even deeper. Terrible thing about digital oscillators is that unisono in the higher registers is sounding so awful, I mean the high buzzy sound killing the spatial effect of three unisono saws, so there is some trick that tunes the oscs closer to each other when playing higher notes. Does seem to improve things quite a lot. Still it is all very subtle. Well, let me know what you think. Have fun, Rob -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: MemoryOfMoog.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3422 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030202/415be20a/MemoryOfMoog.obj From robnet at wxs.nl Sun Feb 2 15:00:04 2003 From: robnet at wxs.nl (Robert van der Kamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] Ftp archive password? In-Reply-To: <3E3D6BEB.8040907@ucla.edu> References: <200302021809.31489.robnet@wxs.nl> <200302021818.19709.robnet@wxs.nl> <3E3D6BEB.8040907@ucla.edu> Message-ID: <200302030000.04767.robnet@wxs.nl> On Sunday 02 February 2003 20:05, Valis Vitalis wrote: > I was there the other day and i believe I used Modular as > the username and Nord as the password and got in. Thanks, I'll give it a try. - Robert From Terryfunken at aol.com Sun Feb 2 15:58:21 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: <90.31db3493.2b6f0a9d@aol.com> In a message dated 2/2/03 7:41:09 pm, brendanheading@clara.co.uk writes: >What's this got to do with the synthesizer being dead ? That's > >hyperbole. Clearly the synthesizer exists for reasons other than > >microtones and alternative tuning. Heck, the vast majority of > >synthesizers out there (including our beloved Nord) do not allow you to > > >use alternative tuning tables. Calm down ;) Don't bite my head off!!- It was meant as a tounge in cheek joke :) My point was that the Piano keyboard created the grounds for the interface used on the majority of synthesizers. Synthesizers were a very important part of the development of the on going progression of keyboard instruments, and if you read the text, it points out that this scale of tuning of the piano could only heard principly by using a synthesizer (or by using eastern instruments etc.) Anyway this is pointless, i've been up all night and I didn't want to start a stupid flame war over something that is (imo) very innovative. Tom :-) From ianhattwick at attbi.com Sun Feb 2 16:19:06 2003 From: ianhattwick at attbi.com (Ian Hattwick) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? In-Reply-To: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> Message-ID: <1B3269A0-370D-11D7-994B-00039307260A@attbi.com> From the article: 'The question of how the device works remains a closely guarded secret at the moment. World music specialist Michael Church said yesterday: "Until we know precisely how the pianist is altering the length or tension of the strings it's hard to say anything meaningful. But if he really is going to 'bend' notes in an eastern manner, then it's a genuine breakthrough." ' Hard to believe they can write a whole article about an invention, and never mention how the device works!! Sounds like Segway style hype to me. 'The biggest challenge will be to convert more conservative musicians to the new outlook. "People set in their ways will be freaked out by this," Mr Smith said. Harriet Smith of the classical Music magazine is among the doubters. "The question it immediately begs is why? You obviously don't need all these extra tones to play the majority of the repertoire that is out there. And you wouldn't really want it to play world music on the piano because that's not really what the piano is about." ' Over christmas I heard a wendy carlos album she made in the 80s that used digital modeling and non-standard tunings throughout the whole thing. her physical modeling concept was cool- she combined different charicteristcs of modeling freely, e.g. overblowing piano strings, or bowing trumpet notes. The unequal tuning concept was definitely hard to get used to, but I suppose at some point it will become common. Already you can get guitar bridges that can retune your guitar at the push of a button, to any tuning you want. As the technology to adapt traditional instruments to unequal tunings becomes more common, I bet we will see more music using it. Cool concept for an article, but wish it had more info!! Ian On Sunday, February 2, 2003, at 09:30 AM, Terryfunken@aol.com wrote: > There was quite an interesting piece in yesterday's "Guardian" newspaper > which I think some people might find interesting (especially all you > pianist's out there! > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,886739,00.html > > if you can't find the link, the try; > > www.guardian.co.uk/arts > > then, type in the search box; "Composer reinvents the Piano" > > Debussy anyone? > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 2661 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030202/416dc7aa/attachment.bin From b.hawk at shaw.ca Sun Feb 2 16:28:29 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: hey hey just got the editor running in classic under 10.2, but it s not stable at all. has anyone got it running well? i m using a tibook800 and a usb midisport 2x2 tia BRAD From chsinger at localnet.com Sun Feb 2 15:57:25 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] Fretless bass guitar patch wanted References: <004901c2cac2$42a0dd20$1200a8c0@aha.ru> Message-ID: <002001c2cb16$d847ac10$199428cf@207d511> Phil, I posted a KS bass guitar a while ago, called csBassGuitar. I'm not sure how well it was tuned, though. I'll take a look at improving it and re-posting it tomorrow. Chet ----- Original Message ----- From: Slami DPA division To: Nord Modular Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 8:52 AM Subject: [NM] Fretless bass guitar patch wanted Hi, everybody on NM-list! There were some fretless bass guitar (Karplus-strong type or so) model patches on list some time ago, can you attach some now, please? best vishes! Phil mix2r@ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Nord-Modular mailing list Nord-Modular@code404.com http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular _______________________________________________ Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list may not be redistributed without the express consent of the author/creator. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030202/6eb262ab/attachment.htm From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 3 01:20:17 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com> In a message dated 3/2/03 12:19:56 am, ianhattwick@attbi.com writes: >Hard to believe they can write a whole article about an invention, and > >never mention how the device works!! Sounds like Segway style hype to me. > I think it's because the inventor is applying for an international patent- which is fair enough :) Harriet Smith of the classical Music magazine is among the doubters. "The question it immediately begs is why? You obviously don't need all these extra tones to play the majority of the repertoire that is out there. And you wouldn't really want it to play world music on the piano because that's not really what the piano is about." ' Isn't this the same attitude people had when the convection oven came out? ;) I think to say "this is not what the piano is really about" would be denying countless composers (in particular, John Cage, Stephen Scott etc.) that their work had any point. (sorry I couldn't think of an appropriate adjective). Even Claude Debussy predicted and dreamt of a machine which would have a keyboard interface yet the machine would create sounds beyond our wildest dreams (the synthesizer?)- I would have been really impressed if this new piano could have been exploited by Debussy. Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 3 01:30:10 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: In a message dated 3/2/03 12:27:58 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: >just got the editor running in classic under 10.2, but it s not >stable at all. has anyone got it running well? i m using a >tibook800 and a usb midisport 2x2 I suppose I really shouldn't be answering this (because I'm not running 10.2 yet- but I think I've got some useful info to share) for a start, what editor are you using? and I've had countless problems with the Midisport 2x2 (not even cash converters would give me a fiver for it!). I'm using an Emagic mt4 now- which is stable as a rock, but you MUST disable the OMSmididriver extention- as I found this interferes with the mt4 . Perhaps it's the same with the 2x2?? good luck! Tom :-) From steve.scrambled at ntlworld.com Mon Feb 3 05:17:10 2003 From: steve.scrambled at ntlworld.com (steve.scrambled) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com> Message-ID: <005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> > Harriet Smith of the classical Music magazine is among > the doubters. "The question it immediately begs is why? You obviously > don't need all these extra tones to play the majority of the repertoire > that is out there. And you wouldn't really want it to play world music > on the piano because that's not really what the piano is about." ' > > Isn't this the same attitude people had when the convection oven came out? ;) > I think to say "this is not what the piano is really about" would be denying > countless composers (in particular, John Cage, Stephen Scott etc.) that their > work had any point. How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? I guess the point of a piano is that it's a massively polyphonic instrument and thus suited to exploiting the possibilities of harmony (or disharmony for that matter). Some non-western music seems to concentrate upon melodic complexity using single monophonic parts rather than on harmonic relationships, whereas other kinds (like Indian music, I believe) have very complex harmonic content. I suppose the extent to which it would make sense to perform existing pieces on this new-fangled piano would depend upon the extent to which harmony is used by the piece. Didn't Terry Riley do some microtonal piano stuff? I think I have an ancient SOS article about it somewhere. Does anyone here make microtonal stuff or know about how it relates to harmony? I think Kofi might be due to drop another information payload quite soon... Nice article, Tom. Steve (Rowboffin) From brendanheading at clara.co.uk Mon Feb 3 05:24:34 2003 From: brendanheading at clara.co.uk (Brendan Heading) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: > Anyway this is pointless, i've been up all night and I didn't want to start a > stupid flame war over something that is (imo) very innovative. It's not a flame; I was merely disagreeing. I just thought it was a bit off the mark to say that the article suggested the death of the synthesizer. Obviously there is much more to a synthesizer than the device we use to control it. It's primary function is synthesis. Alternative tuning and so on is by no means a new idea either. Wendy Carlos has been working in that area for quite some time, and she released an extensive work based on her research in 1986 ("Beauty in the Beast"). On her website somewhere there's a design suggestion for a keyboard capable of other scales that she came up with around the same time. -- From brendanheading at clara.co.uk Mon Feb 3 05:27:20 2003 From: brendanheading at clara.co.uk (Brendan Heading) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: > Isn't this the same attitude people had when the convection oven came out? ;) > I think to say "this is not what the piano is really about" would be denying > countless composers (in particular, John Cage, Stephen Scott etc.) that their > work had any point. On that we agree. It astounds me that someone who considers him/herself a music expert or critic is arrogant enough to believe that there is no application for an alternative piano keyboard other than playing music that has already been composed - although arrogance is certainly nothing new for some people in this field. Perhaps he/she has already dismissed the prospect of *new* music even being worth the listening effort. -- Brendan -- From modular at ursliska.de Mon Feb 3 06:26:10 2003 From: modular at ursliska.de (Urs Liska) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com> <005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> Message-ID: <004901c2cb90$3ff141e0$ca86e23e@schweizk> There are countless efforts in "western contemporary classical music" dealing with microtonality, and most of them are in some way or the other concerned with harmony. Obviously the piano as it is doesn't stand in the center of this but it was also used, mainly with the help of flageolets and their detuning against the welltempered scale. Other instruments like strings or voices are better suited for this purpose. A very prominent example is the use of multiphonics on wind instruments. Especially concerning the oboe this is thoroughly researched in technical and harmonical terms by a book by Peter Veale and Claus-Steffen Mahnkopf. One originally french "school" of contemporary music is called "spectralism" and tries to take the spectral nature of sounds as the basis for composition. This direction carries microtonality and harmony in its center. I don't have useful examples of compositions/composers out of my head (beside the "old" one of Iwan Wyschnegradsky's 16th note piano from the first third of the 20th century) but I can assure you most of the "contemporary composers" who use microtonality use it in context of harmony. This is because if you use pitch as a criterium for composition you are always in a tension between harmony and counterpoint. This hasn't changed much for the last 1000 years (except for the freedom not to use pitches). BTW: I once realized a composition by a young german composer, Johannes Menke, that he wrote for a singer and my NM (phew, we're on topic again), which made extensive use of harmonic microtonality (out of this work I wrote a little text on equidistant scales that is also on the "interesting threads" page [sorry Wout: still not in English]). Johannes Menke also wrote several texts on the subject and held a speech at a symposium last september, but unfortunately none of them is published yet. Hope this was of any interest to you Regards Urs ----- Original Message ----- From: "steve.scrambled" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 2:17 PM Subject: Re: [NM] microtonality: piano > > Harriet Smith of the classical Music magazine is among > > the doubters. "The question it immediately begs is why? You obviously > > don't need all these extra tones to play the majority of the repertoire > > that is out there. And you wouldn't really want it to play world music > > on the piano because that's not really what the piano is about." ' > > > > Isn't this the same attitude people had when the convection oven came out? > ;) > > I think to say "this is not what the piano is really about" would be > denying > > countless composers (in particular, John Cage, Stephen Scott etc.) that > their > > work had any point. > > How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? I guess the > point of a piano is that it's a massively polyphonic instrument and thus > suited to exploiting the possibilities of harmony (or disharmony for that > matter). Some non-western music seems to concentrate upon melodic complexity > using single monophonic parts rather than on harmonic relationships, whereas > other kinds (like Indian music, I believe) have very complex harmonic > content. I suppose the extent to which it would make sense to perform > existing pieces on this new-fangled piano would depend upon the extent to > which harmony is used by the piece. > > Didn't Terry Riley do some microtonal piano stuff? I think I have an ancient > SOS article about it somewhere. > > Does anyone here make microtonal stuff or know about how it relates to > harmony? I think Kofi might be due to drop another information payload quite > soon... > > Nice article, Tom. > > Steve (Rowboffin) > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From pvigo at swin.edu.au Mon Feb 3 06:39:16 2003 From: pvigo at swin.edu.au (Paul Vigo) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:53 2004 Subject: [NM] Q or NL III In-Reply-To: <1043925085029635@caramail.com> Message-ID: If you're selling a microwave xt I'd replace it with a Q. The waldorf sound and synthesis engine is very distinctive and will give you sounds that the nl3 just wont. The q is at its heart a particularly digital beast. But its also a waldorf which means it is very difficult to get to know. waldorf synths are deep and strange. The NL3 can sound very different to the 2, but a lot of the innovations are evolutionary and a lot of the extra expense has gone into the user interface. If you didn't already have a NL2 i'd highly recommend a nl3, but why have two closely related synths when you could have two very different beasts? Paul Vigo Teacher, Swinburne University. [LAM300, LSM201] email: pvigo@swin.edu.au - Mobile: 0425 704463 personal email pavig@pobox.com and MSN .net (preffered IM) ICQ: 642304 - AOL: pavigmedia - Yahoo and undernet/irc: pavig -----Original Message----- From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of zorg zorg Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 11:11 PM To: nord-modular@code404.com Subject: [NM] Q or NL III Hi there, I'm a more than happy owner of NR II, Nord Modular (despite crashing PC with editor), VIRUS b, M3X and MicroWaveXT, all of them bought second hand (well, not the M3X, wich is a pricey piece of gear and not as reliable as pretended ! Oh no, it's not). I'm considering selling the XT to buy wether a Q rack or a NLIII rack second hand (Any advice ? NLIII is very different from NR2 sound wise ? (I know you can go deeper in terms of programming) Thanx !!! and long life to the mighty modular, V 4 or not ! Of course, I've listened to the online demos - there's no serious synth dealer where I live. It might sounds strange to buy such units without even tweaking them live but I did it to my own surprise, and it worked (anyway, I just had a D50, so it wasn't difficult to be pleased with any of those.) _________________________________________________________ Gagne une PS2 ! Envoie un SMS avec le code PS au 61166 (0,35? Hors co?t du SMS) From pvigo at swin.edu.au Mon Feb 3 07:21:17 2003 From: pvigo at swin.edu.au (Paul Vigo) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> Message-ID: I've experimented quite a bit with microtonality in harmony, but despite trying to wrap my head around the theory it's usually come down to the simplest solution: Lay down your harmonies one voice at a time and ride the pitch bend in the process. A lot of it is trial and error but after a bit you figure out which note has to be just a touch sharp or flat and it becomes second nature. Somehow i've found the ear is a better judge of what locks harmonicly than any of the more logical strategies i've been able to come up with - (and the nord lead 2 has a sweet pitch stick for finessing that kind of thing.) I'm not talking about just temperament either - listen to a bit of well played fretless bass and it's anything but just tempered. If anyone's got any interesting microtonal patches, love to hear them. Paul Vigo Teacher, Swinburne University. [LAM300, LSM201] email: pvigo@swin.edu.au - Mobile: 0425 704463 personal email pavig@pobox.com and MSN .net (preffered IM) ICQ: 642304 - AOL: pavigmedia - Yahoo and undernet/irc: pavig -----Original Message----- From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of steve.scrambled Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 12:17 AM To: Nord Modular Subject: Re: [NM] microtonality: piano > Harriet Smith of the classical Music magazine is among > the doubters. "The question it immediately begs is why? You obviously > don't need all these extra tones to play the majority of the repertoire > that is out there. And you wouldn't really want it to play world music > on the piano because that's not really what the piano is about." ' > > Isn't this the same attitude people had when the convection oven came out? ;) > I think to say "this is not what the piano is really about" would be denying > countless composers (in particular, John Cage, Stephen Scott etc.) that their > work had any point. How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? I guess the point of a piano is that it's a massively polyphonic instrument and thus suited to exploiting the possibilities of harmony (or disharmony for that matter). Some non-western music seems to concentrate upon melodic complexity using single monophonic parts rather than on harmonic relationships, whereas other kinds (like Indian music, I believe) have very complex harmonic content. I suppose the extent to which it would make sense to perform existing pieces on this new-fangled piano would depend upon the extent to which harmony is used by the piece. Didn't Terry Riley do some microtonal piano stuff? I think I have an ancient SOS article about it somewhere. Does anyone here make microtonal stuff or know about how it relates to harmony? I think Kofi might be due to drop another information payload quite soon... Nice article, Tom. Steve (Rowboffin) _______________________________________________ Nord-Modular mailing list Nord-Modular@code404.com http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular _______________________________________________ Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list may not be redistributed without the express consent of the author/creator. From theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com Mon Feb 3 07:29:15 2003 From: theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com (Theo.:.) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 2/3/03 4:30 AM, "Terryfunken@aol.com" wrote: > > In a message dated 3/2/03 12:27:58 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: > >> just got the editor running in classic under 10.2, but it s not >> stable at all. has anyone got it running well? i m using a >> tibook800 and a usb midisport 2x2 > > I suppose I really shouldn't be answering this (because I'm not running 10.2 > yet- but I think I've got some useful info to share) > > for a start, what editor are you using? and I've had countless problems with > the Midisport 2x2 (not even cash converters would give me a fiver for it!). > I'm using an Emagic mt4 now- which is stable as a rock, but you MUST disable > the OMSmididriver extention- as I found this interferes with the mt4 . > Perhaps it's the same with the 2x2?? > > good luck! > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > I have the same set up Powerbook 867 2x2 and 10.2 IT works great! Just make sure you have 10.2.3 (which has oms support) and OMS installed on your os 9 sysytem folder. It is better to set it up in 9 rather than in classic. Create a studio set up etc. Other than that I can't offer any other suggestions. Theo From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 3 07:48:25 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead/ nord noodling Message-ID: <146.9723dea.2b6fe949@aol.com> In a message dated 3/2/03 1:25:23 pm, brendanheading@clara.co.uk writes: >I just thought it was a bit >off the mark to say that the article suggested the death of the >synthesizer. Come on Brendan, Life's too short!!! ;) I thought it was an interesting article that I wanted to share with my other collegues on the list:) I never meant to upset anyone. On a different note (pardon me:), I've finally met up with another Nord Noodler last Saturday- Richard@Chorlton to be precise (hiya Richard!), Played a gig in Manchester- it had the best audience EVER! Perhaps I should meet with some more of you wonderful people?- I'd very much like to meet everyone from the US, NL, De, Fr, Se, etc etc etc!! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 3 07:56:46 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <5f.345cf629.2b6feb3e@aol.com> In a message dated 3/2/03 3:29:34 pm, theoloniusmonk@hotmail.com writes: >It is better to set it up in 9 rather than in >classic. Hi Theo! What do you mean by this exactly?- I've just bought a TiPB500, and am looking forward to using OSX- So perhaps it'll be me chewing my nails, asking all kinds of silly questions, next on the list? heh;) Incidently, there is a really good article on xlr8yourmac.com about why the Ti 400 and 500 PB's are twice as fast as the 550 and 667 models- when running audio applications. It could save some people who are looking to buy a PB Mac, some money?! (something to do- apparently- with greater memory bandwidth on the older chips). Tom :-) From theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com Mon Feb 3 09:14:59 2003 From: theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com (Theo.:.) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <5f.345cf629.2b6feb3e@aol.com> Message-ID: On 2/3/03 10:56 AM, "Terryfunken@aol.com" wrote: > > In a message dated 3/2/03 3:29:34 pm, theoloniusmonk@hotmail.com writes: > >> It is better to set it up in 9 rather than in >> classic. > > Hi Theo! > > What do you mean by this exactly?- I've just bought a TiPB500, and am looking > forward to using OSX- So perhaps it'll be me chewing my nails, asking all > kinds of silly questions, next on the list? heh;) > > Incidently, there is a really good article on xlr8yourmac.com about why the > Ti 400 and 500 PB's are twice as fast as the 550 and 667 models- when running > audio applications. It could save some people who are looking to buy a PB > Mac, some money?! > (something to do- apparently- with greater memory bandwidth on the older > chips). > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ Hey Tom Well when I found out you could use the modular editor in 10.2.3 using oms I tried installing OMS (www.m-audio.com under support). I tried installing it in os X under classic. But it wasn't working. SO I booted up into OS 9 using start up disk in system preferences and installed it as you would in 9 with the drivers for the midisport. Once OMS is set up in 9 (has to be in the version of 9 that OS X uses for Classic) and it detects your midi interface etc. Just go back into X and launch the modular editior in classic. Now in the midi setup it should detect your oms midi settings. This will only work in 10.2.3 as it allows you to use OMS for older classic apps. From chsinger at localnet.com Mon Feb 3 10:23:13 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] Fretless bass guitar patch wanted References: <004901c2cac2$42a0dd20$1200a8c0@aha.ru> Message-ID: <001801c2cbb1$52226170$0832a141@207d511> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: csBassGuitar2.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2478 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030203/4a3a01b8/csBassGuitar2.obj From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 11:52:13 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com> <005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> Message-ID: <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 steve.scrambled steve.scrambled wrote: > How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? Why _should_ it operate in a microtonal situation? A very broad spectrum of the music in the world really doesn't bother with it that much. > I guess the > point of a piano is that it's a massively polyphonic instrument and thus > suited to exploiting the possibilities of harmony (or disharmony for that > matter). Exactly. > Some non-western music seems to concentrate upon melodic complexity > using single monophonic parts rather than on harmonic relationships, Again, exactly. > whereas > other kinds (like Indian music, I believe) have very complex harmonic > content. Well ... in the case of Indian, not really. Western music emphasizes harmony. Indian music emphasizes melody. The purpose there is the almost single-minded pursuit of a single note. Each note has a unique individuality. They are said to be taken from nature, and the names that they are given reflect that individuality. As against this, harmony is the attempt to harness, to systematize, and to coordinate various notes. The aims are very different. Classically there are the "saptasvara" or seven basic notes. Then there are the 22 srutis or variants of those notes. They are found approximately ever second note. Then there is "raga" which is the soul of Indian music. Each raga is unique and is associated with a mood, belief, ritual etc etc. Thus the major elements of a musical "offering" are sruti, sahitya, (or lyric), raga, (or combination of notes), laya (the rhythm) and tala (the beats by which the rhythm is divided). No harmonic preoccupations anywhere ... although things are changing a bit under Western influence. > I suppose the extent to which it would make sense to perform > existing pieces on this new-fangled piano would depend upon the extent to > which harmony is used by the piece. I agree. > Didn't Terry Riley do some microtonal piano stuff? Yes. And lots of others. > Does anyone here make microtonal stuff Yes. Me. > or know about how it relates to harmony? The relation ranges from zero to 100% depending entirely upon the intentions and proclivities of both the composer and the listener. That's to say, there's people who find the Western musical system tuneless and not in the least melodious or harmonious (now ... HERE's a highly provocative remark to entertain "the masses" -- may their numbers increase!!!!) -- just as there's Westerners who find the music of other cultures equally tuneless and lacking in melody and harmony (may their numbers steadily decrease!!). > I think Kofi might be due to drop another information payload quite > soon... Wow ... am I really THAT obvious??!! Guess so, actually!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 11:52:31 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <004901c2cb90$3ff141e0$ca86e23e@schweizk> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com> <005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <004901c2cb90$3ff141e0$ca86e23e@schweizk> Message-ID: <28364672230.20030203115231@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Urs Liska wrote: > There are countless efforts in "western contemporary classical music" > dealing with microtonality, > Hope this was of any interest to you It was. Thanks. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 11:52:50 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead/ nord noodling In-Reply-To: <146.9723dea.2b6fe949@aol.com> References: <146.9723dea.2b6fe949@aol.com> Message-ID: <109364691118.20030203115250@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > Come on Brendan, Life's too short!!! ;) > I thought it was an interesting article that I wanted to share with my other > collegues on the list:) I never meant to upset anyone. I really don't think you have. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 11:55:15 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <71364836026.20030203115515@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Paul Vigo wrote: > I've experimented quite a bit with microtonality in harmony, That's nice!! > but despite > trying to wrap my head around the theory .... what theory??!!!! > it's usually come down to the > simplest solution: Simple is best! > Lay down your harmonies one voice at a time Aaaah. And we were doing so well!!!! _Why_ do harmonies have to be laid down? That's the bit I find it hard to grasp, sometimes. > and ride the > pitch bend in the process. Why not just take it somewhere unusual and then leave it there? > A lot of it is trial and error but after a bit > you figure out which note has to be just a touch sharp or flat and it > becomes second nature. Yup. > Somehow i've found the ear is a better judge of what > locks harmonicly than any of the more logical strategies i've been able to > come up with - Yup. > I'm not talking about just temperament either - listen > to a bit of well played fretless bass and it's anything but just tempered. True. > If anyone's got any interesting microtonal patches, love to hear them. There's some in the archives. Best if I create a category for them, I guess. And ... Jan Punter came up with a system for allowing people to create their own tunings. Here you go ... http://www.iaf.nl/Users/BlueHell/nm/tet.zip Actually, I've suddenly remembered that Wout put a discussion we had about this a while ago in the "Interesting Threads" section. Here you go ... http://nordsynth.zevv.nl/010_NordModular/014_Interesting_Threads/Folder/Tuning/Tunings02.htm Enjoy. But ... I _still_ don't get it about this "harmonizing" business. All you need to create a harmony is one drum. That's it. It can harmonize just fine Sometimes two is better, though. You can even create melodies the self same way as well. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From b.hawk at shaw.ca Mon Feb 3 11:45:07 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:54 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > >Just make sure you have 10.2.3 (which has oms support) >Other than that I can't offer any other suggestions. that s what it must be. like, it works, then it doesn't.... 10.2.3 it is then thanks!! From b.hawk at shaw.ca Mon Feb 3 11:54:07 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <5f.345cf629.2b6feb3e@aol.com> References: <5f.345cf629.2b6feb3e@aol.com> Message-ID: >In a message dated 3/2/03 3:29:34 pm, theoloniusmonk@hotmail.com writes: > >>It is better to set it up in 9 rather than in >>classic. > >Hi Theo! > >What do you mean by this exactly?- better to set up oms under 9, rather than classic From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 12:03:40 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? In-Reply-To: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> References: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> Message-ID: <193365340872.20030203120340@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/2/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > There was quite an interesting piece in yesterday's "Guardian" newspaper > which I think some people might find interesting (especially all you > pianist's out there! > http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,886739,00.html This is the gentleman concerned, I believe. http://www.bathspa.ac.uk/profiles/profile.asp?number=52 http://www.sonyclassical.com/artists/smith/bio.html Well ... surely the most striking thing about that article is the relative ignorance of developments in the field displayed by Merope Mills who wrote it. The principal thing the article ignores is that the piano was not invented out of the blue. Back in 1490 the Spanish musician Bartolomeo Pareja laid down what became one of the bedrocks of "modern Western music". He declared that the triad was "a phenomenon of nature". He even described some of the mathematical properties involved. Pareja's ideas became important because they assisted the discovery and description of the fundamentals of harmony ... something that was busy becoming the sine qua non of Western music. If you want to "understand" Western music then you have to understand the laws of harmony. Jean Philippe Rameau made another very important contribution. Along with the musicians of the Camerata Rameau clarified some "key" concepts in music and how it should be organized. He went far beyond Pareja and had a very much bigger influence on musicians, which is why he is often called "the father of modern harmony". The race was now on to develop these new insights. A very big player in the game was Panteleon Hebenstreit, who was a real virtuoso on the dulcimer. Hebenstreit had create a keyboard instrument that not only maintained a decent tuning (even the harpsichord could do that) but that at long last came extremely close to allowing composers to exploit dynamics. You really have to listen to a harpsichord in order to understand what a big deal this was. Compared to a piano, the dynamic range of a harpsichord is pitiful. It also can't sustain notes. And the ability to sustain notes makes it far easier to explore harmonic textures. Many harpsichordists tried to resolve the lack of dynamic capability in the harpsichord by having two, and sometimes three, manuals available. A musician could then extend the dynamic capabilities by playing one note on one manual and another on another. When Bartolomeo Cristofori invented his "gravicembalo col piano e forte" or "keyboard instrument that can be played soft and loud", everyone really sat up and took notice. When the resonance of the instrument was added to its dynamic range, everyone realized that the possibilities were vast. For a variety of reasons, including the contemporaneous invention of an adequate notation system, Cristofori's invention soon acquired a stranglehold on Western music ... and one that it will not soon relinquish (IMO). But as far as "unusual keyboards" is concerned, somewhere in the late 19th century a man named Vincent proposed a keyboard with six rows so that any scale at all could be played while always using the same fingering. It also, of course, made shifting keys a cinch. And sometime before that someone from Vienna (Obendrauf??) actually made a piano that made it easier for children to play large intervals. Another result was that composers and pianists could play and exploit some very unusual chords and intervals. Nobody rose to that particular challenge. Then there was John Dwight's convex keyboard which spanned 7 octaves and allowed a player to play both ends of the piano at once, increasing the range available to both players and composers. Nobody was much interested in that, either. But much more pertinently, back in the 1860s or '70s, a man called Bosanquet designed a "general purpose harmonium" which had 53 keys to the octave. Microtonal music did not exactly take the Western world by storm. A few years later Bosanquet made a different harmonium, for "research purposes", that had 72 keys to the octave ... and a little later one General Perrot Thomson made one with 80 keys to the octave. Then there was Mangeot who stunned Paris with a two-manual piano sometime in 1880. To be fair, though, Mangeot's was a little strange in that each hand was allocated its own keyboard. The keys for the left hand keyboard were reversed so that the low notes were on the right and the high notes were on the left. Pianists could therefore play scales and arpeggio using exactly the same fingering in each hand, but moving them in opposite directions. Then there was Percival who also, just before the turn of the century, invented a piano with two keyboards that were placed back-to-but vertically. The point being ... an awful lot of things have been tried in piano technology ... but they have all have come up against the same basic brick wall ... which is ... how Western music is conceptualized. More than most musics, Western music is centred not only on pitch ... but on the vertical organization of pitch. This remains a central objective in its thinking, and its kind of hard for those who are so used to it that they think it's natural to grasp that other musics on earth simply do not "think" that way. However it is expressed, attacked, reinforced or denied, harmony is always important to Western music. Perhaps a quick look at the differences between Western and Eastern Orthodox and chants can make this a bit clearer. The two are close cousins but went in very different directions. Like Western chant, "znamenny chant" was diatonic. Just like the Western variety, it recognized whole tone and half tone steps. But ... that was about it for similarities. Znamenny chant used 12 pitches (low B to a high D). But ... at every third pitch there were four "accordances" available. (The Russian term was soglassya; and an equivalent Indian term might be shruti). There were low sombre, bright and very bright. The notation system of the time allowed a composer to indicate which accordance he or she intended for that chant. However, a single chant could move freely between different accordances. The melodies of chants moved in "strict conjunct motion" (i.e. there were no jumps between pitches) excepting only that leaps of a fourth or fifth were permitted, for dramatic effect, in the final cadence. Rhythm was quarter and half notes (crotchets and minims), with the main beat being determined by the half notes (minims), with whole notes (semibreves) being used only at the ends of phrases and lines. Eighth notes (quavers) were very rare indeed. In performance, singers were permitted to take liberties and could sustain both half notes and whole notes a bit longer if they felt the occasion warranted it. So far, however, there isn't much between the two traditions. What set them apart, though, was the tonality used (or not used) by Russian znamenny chant composers. The Russians used a system of eight "glassy". These were basically derived from the eight Byzantine "echoi" (very roughly, modes). These seem originally to have been Arabic. The Russians did not group melodies by scale structure, but rather by their melodic patterns which they called "popefki" or "kokizi". Each melodic pattern had certain groups of pitches/melodies in common. Thus the first "glas" had 93 popefki, all of which were considered to have a festive tone or feel about them -- without, of course, denying the solemnity required for a chant. The eight glassy all had their defining popefki and an accompanying mood or feel. Thus the second glas was "sweet and tender", the sixth was "mournful" etc etc. It was the duty of a znamenny composer to memorize all these glassy and their 400 or so popefki memorized as well. So basically, you can establish the mood and the feeling by moving amongst popefki within a glas, and also switch soglassya. Of course, all of this had to be notated, and again the Russian tradition differed from the Western one. In the West, since harmony was developed it became very important to denote "THE" pitch that the melody was playing, and also THE pitches that the accompanying instruments were playing. In znamenny chant, of course, this was not required. It was only necessary to indicate the glas and the popefki. The Byzantines, of course never documented the symbols that they used. Presumably, they all understood them without explanation. Unfortunately, the Byzantine system remains undeciphered. The Eastern Orthodox Russians, however, devised a system of their own ... and they also took the trouble to leave behind a glossary of the symbols they used for znamenny chanting. Thus they indicated the initial accordance as well as shifts to other accordances. They also annotated the rhythm, the duration of notes, the volume, and the style of phrasing to be used. But although the "average" singer could tell from the early form of notation what accordance they should be singing in, they had no real idea, initially, which of the notes in any particular accordance they were supposed to sing. At first, the only solution was for any singer to memorize all the popefki, to recognize them immediately by sight and sound, and thus to know which pitch they should begin singing at. Unfortunately, this took years of training. It included the rather depressing business of having to learn literally hundreds of popefki off by heart. Without that there was no guarantee that any particular chant would be sung accurately. Then somewhere in the middle of the 17th century the Novgorod master Ivan Shaidurov (or Shaidur) invented a new system involving a system of auxiliary red letters. Each letter corresponded to a particular note in the church scale. Any singer could now easily sing a chant, and much more "accurately" than before. Unfortunately ... Shaidurov's system had the unforeseen consequence of making it just as easy to sing Western chants. Compared to the Eastern Orthodox glas/popefki system these used a very much simpler method. Znamenny chanting therefore gradually died out. It was preserved by "the Old Believers" who largely maintained an oral tradition, and through whom it has gradually been resurrected. But ... Eastern chanting was very different from Western chant and was based en very different principles. It had little or nothing to do with "a key centre" or issues associated with that. The "key" to the piano, and to Western music, is that it allows for the simultaneous exploration of melody and harmony -- so making it one of the primary distinguishing features of Western music. Not even Claude Debussy tried to get away from that. Yes ... Debussy did greatly question the major-minor system. But then ... so were lots of others. In any case, it is hardly to "break away" from harmony. Debussy's tradition was the major-minor system, and he addressed Wagner and Mahler's challenge by trying to break away from it. As an Impressionist, he went for "the hazy" rather than "the clear" etc etc. His answer to the musical questions of his time was to explore older, more Mediaeval sounds ... sounds which had existed before the idea of "key centre" had gripped music quite so effectively. He was also, of course, very interested in the sounds of other cultures ... although if you were a member of those other cultures those explorations did not go very far. He and the other Impressionists changed but certainly did not eliminate the basis of harmony. They instead allowed for many dramatic changes in harmony, in melody, and in rhythm. They did their best to deny the essence of the Classical and Romantic traditions which was that there should be a pull towards a firmly declared tonic note. You don't hear many V-I's from the likes of Debussy and Ravel, the two chief exponents of this style. They had more in the way of dissonances. They used a lot of whole tone scales, parallel chords, floating tones, etc. They also tried to do away with regularity in rhythm. The twentieth century (classical) music that followed them focused on further efforts to break away from tonality. The central problem was (and in man ways still remains) that of how else to organize notes harmonically once the fundamental theory of harmony is not accepted. That's to say, no matter what it sounds like, the lynchpin of twentieth century music continued to be the reaction against the Romantics. Instead of being "organized", 20th century music often tried to be "primal" and "primitive". It was a way of recapturing a "lost freedom" that existed before tonality. Towards the end of the century, composers became more "internationalist". Then there were composers like Gyorgy Ligeti who experimented with aleatoric music. The twentieth century was filled with a lot of experimentation and innovation. But many feel that the cost of this freedom for composers was a divorce from substantial numbers of the potential audience who found that they couldn't "understand" and "enjoy" it any more unless they were prepared to invest a considerable amount of time in "learning" to "get" what the composers were up to. There were irregularities in rhythm and patterns based upon 5, 7, 11, or 13 beats to a bar. Polyrhythms, polytonality and many other things were all tried. "Melodies" acquired all sorts of shapes and configurations, including wide leaps and "strange" intervals. There was no reason why a "melody" should be "singable" or "hummable". As for harmony itself, it lurched from the triads first discovered 500 years before by Pareja to complex clusters of 6, 7, 8 notes and more. This created tensions in the music that composers felt under no obligation to "resolve". It was up to the audience to forget all that major-minor tune stuff and just "get used to it". The piano itself began to be used as a percussion instrument. As for microtonalities ... the Guardian article is unbelievably naive and mistaken if it is seriously trying to suggest that Western musicians either don't know about, or have not explored, microtones. They exist worldwide and it's hardly as if they are new. Here's just one website devoted to the stuff: http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/doc/discs.html and ... here's a site full of links to various temperaments etc. http://www.angelfire.com/music/harmonica/temperaments.html However ... IMO the article is basically right in one implication ... that if Western musicians were seriously interested in exploring microtones to any great degree, then they would already be doing so to a much greater degree than they already are. More to the point, though ... what does the Smith invention add to the possibilities for Western composers? Well ... even without it, it would be very easy to e.g. use a second manual. Pianos have been invented already that made microtones available although admittedly by using extra keys. Fretless basses and guitars are certainly available ... plus there are "traditional" instruments such as the violins and wind instruments that do make those notes available. Then there are, of course, the synthesizers that allow for this kind of playing ... if it is really what someone wants to do. The piano was invented for both its dynamics and its ability to harmonize effectively. And ... I really don't see how Geoff Smith's invention is going to overcome some five hundred years worth of preoccupation with "key centres" and harmony. If one forgets harmonizing then almost literally a "key" factor in Western music is gone. You don't have to have a special piano to do that. One only needs to become more open even to Eastern Orthodox chanting, never mind to all the other styles of music on the planet. But ... if one maintain the attitude that "harmonizing is primary" then not even the introduction of microtones achieves very much for it will still sound "Western". It is a question of the structure of the music. It takes more than a sitar that can play shrutis to make something sound "Indian". It's a question of a mindset and I personally don't see how a microtonal piano is going to facilitate the necessary shift in mindset that even Wagner saw it was necessory for Western music to adopt ... although I really would like to see it happen. But ... if it was going to happen then there'd be a lot more sign of it around IMO. Still. Probably I'm just biased!!!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From seayscott at yahoo.com Mon Feb 3 12:28:05 2003 From: seayscott at yahoo.com (Scott Seay) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? In-Reply-To: <193365340872.20030203120340@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <20030203202805.42279.qmail@web20201.mail.yahoo.com> Hey Kofi, I loved the response here, and even laughed at the idea of "he or she" writting chants, like those monks let women write stuff?? But my (probably horrible) understanding of the western focus on harmonies and even dynamics is that it in part was also fuled by the scientific idea that these things could be quantified i.e. C is c because of its vibration at certain cycles per second?, something you hinted at in talking about how these other traditions of chants have been lost because their particular notion was lost? Any ideas on this? ===== Man can think in the sense that he possesses the possibility to do so. This possibility alone, however, is no guarantee to us that we are capable of thinking. Martin Heidegger __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From steve.scrambled at ntlworld.com Mon Feb 3 12:38:52 2003 From: steve.scrambled at ntlworld.com (steve.scrambled) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> ----- Original Message ----- From: Friday's Child To: Nord Modular Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 7:52 PM Subject: Re: [NM] microtonality: piano > On 2/3/2003 steve.scrambled steve.scrambled wrote: > > > How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? > Why _should_ it operate in a microtonal situation? > A very broad spectrum of the music in the world really doesn't bother > with it that much. Not saying it _should_. Just wondering if there is some form of harmony that can be said to apply in a microtonal situation, which I think is releveant when discussing the usefulness or otherwise of the piano that the article describes. > > > I guess the > > point of a piano is that it's a massively polyphonic instrument and thus > > suited to exploiting the possibilities of harmony (or disharmony for that > > matter). > Exactly. So how would you, as someone who knows more about this microtonal business than me, assess the usefulness of a microtonally tuned polyphonic instrument? > > Some non-western music seems to concentrate upon melodic complexity > > using single monophonic parts rather than on harmonic relationships, > Again, exactly. Cool! I got something right then... > > > whereas > > other kinds (like Indian music, I believe) have very complex harmonic > > content. > Well ... in the case of Indian, not really. Okay... > Western music emphasizes harmony. Indian music emphasizes melody. The > purpose there is the almost single-minded pursuit of a single note. > Each note has a unique individuality. They are said to be taken from > nature, and the names that they are given reflect that individuality. > As against this, harmony is the attempt to harness, to systematize, > and to coordinate various notes. The aims are very different. > Classically there are the "saptasvara" or seven basic notes. Then > there are the 22 srutis or variants of those notes. They are found > approximately ever second note. Then there is "raga" which is the soul > of Indian music. Each raga is unique and is associated with a mood, > belief, ritual etc etc. Thus the major elements of a musical > "offering" are sruti, sahitya, (or lyric), raga, (or combination of > notes), laya (the rhythm) and tala (the beats by which the rhythm is > divided). > > No harmonic preoccupations anywhere ... although things are changing a > bit under Western influence. Interesting stuff. Thanks. > > > > I suppose the extent to which it would make sense to perform > > existing pieces on this new-fangled piano would depend upon the extent to > > which harmony is used by the piece. > I agree. > > > Didn't Terry Riley do some microtonal piano stuff? > Yes. > And lots of others. > > > Does anyone here make microtonal stuff > Yes. Me. > > > or know about how it relates to harmony? > The relation ranges from zero to 100% depending entirely upon the intentions > and proclivities of both the composer and the listener. That's to say, > there's people who find the Western musical system tuneless and not in > the least melodious or harmonious (now ... HERE's a highly provocative > remark to entertain "the masses" -- may their numbers increase!!!!) -- > just as there's Westerners who find the music of other cultures > equally tuneless and lacking in melody and harmony (may their numbers > steadily decrease!!). Still wondering about harmony in a microtonal situation. Is the point you're making that you can pretty much combine any number of different notes you want without having to worry about whether the combination is deemed harmonious or inharmonious, since that perception depends largely upon one's cultural background? In Western music there's a recognition of at least some sort of continuum between disonnance and consonnance, so that even if one decides to repudiate harmony in favour of dissonance the idea of consonnance is still implicit within it, if you see what I mean (?!) Is there really no correlate of this in microtonal music? > > > > > I think Kofi might be due to drop another information payload quite > > soon... > Wow ... am I really THAT obvious??!! > Guess so, actually!! Not so much obvious as reliable! :-) > > With every good wish, > K(ofi) B(usia) > Best regards, Steve (Rowboffin). From lesmizz at bellsouth.net Mon Feb 3 12:59:45 2003 From: lesmizz at bellsouth.net (Les Mizzell) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> Message-ID: > > How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation.... I'll use this as an excuse to plug Wendy Carlo's "Beauty in the Beast" again. This is a tour-de-force of both sound synthesis (using pretty much nothing but additive synthesis exclusively on the Crumar GDS/Synergy instruments) and of microtonal explorations. There's one piece that uses a 144 note per octave scale and sounds absolutely beautiful to my ears. Now, having "western" ears myself, I feel it's a matter of what we've grown up with and gotten "used" to hearing. For most folks, anything outside the normal 12 tone scale just sounds "weird" or "wrong". Other cultures seem to have not problem with differing scales because that's what their ears are used to. For the "Western" ears here, listen to some Gamelan music from Bali, for example. After repeated listenings, you start to get "used" to the tunings. Find some Harry Partch to listen to as well. Amazing stuff on instruments invented by the composer. There's some really good Microtonal links here: http://www-math.cudenver.edu/~jstarret/microtone.html There's a list of Microtonal Music on CD here: http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/doc/discs.html The American Festival of Microtonal Music claims that they have a MIDI-compatible 55-note per octave keyboard commercially available soon, but I haven't seen a picture of it. From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 14:13:01 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? In-Reply-To: <20030203202805.42279.qmail@web20201.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030203202805.42279.qmail@web20201.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <92373102372.20030203141301@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Scott Seay wrote: > I loved the response here, and even laughed at the > idea of "he or she" writting chants, like those monks > let women write stuff?? Yeah! LOL indeed!! They did have a few nuns here and thereabouts. They also used to mark their day by chants. It was the accepted custom. Why would an abbess or prioress stop her charges from singing in the privacy of their own monastery or whatever? But apart from that, I dare say their influence was pretty peripheral. Compositionally, which I guess is where a real power lay, I think you're right in that nuns would me more likely to be told what to sing and when to sing it than consulted for their creativity. Just political correctness on my part gone mad, I guess!! > But my (probably horrible) > understanding of the western focus on harmonies and > even dynamics is that it in part was also fuled by the > scientific idea that these things could be quantified Your understanding is pretty much to the point. There was an awful lot of theorizing and calculating going on to come up with "the right" ratios. The eventual best compromise was ... equal temperament. It allowed all keys to be used equally ... and pretty much destroyed the character of every one of them. It's really something to hear Bach's 48, for example, played on a well-tempered (not equal-tempered) instrument. Every key has a really different character and you can hear how Bach tried to highlight these with the various preludes and fugues. And ... that's what's really missing from the equation, I think. People used to equal temperament don't appreciate quite so readily that there's some real character already built into the scale that one is using, and that one doesn't need to "harmonize" to portray that. > i.e. C is c because of its vibration at certain cycles > per second?, That's not quite so easy as that. It took a long time before "concert pitch" as we know it was established, and even then there's at least two standards. If memory serves me correctly concert pitch is now A440 and is "THE" pitch to which all instruments should be tuned ... and in fact if pianos want to give of their sonic best when being played then they have to be designed to give of their sonic best when tuned to that. This is already a very different approach from that taken by say a traditional kora or balaphon, or even sitar maker who would simply listen to the instrument itself and tune it by its own best qualities. The tone of a piano can suffer very badly indeed when it is tuned away form its manufactured "best". That's the kind of thing I mean when I was referring to "a mindset". Back in the 17th century "A" varied between 373.7 and 402.9 Hz (I again think that's correct). So if you asked someone to "give you an A", there was a lot variation. The whole idea of an "exact A" just didn't make sense. The tuning fork was invented in the early 1700s by John Shore and he gave his A 423.5 Hz. Today's "concert A" was established in 1939 ... but even then it hasn't remained "the same". East European countries tune their pianos so they sound best at 444 Hz, sometimes even a little higher. High class concert halls tend to keep two pianos available tuned to those two frequencies. The human singing voice 'naturally' gravitates to just intonation and a well-trained singer who specializes in just singing can produce somewhere around 75 or 76 different pitches in the octave. Thus there's a whole variety of thirds and such like available, all with different characters. In fact, regarding the blues some say that it came about because when African singers and musicians started to get to grips with the piano and other instruments, the thirds and the sevenths that they were use to were located somewhere in between the flattened and plain ones, and so they played around with those intervals a great deal, thus creating a whole new world of music. Referring to the sitar, one of the first things one can determine upon beginning to listen is which one of the three most popular tuning systems the player is using. http://fn2.freenet.edmonton.ab.ca/~buhrger/sitar/tuning.html Obviously, the tuning method chosen immediately has a big impact on what is to be presented. > something you hinted at in talking about > how these other traditions of chants have been lost > because their particular notion was lost? Well ... most other music has been oral, and so has not really had a notation system. Obviously, traditions like the Chinese and the Indian had to try to notate to at least some degree, but since in the end the whole purpose of the music was to explore the microtones inherent in the system in order to express emotions and the like, they didn't have much to write. Here's an interesting example of some mediaeval musical notation from a Czech Radio website: http://archiv.radio.cz/hudba/mediev.html And here's someone -- Nicholas Bailey -- who has tried to develop a notational system to go along with the music that he's making: http://music.columbia.edu/~chris/kuss.html And ... this is what it sounds like!! http://music.columbia.edu/~chris/sounds/kuss.mp3 I did have a link to some notation that Ligeti had devised for his own brand of music, but unfortunately the link doesn't work any more. If I track it down I'll send it in. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 14:14:56 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> Message-ID: <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 steve.scrambled wrote: >> > How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? >> Why _should_ it operate in a microtonal situation? >> A very broad spectrum of the music in the world really doesn't bother >> with it that much. > Not saying it _should_. Sorry ... I was just using you as a sounding board, kind of, and asking a general question about "what's musical". > Just wondering if there is some form of harmony that > can be said to apply in a microtonal situation, Aaaah. That's a question that almost begs that one has a preconception. In a certain sense, yes there is a harmony, because obviously all the notes used are "related" to each other (if the instruments are pitched). However, that is not usually what's on peoples minds. They are not trying to harmonize. A sitar player is trying to express a form and varies that form backwards and forwards, intersecting and intercutting the "expected" rhythms and notes with great panache. > which I think is releveant > when discussing the usefulness or otherwise of the piano that the article > describes. You have a point, and it's kind of also the point that I was trying to make. If one wants to think "harmonically" then as far as I can see the piano is useless because it can add but nothing to the microtonal investigations that MANY Western composers have already made. Microtonal music is a whole different mindset that is not in the least (or is very little) interested in harmonizing. Harmonizing is a very West-centric preoccupation. And if that's all someone's going to do with a microtonal piano then they aren't going to find many new dimensions in music. The whole history of 20th century music was virtually about what you do when you don't want to harmonize any more. Pretty much the answer people come up with was "convince themselves that the noise they're re making isn't just a random noise but still has some kind of structure". Microtonal music answers the same question. It has an organization that one simply has to get used to, and it is NOT concerned with answering questions about harmony. One just has to "convince themselves that the noise they're re making isn't just a random noise but still has some kind of structure". > So how would you, as someone who knows more about this microtonal business I don't really!!! If you want to meet a few people who REALLY know something about microtonality, there's a tuning list on Yahoo Groups that's chock a bloc full of people who know a great deal about it. I just use them. > than me, assess the usefulness of a microtonally tuned polyphonic > instrument? Well ... basically ... take out the polyphonic part. That's the bit that makes it "uniquely Western". And of course, once you've taken out that part, you're left wondering what to do with all your other fingers and what you're doing sitting in front of 88 keys. Pretty much ... Western music is about exploiting chords and chord clusters for which the piano is ideally suited, microtonal or not. And ... all music that explores polyphony has exactly that going for it and that's exactly what its "sameness" is whether it be hip hop or Mozart. Microtonal music as currently practised on the rest of this planet is not concerned with such issues which is why the piano rapidly becomes an expensive piece of furniture. But ... that has not stopped composers like this ... http://composers21.com/compdocs/sjukursa.htm this http://sanjeebsircar.tripod.com/biography.html or this http://www.prabhumusic.com/music/smooth.htm There are just as many people trying to go the other way, and it's a shame the Guardian writer didn't go looking for them. > Still wondering about harmony in a microtonal situation. Well ... try not to!! > Is the point you're > making that you can pretty much combine any number of different notes you > want without having to worry about whether the combination is deemed > harmonious or inharmonious, since that perception depends largely upon one's > cultural background? Well ... in a nutshell ... yes. HOWEVER ... every culture has its own method of restricting the notes that are "legally" allowed in that music, and how they should be related to each other in order to create a "piece". So it's not so much whether the combination is "harmonious or inharmonious" in a harmonic sense, but about whether it's harmonious or inharmonious in a "fitting" "that's just the right note" sense. > In Western music there's a recognition of at least some > sort of continuum between disonnance and consonnance, so that even if one > decides to repudiate harmony in favour of dissonance the idea of consonnance > is still implicit within it, if you see what I mean (?!) I think I do. > Is there really no > correlate of this in microtonal music? Yes. There is always a way to "go home", and a way to be "away from home". It's just that the form varies. One just has to get used to where "home" is. It's just a question of learning to be a native in a strange land instead of always feeling one's self to be a stranger in a strange land. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 14:17:37 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <35373377678.20030203141737@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Les Mizzell wrote: > Now, having "western" ears myself, I feel it's a matter of what we've grown > up with and gotten "used" to hearing. Yes. > For most folks, anything outside the > normal 12 tone scale just sounds "weird" or "wrong". Quite. > Other cultures seem to > have not problem with differing scales because that's what their ears are > used to. Select a response from above and insert here!!! > For the "Western" ears here, listen to some Gamelan music from > Bali, for example. After repeated listenings, you start to get "used" to the > tunings. And that's the point. Not just the tunings, of course, but the whole different sense of organizational principles. > Find some Harry Partch to listen to as well. Amazing stuff on instruments > invented by the composer. Absolutely. Seconded. Read Partch. Listen to Partch. NOW. > The American Festival of Microtonal Music claims that they have a > MIDI-compatible 55-note per octave keyboard commercially available soon, but > I haven't seen a picture of it. Interesting!!!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From valis at ucla.edu Mon Feb 3 14:54:43 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <35373377678.20030203141737@yefrewenchi.com> References: <35373377678.20030203141737@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <1044312883.3e3ef33345d32@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting Friday's Child : > On 2/3/2003 Les Mizzell wrote: > > Find some Harry Partch to listen to as well. Amazing stuff on > instruments > > invented by the composer. > Absolutely. > Seconded. > Read Partch. > Listen to Partch. > NOW. Yes! I was going to mention Partch... some cool stuff, and the instruments are really far-out. His 43-note/octave scale was based on a "tonality diamond"; like the circle of fifths on acid. He built a reed organ (among other instruments) called the "Chromelodeon" that played this scale of his back in, like, the '40s - he probably would have been down with the microtonal piano. vV From walters at doubtfulpalace.com Mon Feb 3 15:15:48 2003 From: walters at doubtfulpalace.com (Tim Walters) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:55 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> Friday's Child wrote: > Microtonal music is a whole different mindset that is not in the least > (or is very little) interested in harmonizing. This strikes me as a bit of an overstatement. There are plenty of contemporary JI composers who use harmonies as major compositional element: Partch, Johnston, Rich, Carlos, La Monte Young, Riley, etc. (I usually recommend the Kronos Quartet performance of Johnston's "Amazing Grace" as an introduction to microtonal music; the familiar tune helps make the tunings comprehensible, and it's a gorgeous piece of music.) > Harmonizing is a very > West-centric preoccupation. Sure, but the West has a strong microtonal tradition of its own. It's not as if Palestrina's choirs sang in equal temperament. -- SLAW * SNAKES & LADDERS Experimental popular children's music for adults http://www.doubtfulpalace.com/artists/Slaw From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 16:06:51 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:56 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> Message-ID: <44379932023.20030203160651@yefrewenchi.com> Hi Tim, On 2/3/2003 Tim Walters wrote: > Friday's Child wrote: >> Microtonal music is a whole different mindset that is not in the least >> (or is very little) interested in harmonizing. > This strikes me as a bit of an overstatement. True. Just getting carried away and trying to be a missionary. > There are plenty of > contemporary JI composers who use harmonies as major compositional > element: Partch, Johnston, Rich, Carlos, La Monte Young, Riley, etc. I was not referring to "Western" microtonal music. >> Harmonizing is a very >> West-centric preoccupation. > Sure, That's all I was trying to say. > but the West has a strong microtonal tradition of its own. I have not denied this. The issue is ... what happened to it > It's not > as if Palestrina's choirs sang in equal temperament. True. But ... they harmonized. Sicut Cervus is great. As also Sanctus from his Missa Brevis. Wasn't that the one that Ralph Vaughan Williams called "the most perfect piece of music ever composed"? But he, again, worked in an environment and a tradition, and was trying to make a point. In his day, the emphasis on the explanation of polyphony led to a serious concern that the words of the Holy Scriptures could no longer be heard ... and that the music was becoming "so beautiful" that no-one was any longer interested in listening, but was more concerned with enjoying the "fine music". What should the proper relationship be between music and word in the sacred compositions of the day? Of course, only the papacy could rule on this and in 1545 the judgement came down from the Council of Trent. Its primary purpose was to reform the Catholic Church against the threats posed by Protestantism. Included amongst these were some 'guidelines' about 'sacred compositions'. The words of scripture should be "clear". That should be the first priority. Palestrina responded suitably. He stuck to the development of polyphony -- the creation of music with simultaneously flowing yet independent lines that somehow "supported" each other harmonically. He wrote the 'Pope Marcellus' Mass. It was one of the earliest examples of the new more structured yet direct style. In site of the fact that Palestrina had six lines of music sounding simultaneously, the text was clearly audible. He proved that the musically complex need not detract from the audibility of the word of God. The Commission set up to investigate the suitability of polyphonic sacred music ruled in his favour. He wrote over 100 Masses, over 250 motets, several Magnificats, madrigals and the like. Even Bach rearranged one of Palestrina's masses voice and instruments in order to learn more about Palestrina's polyphonic technique. "Compose something in the style of Palestrina" is still an exercise given to students of composition today. I never once said that Palestrina composed in equal temperament. How could he have done? It hadn't yet been invented. However ... he was one of the important people who helped to confirm the Western predilection for singing and playing in harmony ... which is several lines supporting each other and being sounded simultaneously with the sounds thus produced being almost a defining character of the music. Microtonal or equal temperament, it really doesn't matter a great deal. You can spot a piece of Western music a mile off because so many of its composers and practitioners are absolutely convinced that music isn't really music unless there are at least two or three lines going along and supporting each other ... or else that somehow there's a "chord sequence" standing there in back of what is being done. All I'm trying to say is that the vast bulk of the world's music does not share this preoccupation, and also that I don't see how a microtonal piano is going to do anything any fundamentally different from what Palestrina was trying to do. All I've tried to say, rightly or wrongly, is that the scale chosen -- be it microtonal or equal temperament -- is in Western music pretty secondary to the method that is to be used to present those notes to the listener which is almost guaranteed to be chordally and harmonically based. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From J.Punter at iaf.nl Mon Feb 3 16:07:37 2003 From: J.Punter at iaf.nl (Jan Punter) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:56 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <3E3F0449.861D109E@iaf.nl> Friday's Child wrote: > And ... all music that explores polyphony has exactly that going for it and that's > > exactly what its "sameness" is whether it be hip hop or Mozart. Hmm, interesting way of looking at it ... > One just has to get used to where "home" is. It's just a question of > learning to be a native in a strange land instead of always feeling > one's self to be a stranger in a strange land. And a strange land it is indeed :-) Jan. From initiatrix at softhome.net Mon Feb 3 16:15:31 2003 From: initiatrix at softhome.net (initiatrix@softhome.net) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:56 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <17310743508.20030204001531@softhome.net> Hey Tom damn cash convertors ! I'll give you a fiver for it ...... hehe jon Tac> In a message dated 3/2/03 12:27:58 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: >>just got the editor running in classic under 10.2, but it s not >>stable at all. has anyone got it running well? i m using a >>tibook800 and a usb midisport 2x2 Tac> I suppose I really shouldn't be answering this (because I'm not running 10.2 Tac> yet- but I think I've got some useful info to share) Tac> for a start, what editor are you using? and I've had countless problems with Tac> the Midisport 2x2 (not even cash converters would give me a fiver for it!). Tac> I'm using an Emagic mt4 now- which is stable as a rock, but you MUST disable Tac> the OMSmididriver extention- as I found this interferes with the mt4 . Tac> Perhaps it's the same with the 2x2?? Tac> good luck! Tac> Tom :-) Tac> _______________________________________________ Tac> Nord-Modular mailing list Tac> Nord-Modular@code404.com Tac> http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular Tac> _______________________________________________ Tac> Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list Tac> may not be redistributed without the express Tac> consent of the author/creator. From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 3 16:23:16 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:56 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano Message-ID: <18c.15a1757d.2b7061f4@aol.com> In a message dated 4/2/03 12:12:09 am, J.Punter@iaf.nl writes: >Friday's Child wrote: > >> And ... all music that explores polyphony has exactly that going for >it and that's >> >> exactly what its "sameness" is whether it be hip hop or Mozart. > >Hmm, interesting way of looking at it ... I was going to suggest listening to Thomas Talis' "Spem in Alum"- (I don't know if I've got the title right?) - But anyway it's 5th (?) century choral music- and pure polyphony- for all those who may be interested. But I'm going to rejoin this thread in the morning as I've had a really hectic day :( Tom :-) From pvigo at swin.edu.au Mon Feb 3 16:48:49 2003 From: pvigo at swin.edu.au (Paul Vigo) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:56 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <71364836026.20030203115515@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: -----Original Message----- On Behalf Of Friday's Child on: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 6:55 AM Re: [NM] microtonality: piano K(ofi) B(usia) wrote..... I _still_ don't get it about this "harmonizing" business. All you need to create a harmony is one drum. That's it. It can harmonize just fine Sometimes two is better, though. You can even create melodies the self same way as well. -- Correct! Drums and skinned instruments are particularly good at this and quite flexable. What we are talking about here though is what physicists call "harmonics", most of the time talking also about the fundamental and other various frequencies with a relationship with this abstract (and highly fictional) number. Musicians from a western tradition play on this theory and it's counterpart in reality under the poetic name of "harmony", doing what physicists would describe something like: "overlaying tones of various frequencies in order to produce close to integer relationships between the harmonics of those tones." It kindof describes reality. (There's a good discussion of the way this works in "the physics and psychophysics of music" by j.g.roeder) One of the quirks of western music is that it's reliance on scales (particularly equal tempered) fight against reducing this "dissonance", whilst paradoxically, this tradition highly values the management of tonal consonance (and dissonance). Luckily the physics of real polyphonic instruments like the piano conspire to keep them more in tune than their tempered scales would imply. Western mono instrumentalists also (often unconciously) conspire against these ideal scales in their attempt to play in tune with their fellow players. The big issue for synthesists however, expecially in the digital domain, is that there is no physics at play, nor interface, to make the subtle pitch ajustments of the voices of our instruments to sidestep the pitching bugs in the western musical system. I guess the point of this rather long winded rant is I am beginning to think that microtonality is extremely important to sound design, and in the age of electronic (and mostly keyboard driven) music, far too easy to ignore. pavig@pobox.com From walters at doubtfulpalace.com Mon Feb 3 16:51:41 2003 From: walters at doubtfulpalace.com (Tim Walters) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:56 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <44379932023.20030203160651@yefrewenchi.com> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> <44379932023.20030203160651@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <17386.207.172.28.2.1044319901.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> Friday's Child wrote: >> There are plenty of >> contemporary JI composers who use harmonies as major compositional >> element: Partch, Johnston, Rich, Carlos, La Monte Young, Riley, etc. > I was not referring to "Western" microtonal music. Well, the original question was something like "how does harmony work in microtonal music?" While it's worth pointing out that there's plenty of microtonal music that doesn't get involved with harmony, I think it's also worth pointing out that there's some that does. > All I'm trying to say is that the vast bulk of the world's music does > not share this preoccupation, and also that I don't see how a > microtonal piano is going to do anything any fundamentally different > from what Palestrina was trying to do. It's hard to know for sure without a better description of the piano, but it's conceivable that it could be used in Partch-tuned music or Lucy-tuned music--both of which are completely outside the Western harmonic system--or even in completely pitch-continuous music, where any frequency is available (and possibily aleatorically determined). Just some examples that come to mind that are neither Eurocentric nor "world." Whether this is the most likely use of the piano is, of course, another matter--if I had to guess, I would say that the main market for this device would be performers who want to switch freely between well temperament and equal temperament in between pieces on the program. On the other hand, maybe all those people have spare fortepianos already... > All I've tried to say, rightly or > wrongly, is that the scale chosen -- be it microtonal or equal > temperament -- is in Western music pretty secondary to the method that > is to be used to present those notes to the listener which is almost > guaranteed to be chordally and harmonically based. There's no doubt that most Western music is like this--that is, its original tuning has a one-to-one mapping to ET such that it's perceived as the same piece of music in either tuning--but it doesn't have to be that way. Partch, again, is an example--his pieces can't be mapped to ET in any meaningful way, yet they have strong harmonic content. Clarence Barlow's 17-ET system is another example (as opposed to 19-ET, which *can* usually be mapped to 12-ET). So there is potential to go "beyond Palestrina" with this device, whether that potential is ever realized or not. -- SLAW * SNAKES & LADDERS Experimental popular children's music for adults http://www.doubtfulpalace.com/artists/Slaw From megasycophant at yahoo.com Mon Feb 3 17:10:28 2003 From: megasycophant at yahoo.com (Brian Forsythe) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: I find that I've worked and worked at most things in my life that I've become relatively good at (slamming my head against the wall) until I uncovered some pivotal piece of information resulting in an epiphany, not making me an instant master of the subject in any sense, but allowing me to confidently proceed -- a "grokking" of the subject if you will. For me, this data is usually accessed in some sort of documentation or interaction with someone who groks the subject. I think I have a personal limitation in that though I excel at many matters considered analytical, my abilities are intuitively driven. Hope that makes sense. My question is this: How have you come to awareness? Was there something you did, read, heard that flicked the switch in the recesses of your subconsciousness? What was your learning process like? I'll share one, albeit minor, piece in the unlikely event there is someone here less aware than me. Some time ago, I was reading a book called Electronica Dance Music Programming Secrets, and realized the importance between the interaction of note lengths and filter envelopes that results in slightly different note lengths dramatically effecting the quality (is timbre the right word?) of individual notes, giving them movement, etc. This illustrates my point well, because I knew all of the pieces involved -- filter envelopes, note lengths, etc -- but had just never put two and two together. Love to hear your thoughts... From soc at code404.com Mon Feb 3 17:34:15 2003 From: soc at code404.com (Justin Maxwell) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, 3 Feb 2003, Brian Forsythe wrote: > My question is this: How have you come to awareness? Was there something you > did, read, heard that flicked the switch in the recesses of your > subconsciousness? What was your learning process like? Yes, it's fairly simple. I stopped caring what other people were doing and focused on my own projects and expanding my own knowledge. > Electronica Dance Music Programming Secrets See, that right there is where I'd stop. I'm happy to hear you found it useful, but -- for me -- reading someone else's opinion on how to write "electronica" seems counterintuitive, especially for a genre born out of creativity and experimentation. Good topic -- looking forward to hearing more... jkm+_ p.s. mr. nord modular helped me rock club six in sf on saturday. -- + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.volsoc.com + + + + > compuphonic_machines_program_my_beats___________________> From bdu at fdiskc.com Mon Feb 3 16:36:54 2003 From: bdu at fdiskc.com (Brandon Daniel) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Mon, 3 Feb 2003, Justin Maxwell wrote: > jkm+_ > > p.s. mr. nord modular helped me rock club six in sf on saturday. Yes, yes it did. The TIbooks and masks didn't hurt either, though! -Brandon From nordmodular at zworg.com Mon Feb 3 18:53:58 2003 From: nordmodular at zworg.com (salvador del salgo) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <16251.1044327238@zworg.com> as long as you know what the peices are, who cares how you put the puzzle together? as long as it works for you, thats what matters. i can't honestly say that i've had an epiphany on synthesis and music making, but if i were to have one i do believe it would on my own and not realized in the response of a question. let it find _you_, otherwise you'll never find _it_. From ianhattwick at attbi.com Mon Feb 3 19:32:43 2003 From: ianhattwick at attbi.com (Ian Hattwick) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <16251.1044327238@zworg.com> Message-ID: <52562CB0-37F1-11D7-B6EF-00039307260A@attbi.com> Two days before I left town for a month last december, a friend told me he had given up using midi to program drums, instead he just directly loads the samples into perfromer, and edits the drum parts as audio. I stayed up the next two nights frantically putting tracks together doing that, and it has made making tracks a lot more intuitive and reliable for me. Now I don't use midi at all, and I am very happy about that. Ian On Monday, February 3, 2003, at 06:53 PM, salvador del salgo wrote: > as long as you know what the peices are, who cares how you put the > puzzle together? as long as it works for you, thats what matters. i > can't honestly say that i've had an epiphany on synthesis and music > making, but if i were to have one i do believe it would on my own and > not realized in the response of a question. let it find _you_, > otherwise you'll never find _it_. > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From b.hawk at shaw.ca Mon Feb 3 17:39:40 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: >>Just make sure you have 10.2.3 (which has oms support) > > > >>Other than that I can't offer any other suggestions. > > > > >that s what it must be. like, it works, then it doesn't.... > >10.2.3 it is then > >thanks!! seems to work fine now thanks! From kadrock at pipeline.com Mon Feb 3 20:57:11 2003 From: kadrock at pipeline.com (Atom) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This all makes me think of Harry Partch, who wrote the book (well a book) on alternate tunings/intonation, microtonality, and built his own instruments. Rather than try to explain it myself, here is a link: http://www.harrypartch.com/ BTW, isn't the Nord Modular capable of alternate tunings, despite what one poster said? (Sorry if this had already been addressed.) -Atom >I've experimented quite a bit with microtonality in harmony, but despite >trying to wrap my head around the theory it's usually come down to the >simplest solution: Lay down your harmonies one voice at a time and ride the >pitch bend in the process. A lot of it is trial and error but after a bit >you figure out which note has to be just a touch sharp or flat and it >becomes second nature. Somehow i've found the ear is a better judge of what >locks harmonicly than any of the more logical strategies i've been able to >come up with - (and the nord lead 2 has a sweet pitch stick for finessing >that kind of thing.) I'm not talking about just temperament either - listen >to a bit of well played fretless bass and it's anything but just tempered. > >If anyone's got any interesting microtonal patches, love to hear them. > >Paul Vigo >Teacher, Swinburne University. [LAM300, LSM201] >email: pvigo@swin.edu.au - Mobile: 0425 704463 >personal email pavig@pobox.com and MSN .net >(preffered IM) >ICQ: 642304 - AOL: pavigmedia - Yahoo and undernet/irc: pavig > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com >[mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of steve.scrambled >Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 12:17 AM >To: Nord Modular >Subject: Re: [NM] microtonality: piano > > >> Harriet Smith of the classical Music magazine is among >> the doubters. "The question it immediately begs is why? You obviously >> don't need all these extra tones to play the majority of the repertoire >> that is out there. And you wouldn't really want it to play world music >> on the piano because that's not really what the piano is about." ' >> >> Isn't this the same attitude people had when the convection oven came out? >;) >> I think to say "this is not what the piano is really about" would be >denying >> countless composers (in particular, John Cage, Stephen Scott etc.) that >their >> work had any point. > >How does harmony operate in a microtonal situation, though? I guess the >point of a piano is that it's a massively polyphonic instrument and thus >suited to exploiting the possibilities of harmony (or disharmony for that >matter). Some non-western music seems to concentrate upon melodic complexity >using single monophonic parts rather than on harmonic relationships, whereas >other kinds (like Indian music, I believe) have very complex harmonic >content. I suppose the extent to which it would make sense to perform >existing pieces on this new-fangled piano would depend upon the extent to >which harmony is used by the piece. > >Didn't Terry Riley do some microtonal piano stuff? I think I have an ancient >SOS article about it somewhere. > >Does anyone here make microtonal stuff or know about how it relates to >harmony? I think Kofi might be due to drop another information payload quite >soon... > >Nice article, Tom. > >Steve (Rowboffin) -- _______________________________________________________ .MELANGE.electronic.music. http://www.melange.org .media/scoring/art/design. "Talking about art is like dancing about architecture." - David Bowie _______________________________________________________ From fogheights at earthlink.net Mon Feb 3 21:10:46 2003 From: fogheights at earthlink.net (e. mokur) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] can't load pch? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, I can't get the editor to accept this patch. Can anybody check this out, please? e. mokur -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2921 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030204/2ae3c655/attachment.obj From fogheights at earthlink.net Mon Feb 3 21:32:47 2003 From: fogheights at earthlink.net (e. mokur) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: Tuva? In-Reply-To: <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: on 2/3/03 2:52 PM, Friday's Child at afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com wrote: > Well ... in the case of Indian, not really. Are there any Tuva voice like patch in the NM achive? Thanks e. mokur From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Mon Feb 3 22:40:33 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] can't load pch? References: Message-ID: <3E3F6061.5030401@wanadoo.nl> e. mokur wrote: > Hi, I can't get the editor to accept this patch. > Can anybody check this out, please? Totally screwed up by the Net, I'm afraid. Go to http://nordsynth.zevv.nl/010_NordModular/011_Patches/Beek_Wouter_van/SickVoilin.pch Where is that site again about long URL's? Wout From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Mon Feb 3 22:48:30 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] can't load pch? References: <3E3F6061.5030401@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: <3E3F623E.3040408@wanadoo.nl> Wout Blommers wrote: > e. mokur wrote: > >> Hi, I can't get the editor to accept this patch. >> Can anybody check this out, please? > > > Totally screwed up by the Net, I'm afraid. > Go to > http://nordsynth.zevv.nl/010_NordModular/011_Patches/Beek_Wouter_van/SickVoilin.pch Strange, doesn't work either... Maybe as an attachment? Wout -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: SickVoilin.pch Type: .pch Size: 2543 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030204/79c8bc17/SickVoilin.bat From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 23:02:41 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:57 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <18c.15a1757d.2b7061f4@aol.com> References: <18c.15a1757d.2b7061f4@aol.com> Message-ID: <63404881639.20030203230241@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > I was going to suggest listening to Thomas Talis' "Spem in Alum"- (I don't > know if I've got the title right?) - Thomas Tallis. 40-part motet. "Spem in alium". > But anyway it's 5th (?) century choral music- 16th century. Elizabethan. http://www.st-alfege.org/t-tallis.htm > and pure polyphony- for all those who may be interested. Idiots like me, actually!!!! This is the text: Spem in alium numquam habui praeter in te Deus Israel qui irasceris et propitius eris et omnia peccata hominum in tribulatione dimittis Domine Deus Creator coeli et terra respice humilitatem nostram I have never put my hope in any other but in you God of Israel who will be angry and yet become again gracious and who forgives all the sins of suffering man Lord God Creator of Heaven and Earth look upon our lowliness As you say -- it's a really great piece of work ... even in the opinion of someone like me who's grown weary of all that polyphony stuff!!! > But I'm going > to rejoin this thread in the morning as I've had a really hectic day :( Hope you had a good sleep!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Mon Feb 3 23:16:26 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <17386.207.172.28.2.1044319901.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> <44379932023.20030203160651@yefrewenchi.com> <17386.207.172.28.2.1044319901.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> Message-ID: <156405707085.20030203231626@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/3/2003 Tim Walters wrote: > Friday's Child wrote: >>> There are plenty of >>> contemporary JI composers who use harmonies as major compositional >>> element: Partch, Johnston, Rich, Carlos, La Monte Young, Riley, etc. >> I was not referring to "Western" microtonal music. > Well, the original question was something like "how does harmony work in > microtonal music?" True. > While it's worth pointing out that there's plenty of > microtonal music that doesn't get involved with harmony, Yes. I was presuming, possibly wrongly, that people didn't know so much about those ... > I think it's also > worth pointing out that there's some that does. Well ... then I was clearly making the mistake of assuming that everyone knew such things existed. Harmonizing is what Western music does, after all. Sorry for making that assumption, though. But ... the kind of microtonal music that harmonizes is called "Western microtonal music". If people are going to get interested in microtonal music one thing that is going to have to change is the form of the music. E.g.. when the Impressionists "rejected" the major-minor axis they wrote many less sonatas and concertos (n.b. I did not say "non") and emphasised other forms such as preludes and "occasional" musics. Those kinds of forms did not derive their existence from a search for completion through tonality. > It's hard to know for sure without a better description of the piano, but > it's conceivable that it could be used in Partch-tuned music or Lucy-tuned > music-- Yes indeed. > both of which are completely outside the Western harmonic > system-- That I'm not so sure of. Just look at the theories that went into establishing them. And that done, they still try to harmonize. Take the Lucy. All those calculations using the value of pi. http://www.harmonics.com/lucy/lsd/chap1.html http://www.harmonics.com/lucy/index.html Partch, however, is another matter, and your point is taken. Nevertheless ... nevertheless ... he certainly doesn't SOUND like he's from any other culture -- but the Western. At least ... not from what I've heard of him!! I, personally, have not heard anything that could conceivably have been written by anyone from any other culture, although I have not heard all his works. > Whether this > is the most likely use of the piano is, of course, another matter-- Quite. And ... agreed. > if I > had to guess, I would say that the main market for this device would be > performers who want to switch freely between well temperament and equal > temperament in between pieces on the program. Unfortunately, I agree with you. That's the depressing part. > On the other hand, maybe all > those people have spare fortepianos already... LOL!! >> All I've tried to say, rightly or >> wrongly, is that the scale chosen -- be it microtonal or equal >> temperament -- is in Western music pretty secondary to the method that >> is to be used to present those notes to the listener which is almost >> guaranteed to be chordally and harmonically based. > There's no doubt that most Western music is like this--that is, its > original tuning has a one-to-one mapping to ET such that it's perceived as > the same piece of music in either tuning-- That's all I've tried to say. > but it doesn't have to be that way. Totally agreed. And ... I wish it wasn't. One of the major things I was taking issue with, from the original Guardian article, was its declaration that somehow this piano was suddenly going to present "Western music" with something it had never come across before. It has. Let's just hope that people get to like it more this time ... but somehow I don't think they will. > Partch, again, is an example--his pieces can't be mapped to ET in any > meaningful way, yet they have strong harmonic content. Errrrr ... that's kind of EXACTLY what I've tried to say. Harmonizing is what Western composers always want to do, even when you give them a new scale. WHY do they always want to do this? Why? > So there is potential to go "beyond Palestrina" with this device, Yes. Totally agreed. > whether > that potential is ever realized or not. Sadly, I don't think it will be but I wait with bated breath. OK ... as far as I can see the differences between your position and mine reduce to this ... when you hear a different tuning or a whole different set of choices to make music with, then it's immediately "different" and unlike everything else in Western music. Me ... well ... I guess I'm just more jaundiced. As soon as I hear people harmonizing or playing in a way that clearly implies "chords", then I pretty much don't care any more HOW exotic" or whatever the tuning or choice of notes might be. The composers and players are immediately children of Palestrina and his simultaneous polyphonic lines and I call it "Western". It might be microtonal but it's still harmonic and Western. That's really all I've tried to say -- to point out that there's a lot of microtonal music that's played and conceived in a TOTALLY different way. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From walters at doubtfulpalace.com Tue Feb 4 00:15:05 2003 From: walters at doubtfulpalace.com (Tim Walters) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: <156405707085.20030203231626@yefrewenchi.com> References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> <44379932023.20030203160651@yefrewenchi.com> <17386.207.172.28.2.1044319901.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> <156405707085.20030203231626@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: >OK ... as far as I can see the differences between your position and >mine reduce to this ... when you hear a different tuning or a whole >different set of choices to make music with, then it's immediately >"different" and unlike everything else in Western music. That certainly isn't what I meant to say! I would put it more like this: People (like the writer of the article) usually assume that "microtonality" implies "non-Western" scales, but: --there are strong Western microtonal traditions, both ancient and modern; --if you want to have both microtonality *and* harmony in your music, it's quite possible, and there are plenty of models to learn from. Harry Partch has always sounded totally American to me--while simultaneously sounding like no-one else--and I believe that's how he would like it. (Ditto Charles Ives, another microtonalist.) I don't have any problem with the idea that "chords" make music sound Western, regardless of tuning. I understand that to an Indian classical musician, the entire Western symphonic repertoire sounds like either funeral marches or nursery rhymes. Using mean-tone tuning won't change that! I would add, though, that playing anything on a piano, bent strings or no, will also make it sound Western, even if it's Peking Opera. I don't think we have any actual disagreement. We're just emphasizing different things. -- Free Exquisite Music : The Doubtful Palace : http://www.doubtfulpalace.com From Terryfunken at aol.com Tue Feb 4 00:53:25 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <172.16087355.2b70d985@aol.com> In a message dated 3/2/03 7:57:26 pm, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: >>What do you mean by this exactly?- > > > >better to set up oms under 9, rather than classic > yeah yeah- I'm not that dumb;) From nostromo at arkaos.net Tue Feb 4 02:41:19 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: Message-ID: <00c501c2cc39$f446d480$66c188d9@TWISTIE> > Yes, it's fairly simple. I stopped caring what other people were doing > and focused on my own projects and expanding my own knowledge. Yeah, but isn't your knowledge based on other people's work. There's invaluable knowledge out there (more specifically this list is one of them) and to respond to the original post, I find the following are definetly very important: 1- learn the language ----------------------------- Getting the basic knowledge of the various element of synthesis. I would categorise them into > Physical process What is sound made of ; basic things as harmonics, fourier principles, psycho-acoustics... I have a couple of books that are very interesting although sometimes quite abstracts. Elements of computer music by Richard moore is one of them. > Synthesis types: substractive, FM, additive, granular.. > Synth building blocks: Oscillators, LFO, Filter, Ring modulators, compressors Look at the Modular workshop on clavia's web site... if you got a nord, they are a great source of self teaching. I also love the synthesis article in sound on sound. They stay very simple but you learn a great deal to them. Getting to know your gears intimately is also a bonus. 2- Dissect other people's work. Get to know how other people do stuff you like. Again, the fact that the nord has such a nice editor makes it a lot easier to get around those. There are *tons* of beautiful patches in the archives but you'll have to separate them from the noise though ;-) 3- Put yourself under pressure. I've started learning a lot by having to do stuff for other people. Instead of doing my own crazy unusable rambling that gave me easy self satisfaction, it forced my to focus on a specific goal and delivering usable sounds ; much more of a challenge if you asked me. 4- Don't be afraid to ask. There's some geniuses on this list ;-) Hope this helps, M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ From dave at 22host24.com Tue Feb 4 02:59:15 2003 From: dave at 22host24.com (dave) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] a pleasent patch Message-ID: <000d01c2cc3c$758b4240$02fea8c0@soloman> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pritty patchy.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2036 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030204/55516f5a/prittypatchy.obj From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Tue Feb 4 02:49:10 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > > > My question is this: How have you come to awareness? Was there > something you > did, read, heard that flicked the switch in the recesses of your > subconsciousness? What was your learning process like? > > Love to hear your thoughts... > The point is one never knows if one has really come to awareness, awareness can be full of deceit. At some point things appear to look clear and there is a sense of understanding and finally being there, then the next day it doesn't 'work' anymore and the insights appear limited. Which leads to what for me makes 'making music with as much control over synthesis as possible' such a nice and adventurous thing, it is like travelling to a strange land, everyday there are new discoveries when new places are visited. And there seems to be no borders around this wonderful land of synthesis. A bit like our planet, us humans have drawn borders, but the same humans proved that all _natural_ borders like oceans and mountain ranges can be taken and so have ceased to be real borders. Now humans go moutaineering and ocean sailing for pure amusement. Which is a positive thought, leading to the notion that in the end, when all borders around limited musical, compositorial and synthesis abilities are crossed, all music will be nothing but amusement. These days borders are created in the mind only and taking them seriously is per definition a limited view, and trying to effectuate borders by building fences is dangerous and all too often leads to death by war or famine for many. So, taking a lighthearted approach to synthesis and music in general is imho not a bad thing. Still, this is _my_ awareness and maybe tomorrow I find out that I'm totally wrong, eg. that serious music is really serious and it will be proven in some court that I make 'entartete musik' instead and will be imprisoned, tortured and killed for 'not being serious'. (It wasn't only Jews who got killed in the gas chambers, you know! The notion of artistic freedom runs much deeper than just the right to do things your own way.) I guess a healthy attitude is to get inspired by everything and trying out every new idea. It doesn't really matter where the inspiration comes from when it in fact does inspire. I am aware that this is a bit in contrast to our modern day consumerist culture where one 'buys what one needs' instead of 'makes what one needs'. I'm a bit oldfasioned in this, I have a bit of the 'renaissance mind' which on the surface might appear to be contra-economical, but is in fact quite productive. Anyway, sound synthesis is only one of the tools used in the art of making music. And like in the process of mastering any tool one learns the most from the 'mistakes', eg. when picking up a hammer for the first time and hitting your thumb you know: _that_ way it doesn't work. But the nice thing about synthesis is that there are only 'happy accidents', they cannot hurt, unless of course you literally blow your ears away. There are two things one can do with these happy accidents, 'promote' them to some new music theory by building a fence around them or keep them for what they really are: happy accidents that can be enjoyed by oneself and one's audience. Every musical genre has it's style characteristics, but these are no laws, just 'things that work' and can be freely used. There is some subtle difference here between character and dogma. Eg. imho the main feature of a synthesizer should be the ability to play the sound in a dynamic and expressive way. This is not to bend the character of the sound into what the synth is expected to sound like in a certain genre, but instead to play the character in new and unexpected ways to add to the richness of a genre. And so to be able to improvise. This can be done by controllers like pitchsticks and modwheels or by using other oscillators and filters patched in an unconventional way. But also some nifty computer programming or NM patching can accomplish it, or whatever else that works. Cause it is simple: when it works it works, and when it doesn't work one might possibly be on the exiting path of discovering something new. And when feeling a bit uncertain about this, well, all other people are as big a fool or wiseguy as yourself, you can safely put your trust in that one! ;-)) Have fun, Rob From Terryfunken at aol.com Tue Feb 4 05:11:42 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: <37.336deace.2b71160e@aol.com> In a message dated 3/2/03 8:05:24 pm, afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com writes: >The twentieth century was filled with a lot of >experimentation and innovation. But many feel that the cost of this >freedom for composers was a divorce from substantial numbers of the >potential audience who found that they couldn't "understand" and "enjoy" >it >any more unless they were prepared to invest a considerable amount of >time in "learning" to "get" what the composers were up to. Hmmm very interesting point Kofi:) Like ALL languages (and music definately IS a language), It is only interest which spurs us on to understand it further. Even the, interest is determined by taste, and while some compositions are music to some people's ears, it's cacophony to others. Yes the Guardian writing is naive- which is a shame, but then they are appealing to the masses- and they have to sell newpapers:(. But there we go! ;) Interestingly enough, there are only a very small number of 'techno' producers who have explored quarter and microtonal scales. The most obvious one who springs to mind is Richard D. James (aka Aphex Twin)- and although people say there is a certain mystery to his music, I think this has been largely achieved by the use of the DX7 synthesiser which has the ability to do just that (the DX is beloved by James- which is not surprising;) Others (asforementioned- Harry Partch, Terry Riley etc)- I'd say Brian Eno and The Residents too. I'd rather have a micromodular any day to a bulky Piano, but then again, the piano can evoke emotions that the synthesiser can never achieve (possibly because, while the only person to take it seriously in the 60's was probably Wendy Carlos, others just viewed it as a great machine for producing 'cheesy farting noises' (notably- Jean Jaques-Perret!!) LOL!! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Tue Feb 4 05:19:58 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <33.336f14b4.2b7117fe@aol.com> In a message dated 4/2/03 10:42:00 am, nostromo@arkaos.net writes: >Yeah, but isn't your knowledge based on other people's work. There's > >invaluable knowledge out there (more specifically this list is one of them) > >and to respond to the original post, I find the following are definetly >very > >important: > > > >1- learn the language > >----------------------------- In fact if you are clever enough, you should be able to stick just 6 patches in your synth, and use no more- ie writing *songs* using those signature sounds. I think this is a very important point to make, because in this world of "faceless *electronica* bollocks", it is often very hard to hear who is making what. Everybody (I hope) can spot kraftwerk or Mouse on Mars or Aphex Twin etc a mile off because they rely on a set of sounds which become their signature sound (also too is the style that they PLAY those sounds in too). I think this is waay more important than clambering over everybody else hoping to find new sounds altogether. Hope that helps:) Tom :-) From nostromo at arkaos.net Tue Feb 4 05:47:32 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: <33.336f14b4.2b7117fe@aol.com> Message-ID: <012101c2cc53$f7cf6030$66c188d9@TWISTIE> You have a point in that sonic signature is definetly important. You could argue also that being a good craftmen, you could turn any patch into yours by adding your own flavoring into it .. but this takes the same learning curve as being able to write patch per se.. > In fact if you are clever enough, you should be able to stick just 6 patches > in your synth, and use no more- ie writing *songs* using those signature > sounds. Everybody (I hope) can spot kraftwerk or Mouse on Mars or Aphex > Twin etc a mile off because they rely on a set of sounds which become their > signature sound (also too is the style that they PLAY those sounds in too). I > think this is waay more important than clambering over everybody else hoping > to find new sounds altogether. From dave at 22host24.com Tue Feb 4 07:14:10 2003 From: dave at 22host24.com (dave) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech Message-ID: <000c01c2cc60$11ae0860$02fea8c0@soloman> Hi there I would like to do some speeck and singing on my mac (osx) a la aphex t and cylog etc. Is there a nice gui or do i have to use applescript etc. I know I can highlight text and get it to speak that , but Im sure oin os 9 there was an inbuilt app that had all the controls in one window... cheers dave -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030204/29661e91/attachment.htm From eggy at eggytoast.com Tue Feb 4 07:13:50 2003 From: eggy at eggytoast.com (EggyToast) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:58 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <52562CB0-37F1-11D7-B6EF-00039307260A@attbi.com> References: <52562CB0-37F1-11D7-B6EF-00039307260A@attbi.com> Message-ID: >Two days before I left town for a month last december, a friend told >me he had given up using midi to program drums, instead he just >directly loads the samples into perfromer, and edits the drum parts >as audio. I stayed up the next two nights frantically putting tracks >together doing that, and it has made making tracks a lot more >intuitive and reliable for me. Now I don't use midi at all, and I am >very happy about that. >Ian Well, using a sampler and a midi sequencer gives you pretty much the same flexibility, if not more, as you don't need to modify the actual audio in order to work. I used to work with audio directly, and it's great for visualization. But I kept feelign limited by the actual samples I was using -- after all, you're then limited to using samples and audio editors, rather than something like Kontakt. I guess I just don't see the difference. You're still hand-sequencing everything, you just can't swap out sounds nearly as easily. derek -- eggytoast.com -------------- commerce soon: eggtastic.com From byron at limbiksys.org Tue Feb 4 08:04:53 2003 From: byron at limbiksys.org (ByronE) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <55377.24.211.24.211.1044374693.squirrel@www.limbiksys.org> >>Two days before I left town for a month last december, a friend told >>me he had given up using midi to program drums, instead he just >>directly loads the samples into perfromer, and edits the drum parts as >>audio. I stayed up the next two nights frantically putting tracks >>together doing that, and it has made making tracks a lot more >>intuitive and reliable for me. Now I don't use midi at all, and I am >>very happy about that. >>Ian > Each to his own, I used to do it that way (for years), but only because I had very few other options. I spent the first 7 years of my music makeing trying to dig my self out of the digital hole of pure sample and loop based music ...due to the fact that I personally found it to eventually become a bit boring, and lacked the 'sub-flow' and inner groove that hardware sequencing with analog synths and percussion, and a touch of randomosity wield. I've just always felt as well, that even a sampled loop being sequnced in a hardware sampler can give a touch more fluidness than using software to sequnce samples...not to mention, it makes it much easier to prepare to gig live since I dont have to worry about bringing my computer then. ByronIV From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Tue Feb 4 08:14:24 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] a pleasent patch References: <000d01c2cc3c$758b4240$02fea8c0@soloman> Message-ID: <3E3FE6E0.9060806@wanadoo.nl> dave wrote: > Sort of like a harpsichord or something. pleasent with some fizz and > movement. my first contribution. > d Hi Dave, Do you have a family name? There is already a 'Dave' in the Archive and if this is your first contribution, you are not the same person, so how do you want to be known in the Archive? Wout From ClkDiv at yahoo.de Tue Feb 4 06:48:59 2003 From: ClkDiv at yahoo.de (Suer Stroemling) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] Sell NORD MDOULAR RACK for 950,- + Micro Modular for 380,- EURO References: Message-ID: <002201c2cc6a$fb12ace0$3d9f143e@micky> Hallo Stefan, kann ich mal deine Telefonnummer haben? Und ist der Micro ?berhaupt noch da? Danke.... Martin __________________________________________________________________ Gesendet von Yahoo! Mail - http://mail.yahoo.de Bis zu 100 MB Speicher bei http://premiummail.yahoo.de From valis at ucla.edu Tue Feb 4 08:38:46 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <55377.24.211.24.211.1044374693.squirrel@www.limbiksys.org> References: <55377.24.211.24.211.1044374693.squirrel@www.limbiksys.org> Message-ID: <1044376726.3e3fec96e28cb@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting ByronE : > > I've just always felt as well, that even a sampled loop being sequnced in > a > hardware sampler can give a touch more fluidness than using software to > sequnce samples...not to mention, it makes it much easier to prepare to > gig > live since I dont have to worry about bringing my computer then. > > ByronIV I agree- but, to each his own. I work best with midi as, I think Derek(?) mentioned, it is so easy to swap out sounds and get things you didn't plan on... I work best with my old Akai S2800 sampler simply because I know it so well - I can practically edit programs with my eyes closed. It just depends how you work best. When I first got into sequencing I started with a lot of heavily-planned, painstaking deliberate sequence programming. But in recent years I have gravitated to a more "live" type of recording, as I believe a lot of the best moments are not consciously planned, and (as Miles Davis always said) usually the "first take" is the best. So I will pound out a beat or jam a bassline or whatever for a while first, and then go to the editing to "clean it up" a little (if necessary). I go back and forth from midi to audio, sampling bits and re-sequecning them, running the sequences through the NM, re-sampling, re-sequencing etc., etc. And it's different every day. You may get some good inspiration studying what others' methods are, and by dissecting others' works, but in the end, those methods just may not be what suits you. Just experiment, have fun, tweak, squeeze, blow, pound, slice, nudge, cut copy paste, quantize, unquantize, drag drop, squash, bend, timestretch, pitchshift, loop, process etc etc etc etc vV From valis at ucla.edu Tue Feb 4 08:40:28 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <55377.24.211.24.211.1044374693.squirrel@www.limbiksys.org> References: <55377.24.211.24.211.1044374693.squirrel@www.limbiksys.org> Message-ID: <1044376828.3e3fecfc97b70@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting ByronE : > > I've just always felt as well, that even a sampled loop being sequnced in > a > hardware sampler can give a touch more fluidness than using software to > sequnce samples...not to mention, it makes it much easier to prepare to > gig > live since I dont have to worry about bringing my computer then. > > ByronIV I agree- but, to each his own. I use a lot of midi as, I think Derek(?) mentioned, it is so easy to swap out sounds and get things you didn't plan on... I work best with my old Akai S2800 sampler simply because I know it so well - I can practically edit programs with my eyes closed. It just depends how you feel comfortable. There is no secret formula! When I first got into sequencing I started with a lot of heavily-planned, painstaking deliberate sequence programming. But in recent years I have gravitated to a more "live" type of recording, as I believe a lot of the best moments are not consciously planned, and (as Miles Davis always said) usually the "first take" is the best. So I will pound out a beat or jam a bassline or whatever for a while first, and then go to the editing to "clean it up" a little (if necessary). I go back and forth from midi to audio, sampling bits and re-sequecning them, running the sequences through the NM, re- sampling, re-sequencing etc., etc. And it's different every day. You may get some good inspiration studying what others' methods are, and by dissecting others' works, but in the end, those methods just may not be what suits you. Just experiment, have fun, tweak, squeeze, blow, pound, slice, nudge, cut copy paste, quantize, unquantize, drag drop, squash, bend, timestretch, pitchshift, loop, process etc etc etc etc vV From valis at ucla.edu Tue Feb 4 08:52:04 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech In-Reply-To: <000c01c2cc60$11ae0860$02fea8c0@soloman> References: <000c01c2cc60$11ae0860$02fea8c0@soloman> Message-ID: <1044377523.3e3fefb403b4b@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting dave : > Hi there > > I would like to do some speeck and singing on my mac (osx) a la aphex t > and cylog etc. Is there a nice gui or do i have to use applescript etc. I > know I can highlight text and get it to speak that , but Im sure oin os 9 > there was an inbuilt app that had all the controls in one window... > cheers > dave I'm not sure what you are looking for... there is the "speech" control panel, where you can change the voices and stuff, but that's all I know of. What is it exactly you want to be able to do? I think highlighting the text like you said is the best way, you know, simpletext or something. Then you just need a way to record that out (I use my mini disk) and then you can do what you need to in order to manipulate it (e.g. sample it, record it into Logic/Cubase, etc.) From seayscott at yahoo.com Tue Feb 4 08:58:11 2003 From: seayscott at yahoo.com (Scott Seay) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030204165811.13622.qmail@web20207.mail.yahoo.com> > My question is this: How have you come to awareness? > Was there something you > did, read, heard that flicked the switch in the > recesses of your > subconsciousness? What was your learning process > like? I can tell you that I am still working on learning programing, and that the past tense of the question is wrong for me. I have to learn how best to articulate an idea each time I try to put stuff together, and all I have found out is that i need to remeber not to mistake, or equate, programing with music. It is easy to get lost in the ins and outs of things and forget the larger picture. That, and I need to treat instuments and sounds as if they are things I am collaborating with, not using to create. ===== Man can think in the sense that he possesses the possibility to do so. This possibility alone, however, is no guarantee to us that we are capable of thinking. Martin Heidegger __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From nordmodular at zworg.com Tue Feb 4 09:31:25 2003 From: nordmodular at zworg.com (salvador del salgo) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech Message-ID: <5546.1044379885@zworg.com> all i've ever known for mac speech is simpletext. in there you can write what you want spoken and chenge the voice to whichever you want. if you want to record the sound back onto the coputer you have to run your output back into your input. there's no other way (that i know of) to do the recording internally. From soc at code404.com Tue Feb 4 09:26:17 2003 From: soc at code404.com (Justin Maxwell) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech In-Reply-To: <5546.1044379885@zworg.com> References: <5546.1044379885@zworg.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 4 Feb 2003, salvador del salgo wrote: > all i've ever known for mac speech is simpletext. in there you can > write what you want spoken and chenge the voice to whichever you want. > if you want to record the sound back onto the coputer you have to run > your output back into your input. there's no other way (that i know > of) to do the recording internally. There are plenty of ways, especially under osx. just go to versiontracker.com and search for "speech". you'll find 3-4 useful tts apps. -- + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.volsoc.com + + + + > compuphonic_machines_program_my_beats___________________> From snorum at ieee.org Tue Feb 4 09:40:56 2003 From: snorum at ieee.org (Stephen Norum) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech In-Reply-To: <5546.1044379885@zworg.com> Message-ID: http://www.apple.com/applescript/macosx/text2audio.html "One of the new features of Mac OS X v10.2 is the ability to convert written text into an AIFF sound file. The following scripts can be used to accomplish this conversion." Render Text to Sound File - This script will convert the text typed into a dialog window into an AIFF sound file using a chosen voice. ? Render TextEdit Document to Sound File - This script will convert the contents of the frontmost TextEdit document into an AIFF sound file using a chosen voice. Head to the page and download the scripts. You might want to check out this site as well. It has all the extra commands you can use with text to speech to make your speech more dynamic: http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/mac/Sound/Sound-200.html stephen snorum@ieee.ca salvador del salgo wrote: > all i've ever known for mac speech is simpletext. in there you can > write what you want spoken and chenge the voice to whichever you want. > if you want to record the sound back onto the coputer you have to run > your output back into your input. there's no other way (that i know > of) to do the recording internally. From valis at ucla.edu Tue Feb 4 10:09:08 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1044382148.3e4001c47fd23@mail.ucla.edu> Wow, I had no idea. Just got 10.2, and am still learning - thanks for the info. Quoting Stephen Norum : > > http://www.apple.com/applescript/macosx/text2audio.html > > "One of the new features of Mac OS X v10.2 is the ability to convert > written text into an AIFF > sound file. The following scripts can be used to accomplish this > conversion." > > Render Text to Sound File > - This script will convert the text typed > into a dialog window into an AIFF sound > file using a chosen voice. > ? > Render TextEdit Document to Sound File > - This script will convert the contents of the > frontmost TextEdit document into an AIFF > sound file using a chosen voice. > > Head to the page and download the scripts. You might want to check out > this site as well. It has all the extra commands you can use with text > to speech to make your speech more dynamic: > > http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/mac/Sound/Sound-200.html > > > stephen > snorum@ieee.ca > > > > > > > salvador del salgo wrote: > > > all i've ever known for mac speech is simpletext. in there you can > > write what you want spoken and chenge the voice to whichever you want. > > if you want to record the sound back onto the coputer you have to run > > your output back into your input. there's no other way (that i know > > of) to do the recording internally. > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From gaunitz at konstfack.se Tue Feb 4 11:36:51 2003 From: gaunitz at konstfack.se (Andreas Gaunitz) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech In-Reply-To: <1044382148.3e4001c47fd23@mail.ucla.edu> References: <1044382148.3e4001c47fd23@mail.ucla.edu> Message-ID: Get a Mac Classic II or similar, get MacOS 7.0, and get Macintalk 1.0 and the hypercard stack to control it (downloadable from apple web site). Turn on "robotic talk". Set words per minute to the tempo of your song. Set frequency to 69 Hz. 69 is too low for macintalk, so the voice will go into falsetto just for a syllable every now and then. Nothing even comes close to that sound. -A. At 10.09 -0800 03-02-04, valis@ucla.edu wrote: >Wow, I had no idea. Just got 10.2, and am still learning - thanks for the >info. > >Quoting Stephen Norum : > >> >> http://www.apple.com/applescript/macosx/text2audio.html >> >> "One of the new features of Mac OS X v10.2 is the ability to convert >> written text into an AIFF >> sound file. The following scripts can be used to accomplish this >> conversion." >> >> Render Text to Sound File >> - This script will convert the text typed >> into a dialog window into an AIFF sound >> file using a chosen voice. >> >> Render TextEdit Document to Sound File >> - This script will convert the contents of the >> frontmost TextEdit document into an AIFF >> sound file using a chosen voice. >> >> Head to the page and download the scripts. You might want to check out >> this site as well. It has all the extra commands you can use with text >> to speech to make your speech more dynamic: >> >> http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/mac/Sound/Sound-200.html >> >> >> stephen >> snorum@ieee.ca >> >> >> >> >> >> >> salvador del salgo wrote: >> >> > all i've ever known for mac speech is simpletext. in there you can >> > write what you want spoken and chenge the voice to whichever you want. >> > if you want to record the sound back onto the coputer you have to run >> > your output back into your input. there's no other way (that i know >> > of) to do the recording internally. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Nord-Modular mailing list >> Nord-Modular@code404.com >> http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >> _______________________________________________ >> Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >> may not be redistributed without the express >> consent of the author/creator. >> > > > >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. From ianhattwick at attbi.com Tue Feb 4 11:51:10 2003 From: ianhattwick at attbi.com (Ian Hattwick) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0223413A-387A-11D7-B6EF-00039307260A@attbi.com> The main reasons it changed my working life so much are that it ceased my reliance on external hardware, I just record my drum machine and work from there, and that manipulating audio is so intuitive for me. Maybe if I was using kontakt or something similar I would feel different, but making rolls, and tweaking audio feels more natural to me using thre audio editor. Plus being able to edit start and stop points, and crossfades, reversing, etc, is easier in the audio window for me. I know there are advantages to using midi, but not using it works better for me, and I think that is what epiphanies are all about, finding the way of looking at a problem that makes the most (intuitive) sense for you. As a teacher, I've seen that different people need to look at the same thing in different ways in order to understand it. It depends on what knowledge you have to draw upon. Music is so intuitive of a thing that you really need to understand what you are doing at a deep level in order to create anything approaching art. For me that is what epiphanies are- sudden jumps of personal understanding about the way things work, an understanding that lets you stop having to think about the process, and move on to the next level. Just some thoughts. Ian On Tuesday, February 4, 2003, at 07:13 AM, EggyToast wrote: >> Two days before I left town for a month last december, a friend told >> me he had given up using midi to program drums, instead he just >> directly loads the samples into perfromer, and edits the drum parts as >> audio. I stayed up the next two nights frantically putting tracks >> together doing that, and it has made making tracks a lot more >> intuitive and reliable for me. Now I don't use midi at all, and I am >> very happy about that. >> Ian > > Well, using a sampler and a midi sequencer gives you pretty much the > same flexibility, if not more, as you don't need to modify the actual > audio in order to work. > > I used to work with audio directly, and it's great for visualization. > But I kept feelign limited by the actual samples I was using -- after > all, you're then limited to using samples and audio editors, rather > than something like Kontakt. > > I guess I just don't see the difference. You're still hand-sequencing > everything, you just can't swap out sounds nearly as easily. > > derek > -- eggytoast.com > -------------- > commerce soon: eggtastic.com > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From joker at netcologne.de Tue Feb 4 12:25:37 2003 From: joker at netcologne.de (Joker) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:00:59 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Theo, Did this really work for you? How? I did the same and I can use the editor to edit patches, but as soon as I want to save a file, the editor crashes Classic. I was quite exited first, when I was able to edit patches under OS X, but this is unusable. With the OS X version of the editor I found the following bugs so far: Clicking on a random button (sequencer modules) sets them to the lowest possible value Never use ctrl-click on a module (for rename or delete), you?ll crash about 5 seconds later. Using backspace for deleting works though. When double-clicking on a .pch file to open it in the editor, you can?t access the menu bar any more to select modules. Using the open dialog works though. Quite disapointing.... I?m using a Ghz Titanium with a Midisport 2x2 > SO I booted up into OS 9 > using start up disk in system preferences and installed it as you > would in 9 > with the drivers for the midisport. Once OMS is set up in 9 (has to be > in > the version of 9 that OS X uses for Classic) and it detects your midi > interface etc. Just go back into X and launch the modular editior in > classic. Now in the midi setup it should detect your oms midi > settings. > > This will only work in 10.2.3 as it allows you to use OMS for older > classic > apps. > > all the best, Joker ------------------ www.klangbureau.de ------------------ From grantransom at totalise.co.uk Tue Feb 4 12:37:07 2003 From: grantransom at totalise.co.uk (Grant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: Message-ID: <002e01c2cc8d$35596020$0987fea9@grantransom> ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian Forsythe To: Nord Modular Mailing List Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:10 AM Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > I find that I've worked and worked at most things in my life that I've > become relatively good at (slamming my head against the wall) until I > uncovered some pivotal piece of information resulting in an epiphany, not > making me an instant master of the subject in any sense, but allowing me to > confidently proceed -- a "grokking" of the subject if you will. For me, this > data is usually accessed in some sort of documentation or interaction with > someone who groks the subject. I think I have a personal limitation in that > though I excel at many matters considered analytical, my abilities are > intuitively driven. Hope that makes sense. > > My question is this: How have you come to awareness? Was there something you > did, read, heard that flicked the switch in the recesses of your > subconsciousness? What was your learning process like? > Ongoing. The more someone feels they've mastered something, the less likely their ego is to accept what they perceive as input from a less 'masterful' source. Someone who soaks everything up, and hammers away whilst having fun is often capable of producing much more interesting things. > I'll share one, albeit minor, piece in the unlikely event there is someone > here less aware than me. Some time ago, I was reading a book called > Electronica Dance Music Programming Secrets, and realized the importance > between the interaction of note lengths and filter envelopes that results in > slightly different note lengths dramatically effecting the quality (is > timbre the right word?) of individual notes, giving them movement, etc. This > illustrates my point well, because I knew all of the pieces involved -- > filter envelopes, note lengths, etc -- but had just never put two and two > together. (Playing devil's advocate...) Interesting: A good funk bass player will do things subconciously which are analogous to this. Listening and feeling and understanding more about live playing can open up the 'technists' mind and take one's craft to a new level. Let's face it, many of them don't, with a form of zealous snobbery (and the interesting one's I know of, do). I think this is why, appart from a few exceptions, most electronic acts/genres and techno programmers are *totaly* plagiaristic at the moment. Grant. From eggy at eggytoast.com Tue Feb 4 13:40:49 2003 From: eggy at eggytoast.com (EggyToast) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <0223413A-387A-11D7-B6EF-00039307260A@attbi.com> References: <0223413A-387A-11D7-B6EF-00039307260A@attbi.com> Message-ID: >The main reasons it changed my working life so much are that it >ceased my reliance on external hardware, I just record my drum >machine and work from there, and that manipulating audio is so >intuitive for me. Maybe if I was using kontakt or something similar >I would feel different, but making rolls, and tweaking audio feels >more natural to me using thre audio editor. Plus being able to edit >start and stop points, and crossfades, reversing, etc, is easier in >the audio window for me. > >I know there are advantages to using midi, but not using it works >better for me, and I think that is what epiphanies are all about, >finding the way of looking at a problem that makes the most >(intuitive) sense for you. As a teacher, I've seen that different >people need to look at the same thing in different ways in order to >understand it. It depends on what knowledge you have to draw upon. >Music is so intuitive of a thing that you really need to understand >what you are doing at a deep level in order to create anything >approaching art. For me that is what epiphanies are- sudden jumps of >personal understanding about the way things work, an understanding >that lets you stop having to think about the process, and move on to >the next level. > Oh, from that point of view, I agree completely. I tried using hardware samplers and sequencing using hardware, and it's just so much more of a pain. I love seeing the waveform when I edit sounds, and seeing what my effects do to that waveform. it's a dual learning process then -- I train my ears *and* my eyes. For me, I like seeing what I'm doing, rather than dialing up loop points based on numbers and an "approximation" of a waveform. I love using a mouse to just highlight a bit instead of use a series of buttons and dials to do the same thing. I just prefer sequencing it in midi because it's less destructive. But otherwise I agree with you. There are certainly times where I dump bits to audio and simply work from there, because it's easier. derek -- eggytoast.com -------------- commerce soon: eggtastic.com From dpeck at euphonix.com Tue Feb 4 14:20:01 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] A patch Message-ID: <001701c2cc9b$8f503230$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi all, Nice stuff here in the list lately! Here's a rather pedestrian pad patch, but I like the effect. I was trying for something like the Prophet 5 pad patch in the tune "San Jacinto", which is about as warm & analogy as it gets, IMO. Enjoy! Dave Peck Euphonix, Inc. 220 Portage Ave. Palo Alto, CA 94306 650-846-1192 -------------- next part -------------- [Header] Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 8 630 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 [/Header] [ModuleDump] 1 1 1 1 27 2 4 3 32 3 97 0 18 4 11 0 15 5 97 0 10 7 11 0 4 8 19 0 2 9 92 1 0 10 51 2 0 11 18 2 12 12 30 0 23 13 20 1 15 14 20 2 15 15 66 1 20 16 102 2 20 17 50 3 18 18 19 3 22 19 18 3 24 20 18 2 27 21 66 0 21 22 33 0 27 23 57 0 25 6 11 0 7 24 62 2 6 25 62 1 6 26 43 1 9 27 47 3 27 28 30 3 30 29 103 3 14 30 39 1 25 [/ModuleDump] [ModuleDump] 0 [/ModuleDump] [CurrentNoteDump] 64 0 0 64 0 0 [/CurrentNoteDump] [CableDump] 1 3 4 0 0 3 0 1 0 8 2 0 7 0 1 0 8 0 0 4 0 1 0 9 2 0 8 0 1 0 10 2 0 9 2 0 2 13 1 0 1 1 1 2 14 1 0 1 1 1 2 22 0 0 1 1 1 1 9 1 0 13 0 1 1 10 0 0 13 0 1 1 13 3 0 15 0 1 0 14 0 0 11 0 1 0 16 0 0 14 1 1 0 20 0 0 16 0 0 0 18 1 0 17 2 1 0 18 2 0 17 0 1 0 19 1 0 18 0 1 0 20 1 0 16 0 1 1 21 1 0 12 0 1 1 3 1 0 21 0 1 1 5 1 0 3 1 0 1 23 0 0 22 0 1 1 3 0 0 23 0 1 3 6 0 0 5 0 1 3 7 0 0 6 0 0 0 8 1 0 6 0 1 0 11 1 0 24 0 1 0 24 0 0 10 0 1 0 11 0 0 25 0 1 0 25 0 0 9 0 1 1 24 1 0 26 0 1 1 25 1 0 26 0 1 0 27 0 0 19 0 1 0 2 1 0 27 1 1 0 2 0 0 27 0 1 1 27 1 0 28 0 1 0 17 0 0 29 0 1 0 19 0 0 17 0 0 0 29 0 0 20 0 1 1 30 0 0 1 2 1 1 15 0 0 30 0 0 1 9 0 0 30 0 1 1 10 3 0 30 0 1 [/CableDump] [CableDump] 0 [/CableDump] [ParameterDump] 1 2 4 3 127 0 0 3 97 5 64 64 1 0 26 4 11 4 64 65 0 0 5 97 5 64 64 1 0 24 6 11 4 64 64 0 0 7 11 4 64 63 0 0 8 19 3 104 127 111 9 92 7 82 23 27 6 40 1 0 10 51 10 0 0 40 78 23 0 52 1 6 0 11 18 2 0 67 12 30 1 96 13 20 6 0 85 99 20 101 0 14 20 6 1 82 107 64 98 0 15 66 5 0 44 0 127 1 16 102 11 30 1 0 55 0 53 1 64 0 27 127 17 50 3 112 12 0 18 19 3 127 110 127 19 18 2 0 104 20 18 2 0 24 21 66 5 0 127 0 44 1 22 33 2 0 0 23 57 2 2 0 24 62 2 20 0 25 62 2 30 0 26 43 2 74 1 27 47 2 26 64 28 30 1 32 29 103 5 48 50 67 0 127 30 39 1 45 [/ParameterDump] [ParameterDump] 0 [/ParameterDump] [MorphMapDump] 81 0 0 0 1 3 3 0 18 1 4 0 0 0 1 4 1 0 11 1 7 0 0 0 1 7 1 0 -3 [/MorphMapDump] [KnobMapDump] 1 9 0 0 1 9 2 1 1 10 3 3 1 10 6 4 1 11 1 5 1 13 1 7 1 13 2 10 1 13 3 13 1 13 4 16 1 14 1 8 1 14 2 11 1 14 3 14 1 14 4 17 1 15 1 2 1 19 1 9 1 20 1 6 1 26 0 12 2 1 0 15 [/KnobMapDump] [CtrlMapDump] 1 21 3 1 [/CtrlMapDump] [CustomDump] 1 3 1 0 4 1 0 5 1 0 6 1 0 7 1 0 9 1 0 10 1 0 12 1 1 17 1 0 28 1 1 [/CustomDump] [CustomDump] 0 [/CustomDump] [NameDump] 1 1 Keyboard1 2 Dave Peck 3 MasterOsc1 4 OscSlvC1 5 MasterOsc2 6 OscSlvC2 7 OscSlvC3 8 Mixer1 9 KN 1 2 10 KN 4 5 11 FilterMix=KN6 12 LFOSlvE1 13 8 11 14 17 14 9 12 15 18 15 EG Amt=KN3 16 Phaser1 17 FilterC1 18 Mixer2 19 Warmth=KN10 20 Phaser=KN7 21 MOD WHEEL 22 ClkRndGen1 23 InvLevShift1 24 Overdrive1 25 Overdrive2 26 DRIVE=KN13 27 Pan1 28 LFOSlvE2 29 EqMid1 30 Vel Smoother [/NameDump] [NameDump] 0 [/NameDump] From dave at 22host24.com Tue Feb 4 14:33:21 2003 From: dave at 22host24.com (dave) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] a pleasent patch References: <000d01c2cc3c$758b4240$02fea8c0@soloman> <3E3FE6E0.9060806@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: <001601c2cc9d$6c0146f0$02fea8c0@soloman> briggs is the one cheers ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wout Blommers" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 4:14 PM Subject: Re: [NM] a pleasent patch > dave wrote: > > Sort of like a harpsichord or something. pleasent with some fizz and > > movement. my first contribution. > > d > > Hi Dave, > > Do you have a family name? > There is already a 'Dave' in the Archive and if this is your first > contribution, you are not the same person, so how do you want to be > known in the Archive? > > Wout > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Tue Feb 4 14:39:53 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano In-Reply-To: References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6> <183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> <111373217077.20030203141456@yefrewenchi.com> <32963.207.172.28.2.1044314148.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> <44379932023.20030203160651@yefrewenchi.com> <17386.207.172.28.2.1044319901.squirrel@www.doubtfulpalace.com> <156405707085.20030203231626@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <40461113776.20030204143953@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/4/2003 Tim Walters wrote: >>OK ... as far as I can see the differences between your position and >>mine reduce to this ... when you hear a different tuning or a whole >>different set of choices to make music with, then it's immediately >>"different" and unlike everything else in Western music. > That certainly isn't what I meant to say! I would put it more like this: > People (like the writer of the article) usually assume that > "microtonality" implies "non-Western" scales, : Aaaah!! That makes complete sense now!! I can see where you are coming from. To put things in perspective, a couple of weeks ago that same writer (Merope Mills) had an article in about the clothes and behaviour and lifestyles of "celebrity daughters" (people like Bianca Jagger et al). So if we're lucky, next week we'll get a whole article on the favourite microtonal scales of those self-same dudettes. Now wouldn't THAT be nice!!! > --there are strong Western microtonal traditions, both ancient and modern; I was certainly aware of that and didn't mean to imply otherwise. > --if you want to have both microtonality *and* harmony in your music, > it's quite possible, and there are plenty of models to learn from. OK ... well ... my question is more along the lines of "if people REALLY want to be different, why don't they try microtonal AND non-harmonic?" There's a whole not-necessarily-all-harmonic-but-still-exciting world out there waiting to be discovered. > Harry Partch has always sounded totally American to me--while > simultaneously sounding like no-one else--and I believe that's how he > would like it. Absolutely absolutely absolutely. Sounding exactly like yourself and like no-one else is the very hardest thing in life, microtonal or not. A couple of years ago there was a bit of a fashion in Ethiopian pop music for somehow sounding like a Japanese version of Britney Spears on steroids. Can't remember the names of the three ladies concerned. The sound was so horrible that I think I've just blanked it out. Just because it's microtonal doesn't immediately mean it's "good". (Except I guess I should be more charitable for times are so very hard in Ethiopia right now that I guess even an imitation Britney Spears has the capacity to make life easier). > (Ditto Charles Ives, another microtonalist.) Yes. > I don't have any problem with the idea that "chords" make music sound > Western, regardless of tuning. That's kind of all I was saying, actually ... and I couldn't quite grasp what was so "outrageous" (right word?) about the idea. > I understand that to an Indian > classical musician, the entire Western symphonic repertoire sounds > like either funeral marches or nursery rhymes. LOL!!!! > Using mean-tone tuning > won't change that! Nope. > I would add, though, that playing anything on a > piano, bent strings or no, will also make it sound Western, even if > it's Peking Opera. Yes. The piano is a distinctively Western instrument. It pretty much defines how the West approaches music. People do try very hard, though, to make it sound otherwise. > I don't think we have any actual disagreement. Non-disagreement agreement agreed to! > We're just emphasizing > different things. Yes. I wish that piano good luck, but I don't think it's going to change anything ... although I would very much enjoy being wrong. Nice to speak to you again! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Tue Feb 4 17:28:41 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <012101c2cc53$f7cf6030$66c188d9@TWISTIE> Message-ID: > Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning > experiences > > > > You have a point in that sonic signature is definetly important. You could > argue also that being a good craftmen, you could turn any patch into yours > by adding your own flavoring into it .. but this takes the same learning > curve as being able to write patch per se.. > Aah well, it takes as long to make a patch as it takes to figure out someone elses. Making the patch oneself has the big advantage that from the start there is some notion about what the patch should do. Finding a patch that does just that is very time consuming, simply because what is needed might be in the patch but only after some serious tweaking. And to be honest, I have difficulty tweaking someone elses patches, mainly because I don't know where to begin. Most patches don't exactly look like the old familiar prepatched monosynths from way back. > > In fact if you are clever enough, you should be able to stick just 6 > patches > > in your synth, and use no more- ie writing *songs* using those signature > > sounds. Everybody (I hope) can spot kraftwerk or Mouse on Mars or Aphex > > Twin etc a mile off because they rely on a set of sounds which become > their > > signature sound (also too is the style that they PLAY those sounds in > too). I > > think this is waay more important than clambering over everybody else > hoping > > to find new sounds altogether. > I can't even remember what I put in one of my own NM patches a couple of months ago. But that has much to do with the nature of the NM, it is so easy to put in a few extra things and then some more and then some more, save it on disk and forget about all the why's. I was brought up to painstakingly draw patchsheets on paper, it now seems such a relief not having to do that anymore. But it is very illusionary, as making paper patchsheets makes one very familiar with a patch, much more than simply clicking save. I remember having maybe five or six patches and using them all the time, on the NM I must have made hundreds, perhaps using the same five or six techniques but in a myriad of variations. It is quite hard to keep track, or more honest: I must confess I lost track completely. But what the heck if one can make a new NM patch in a jiffy. ;-)) > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com Tue Feb 4 19:20:44 2003 From: theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com (Theo.:.) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hey Joker Since your email I tested what you said (as I still edit most of my patches on my desktop which runs under nine) Yeah I had the same problem. I had only really tested it loading and editing but not saving which of course is pretty esential. The only suggestion is that you save the patches directly into the modular, which works. As for the ctr click I think that might have to do with the fact that OS X uses the right click feature of the mouse (like a pc) and it might be causing a 9 / x conflict. Sorry to get everyones hopes up. I have bombarded Clavia with emails regarding the lack of OS X support, as I am sure have many others. The US distributer says that the reaction to the dropping of V 4 was overwealming and he thinks that there will be a serious X port of the software (whether v 4 or not) pretty soon. Theo > Hi Theo, > > Did this really work for you? How? I did the same and I can use the > editor to edit patches, but as soon as I want to save a file, the > editor crashes Classic. I was quite exited first, when I was able to > edit patches under OS X, but this is unusable. > > With the OS X version of the editor I found the following bugs so far: > > Clicking on a random button (sequencer modules) sets them to the lowest > possible value > > Never use ctrl-click on a module (for rename or delete), you?ll crash > about 5 seconds later. Using backspace for deleting works though. > > When double-clicking on a .pch file to open it in the editor, you can?t > access the menu bar any more to select modules. Using the open dialog > works though. > > Quite disapointing.... > > I?m using a Ghz Titanium with a Midisport 2x2 > > >> SO I booted up into OS 9 >> using start up disk in system preferences and installed it as you >> would in 9 >> with the drivers for the midisport. Once OMS is set up in 9 (has to be >> in >> the version of 9 that OS X uses for Classic) and it detects your midi >> interface etc. Just go back into X and launch the modular editior in >> classic. Now in the midi setup it should detect your oms midi >> settings. >> >> This will only work in 10.2.3 as it allows you to use OMS for older >> classic >> apps. >> >> > all the best, > > Joker > From cancelgretl at hotmail.com Wed Feb 5 00:12:15 2003 From: cancelgretl at hotmail.com (Cancel Gretl) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: [OT] speech (not for mac) References: <000c01c2cc60$11ae0860$02fea8c0@soloman> Message-ID: mbrola is the best text>speech there is for realistic emulation, in my opinion. (unfortunately, it's not for mac) if you enjoy emulating humans in german or english, you're in luck. (those two in my opinion were the best accent libraries existing). i don't know if they are still available. it's painstaking w/the interface, but worth the trials. once you get the gist of the pitch ramping/speed, vowel combos, etc. you can get frighteningly close to human vocal inflection. ----- Original Message ----- From: dave To: Nord Modular Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 9:14 AM Subject: [NM] mac speech Hi there I would like to do some speeck and singing on my mac (osx) a la aphex t and cylog etc. Is there a nice gui or do i have to use applescript etc. I know I can highlight text and get it to speak that , but Im sure oin os 9 there was an inbuilt app that had all the controls in one window... cheers dave ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Nord-Modular mailing list Nord-Modular@code404.com http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular _______________________________________________ Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list may not be redistributed without the express consent of the author/creator. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030205/c77b384c/attachment.htm From john at johntennant.com Wed Feb 5 01:22:42 2003 From: john at johntennant.com (John Tennant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:00 2004 Subject: [NM] Newbie Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, my name is John and I just joined the list. I'm a fairly new professional tech-house/progressive house producer in Vancouver, Canada. Sorry if this is a dumb question. I've looked around a lot and I haven't been able to answer this one by myself. I was hoping to program a 'filter-delay' style 'line-in' patch. But I can't figure out which object to use to delay my external signal by higher values (ie 2.5 seconds). Anyone have any advice or is this just not possible? Again, sorry if it's a dumb question. John -- http://www.johntennant.com From SBLAK1SC at stokecoll.ac.uk Wed Feb 5 01:28:56 2003 From: SBLAK1SC at stokecoll.ac.uk (Blakemore, Steven) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Newbie Question Message-ID: > I can't figure out which object to use to delay my external signal by higher values (ie 2.5 seconds). Anyone have any advice or is this just not possible? Again, sorry if it's a dumb question. S'alright John. Everyone on this list was a beginner once. I'm afraid that the dealy lengths you are after can't be done on the NM. The dealy modules are really good for millisecond sized delays and can produce really nice physical modelling effects, but that's about it. DISCLAIMER : This message and any attachments are confidential. The information contained herein may only be used for the intended purpose and by the intended recipient. The message and attachments have been swept for the presence of computer viruses. In the light of the growing number and complexity of such viruses the College strongly recommends further checking before any attachments are opened. The College accepts no liability whatsoever for any loss or damage caused by viruses attached to these documents. If this e-mail has come to you in error please delete it and any attachments. From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 01:42:05 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <20.91d6a7e.2b72366d@aol.com> In a message dated 5/2/03 1:31:05 am, rhordijk@xs4all.nl writes: >I can't even remember what I put in one of my own NM patches a couple of > >months ago. But that has much to do with the nature of the NM, That's alright Rob- You ARE the *DADDY* patcher!!!! _ referring to an earlier part of this thread, I too find it easier to record stuff straight in (especially long changing drones and ryhthms created on my MicroMod coupled to my ER-1, RY30, or MPC2000, then cut them up in the audio window and arrange page- But I still use midi a lot- especially for melody/ not so much for drums etc.) Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 01:46:19 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> In a message dated 4/2/03 3:13:17 pm, eggy@eggytoast.com writes: >Well, using a sampler and a midi sequencer gives you pretty much the >same flexibility, if not more, as you don't need to modify the actual >audio in order to work. I must say that I've thought very hard about replacing my Emu E4 with an internal VST sampler, but the Emu is just sooo much more powerful than Logic's EXS24- and the converters have so much more weight too. Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 01:57:53 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <162.1b4578f4.2b723a21@aol.com> In a message dated 4/2/03 1:47:43 pm, nostromo@arkaos.net writes: >You have a point in that sonic signature is definetly important. A good case in example would be the music of Mike Paradinas (aka u-ziq), who, in the early days used just a Roland D50, a Yamaha DX11, and an Alesis HR16 coupled to an Atari. Mike P. always insisted that he couldn't be bothered to experiment with getting new sounds, preferring to use the internal presets (abusing them too with lots of distortion to get different sounds- a bit like a guitarist would). So hence, although all his songs sounded very different in their structure, the sounds used were pretty much the same across the board- making him instantly reconisable (especially in his drum programming- which would be distorted to death, creating all kinds of wonderful harmonics. If there is anyone who hasn't heard his music here- although I'm pretty sure a lot of people have, I can highly recommend listening to "Tango 'n' Vectif" and "Bluff Limbo"- both available on Rephlex records.) Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 02:05:48 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech Message-ID: <1d1.1adaac7.2b723bfc@aol.com> In a message dated 4/2/03 3:06:37 pm, dave@22host24.com writes: >I would like to do some speeck and singing on my mac (osx) a la aphex t >and cylog etc. Is there a nice gui or do i have to use applescript etc. >I know I can highlight text and get it to speak that , but Im sure oin >os 9 there was an inbuilt app that had all the controls in one window... Hi Dave! The program you may be referring to, is actually created on the Commodore 64. Although you can get an excellent emulator for both Mac and PC that'll do the job just as well (well that's what Aphex used in the early days). Too, as mentioned before, is the speech synthesizer in Simpletext on the Mac (as used by Cylob on 'rewind' etc.), which is more like Dr Stephen Hawkin getting down on the dancefloor!!! In fact there is a whole site somewhere on the web dedicated to rappin' Stevie H! ;) The C64 is alot more electro btw (just listen to Caustic Window or Polygon window by Aphex) my 2 cents worth! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 02:22:23 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: [OT] speech (not for mac) Message-ID: <1d1.1adaace.2b723fdf@aol.com> In a message dated 5/2/03 10:15:59 am, cancelgretl@hotmail.com writes: >mbrola is the best text>speech there is for realistic emulation, in my >opinion. (unfortunately, it's not for mac) if you enjoy emulating humans >in german or english, you're in luck. (those two in my opinion were the >best accent libraries existing). i don't know if they are still available. > it's painstaking w/the interface, but worth the trials. > > Alternatively, you could go the hardware route and find a Boss VT-1, which has a robot setting and of course all those crazy voice transformation settings which allow you sound like a young child on acid!!! (It's not cheap however :( From disjunction at couchblip.com Wed Feb 5 05:15:14 2003 From: disjunction at couchblip.com (7uke) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] [OT]Please share your sampler programming learning experiences References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> Message-ID: <006601c2cd18$9eb0a0c0$0300000a@analogue> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 8:46 PM Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > > In a message dated 4/2/03 3:13:17 pm, eggy@eggytoast.com writes: > > >Well, using a sampler and a midi sequencer gives you pretty much the > >same flexibility, if not more, as you don't need to modify the actual > >audio in order to work. > > I must say that I've thought very hard about replacing my Emu E4 with an > internal VST sampler, but the Emu is just sooo much more powerful than > Logic's EXS24- and the converters have so much more weight too. > > Tom :-) I'm in a Similar situation to Tom I think about the convienience of software sampling a lot, but have yet to find the reliability, Sound quality and Flexibility of E-mu's chords in a Softo yet. To me Kontakt has good features, Halion Sounds good, but neither has great sound and features of that chunk of metal sitting here in the Rack. E-mu has been rumoured to be releasing E5 soft sampler with a USB interface to the Ultra series in the EOS range......But at NAMM the rumours became that E-mu would be releasing E5 as a PCI card. which would thwart my plans to go to a Notebook for sampling regards 7uke From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 06:58:29 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Newbie Question Message-ID: <63.17e53545.2b728095@aol.com> In a message dated 5/2/03 12:26:38 pm, SBLAK1SC@stokecoll.ac.uk writes: >I'm afraid that the dealy lengths you are after can't be done on the NM. >The > >dealy modules are really good for millisecond sized delays and can produce > >really nice physical modelling effects, but that's about it. > > You can also get quite mad squarepusher type comb-filter fx too- but alas, as Steven says, you can't get greater delays than that. BUT, you can always patch in an external echo pedal (and anything else for that matter) and route it back into the NM for further processing- which can yield some xtra-crazy results;) have fun! Tom :-) From john at johntennant.com Wed Feb 5 07:16:43 2003 From: john at johntennant.com (John Tennant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Newbie Question In-Reply-To: <63.17e53545.2b728095@aol.com> Message-ID: Okay, this is what I suspected. Thanks for the help guys--quick too! :) John On 2/5/03 6:58 AM, "Terryfunken@aol.com" wrote: > > In a message dated 5/2/03 12:26:38 pm, SBLAK1SC@stokecoll.ac.uk writes: > >> I'm afraid that the dealy lengths you are after can't be done on the NM. >> The >> >> dealy modules are really good for millisecond sized delays and can produce >> >> really nice physical modelling effects, but that's about it. >> >> > You can also get quite mad squarepusher type comb-filter fx too- but alas, as > Steven says, you can't get greater delays than that. BUT, you can always > patch in an external echo pedal (and anything else for that matter) and route > it back into the NM for further processing- which can yield some xtra-crazy > results;) > > have fun! > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From valis at ucla.edu Wed Feb 5 08:25:29 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: [OT] speech (not for mac) In-Reply-To: <1d1.1adaace.2b723fdf@aol.com> References: <1d1.1adaace.2b723fdf@aol.com> Message-ID: <1044462329.3e413af950867@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting Terryfunken@aol.com: > Alternatively, you could go the hardware route and find a Boss VT-1, > which > has a robot setting and of course all those crazy voice transformation > settings which allow you sound like a young child on acid!!! (It's not > cheap > however :( Ahhh, yes, the VT1!! I did sound design for a production of "Hamletmachine" and they had a pretty big budget and sent me out to by vocal effects processors - One thing I picked up was the VT1 (it was fairly new then) and loved it - I locked myself in the studio all night playing with that thing. It just kills me that there is actually a button called "Robot". Been a while since I've played w/ one, but the NM is the first thing I've come across that comes close to sounding like it... :) vV From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 09:58:12 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: [OT] speech (not for mac) Message-ID: <1df.13174d1.2b72aab4@aol.com> In a message dated 5/2/03 4:26:10 pm, valis@ucla.edu writes: >I locked myself in the studio all night playing > >with that thing. It just kills me that there is actually a button > >called "Robot". Been a while since I've played w/ one, but the NM is the > > >first thing I've come across that comes close to sounding like it... :) > > I know Kees or JJ did a frequency shifter, but has anyone tried to make a VT-1 patch?- That would be f*****g fantastic!!! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 5 10:26:17 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:01 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: [OT] speech (not for mac) Message-ID: <3b.32f9d0be.2b72b149@aol.com> In a message dated 5/2/03 5:59:20 pm, Terryfunken@aol.com writes: >I know Kees or JJ did a frequency shifter, but has anyone tried to make >a >VT-1 patch?- That would be f*****g fantastic!!! > >Tom :-) Ahhh- answering to my own mails- next i'll be looking for hairs on my palms hehehe ;) Dosen't it feel a bit of an insult to the Nord, looking for a computer speech emulator, ( now its also been done to death- Dr Hawky etc that is;)- Howabout a contest to see if we can come up with the craziest voice box for our beloved red monsters??? anyone?- It dosen't have to be totally original patching (ie borrowing from other ideas/ patches), but of course if anyone DOES come up with an original patch, he or she will be made the voice box king/queen !!!? PS whoever came up with that "Dutch to Swedish" (I think it was that man Kees again?;)- well lets say that turned me into a jibbering wreck- a bit like being on 'the dentist's laughing gas" hehe. Tom :-) From valis at ucla.edu Wed Feb 5 10:38:09 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: [OT] speech (not for mac) In-Reply-To: <3b.32f9d0be.2b72b149@aol.com> References: <3b.32f9d0be.2b72b149@aol.com> Message-ID: <1044470289.3e415a113d67d@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting Terryfunken@aol.com: > Howabout > a contest to see if we can come up with the craziest voice box for our > beloved red monsters??? > > anyone?- It dosen't have to be totally original patching (ie borrowing > from > other ideas/ patches), but of course if anyone DOES come up with an > original > patch, he or she will be made the voice box king/queen !!!? Hmmmm - sounds like fun... Maybe I will give it a whirl. I haven't yet gotten much into making vocal processing patches, I think I may mess around with this a bit. vV From dpeck at euphonix.com Wed Feb 5 11:47:30 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] Today's patch Message-ID: <000901c2cd4f$6af97900$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi all, Here's one I did last night. It does sort of a wavetable-ish effect by combining different sweep effects at the oscillator level (wavewrapped sine, FM sweep sine, & PWM sweep), then sends them through a wide resonant notch filter (a pair of 12dB filters). Then LPFs with a crossfader for filter flavoring, and another crossfader for pre/post LPF mix, then a final filter to add slow tone decay to the whole shebang. Play with knob 13 to control the overal sweep amount. Cool on the low notes. Enjoy! Dave Peck Euphonix, Inc. 220 Portage Ave. Palo Alto, CA 94306 650-846-1192 -------------- next part -------------- [Header] Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 8 600 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 [/Header] [ModuleDump] 1 1 1 1 33 2 4 3 32 3 97 0 19 4 13 0 16 5 74 0 13 6 84 1 30 8 83 1 28 9 10 0 10 10 19 0 1 11 13 0 3 12 44 0 8 13 19 0 6 7 49 1 1 14 19 1 11 16 66 1 24 17 49 1 6 18 49 2 6 19 19 2 4 20 51 3 5 21 18 2 20 22 20 2 24 23 20 3 24 15 18 2 15 24 30 0 33 25 20 0 24 26 70 0 29 27 66 0 22 28 38 0 31 29 66 2 30 30 47 3 29 31 30 2 33 33 49 3 15 32 84 3 20 [/ModuleDump] [ModuleDump] 0 [/ModuleDump] [CurrentNoteDump] 64 0 0 64 0 0 [/CurrentNoteDump] [CableDump] 1 3 4 0 0 3 0 1 3 9 0 0 4 0 0 3 11 0 0 9 0 0 0 5 0 0 4 0 1 0 12 1 0 5 0 0 0 13 1 0 12 1 0 1 8 0 0 6 0 1 1 5 1 0 8 0 1 1 9 1 0 5 1 0 1 12 0 0 9 1 0 1 16 1 0 8 0 1 0 10 1 0 9 0 1 0 10 0 0 5 0 1 0 10 2 0 11 0 1 0 13 2 0 12 0 1 0 11 1 0 13 0 1 0 14 1 0 7 0 1 0 7 1 0 10 0 1 0 17 1 0 7 1 0 0 14 0 0 10 0 1 0 14 2 0 17 2 1 1 17 0 0 16 0 1 1 7 0 0 17 0 0 0 19 0 0 14 0 1 0 20 2 0 14 0 1 0 21 0 0 14 0 1 2 6 0 0 1 1 1 2 28 0 0 6 0 0 2 22 1 0 1 1 1 2 23 1 0 22 1 0 2 32 0 0 23 1 0 0 18 1 0 19 0 1 0 19 2 0 18 2 1 0 15 0 0 18 2 1 0 15 1 0 20 0 1 0 21 1 0 15 0 1 1 20 0 0 22 0 1 1 18 0 0 22 0 1 1 25 0 0 24 0 1 1 27 1 0 25 1 1 1 3 1 0 27 0 1 2 26 0 0 28 0 1 2 25 1 0 26 0 1 1 29 1 0 1 2 1 1 23 3 0 29 1 0 1 22 3 0 29 0 1 0 30 0 0 23 1 1 0 2 0 0 30 0 1 0 2 1 0 30 1 1 1 30 1 0 31 0 1 0 33 1 0 21 0 1 0 23 0 0 33 2 1 1 33 0 0 32 0 1 [/CableDump] [CableDump] 0 [/CableDump] [ParameterDump] 1 2 4 3 127 0 0 3 97 5 64 64 1 0 25 4 13 4 64 64 0 0 5 74 2 0 4 6 84 3 0 109 0 7 49 4 127 0 111 0 8 83 1 1 9 10 5 64 62 0 1 0 10 19 3 127 110 104 11 13 4 71 65 106 0 12 44 1 0 13 19 3 127 65 0 14 19 3 97 127 127 15 18 2 0 64 16 66 5 0 127 1 127 0 17 49 4 109 0 111 0 18 49 4 68 32 12 90 19 19 3 116 127 88 20 51 10 0 1 90 52 32 0 74 1 0 0 21 18 2 0 107 22 20 6 0 89 107 32 105 0 23 20 6 0 66 111 64 99 0 24 30 1 99 25 20 6 1 93 77 127 0 0 27 66 5 0 127 0 68 1 28 38 1 58 29 66 5 0 127 0 115 1 30 47 2 28 64 31 30 1 38 32 84 3 0 115 0 33 49 4 89 32 0 83 [/ParameterDump] [ParameterDump] 0 [/ParameterDump] [MorphMapDump] 22 127 0 0 1 5 0 1 96 1 7 3 1 80 1 9 0 0 0 1 9 1 0 -13 1 9 3 1 63 1 13 2 1 109 1 17 3 1 80 [/MorphMapDump] [KnobMapDump] 1 6 1 15 1 15 1 0 1 18 0 1 1 18 2 2 1 20 3 4 1 20 6 5 1 21 1 3 1 22 1 7 1 22 2 10 1 22 3 13 1 22 4 16 1 23 1 8 1 23 2 11 1 23 3 14 1 23 4 17 1 29 3 6 2 1 0 9 2 1 1 12 [/KnobMapDump] [CtrlMapDump] 1 27 3 1 [/CtrlMapDump] [CustomDump] 1 3 1 0 4 1 0 7 1 0 9 1 0 11 1 0 17 1 0 18 1 0 20 1 0 24 1 1 31 1 1 33 1 0 [/CustomDump] [CustomDump] 0 [/CustomDump] [NameDump] 1 1 Keyboard1 2 Dave Peck 3 MasterOsc1 4 WRAP SINE 5 WaveWrap1 6 SWEEP=KN16 7 Wide... 8 Linear decay 9 PWM OSC 10 Mixer1 11 FM SINE 12 GainControl1 13 Mixer2 14 Notch mix 15 Filter D/E=KN1 16 Invert sweep 17 ...Notch 18 fc/res=KN2/3 19 Mixer4 20 fc/res=KN5/6 21 Pre/post=KN4 22 8 11 14 17 23 9 12 15 18 24 LFOSlvE1 25 Vibrato delay 26 LogicInv1 27 Mod Wheel 28 Pulse1 29 EG AMT=KN7 30 Pan1 31 LFOSlvE2 32 AD-Env1 33 Final filter [/NameDump] [NameDump] 0 [/NameDump] From ClkDiv at yahoo.de Wed Feb 5 13:06:01 2003 From: ClkDiv at yahoo.de (Suer Stroemling) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] Dirt In The House Message-ID: <000801c2cd5a$6605c4c0$6e32fcc3@micky> UffDaUffDaUffDaUffDa! I like it!!!!!!!!!!!! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: DirtInTheHouse.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3412 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030205/9aaa39d2/DirtInTheHouse.obj From joker at netcologne.de Wed Feb 5 16:43:36 2003 From: joker at netcologne.de (Joker) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <06F2A37C-396C-11D7-BD5C-000393DBB2AA@netcologne.de> Hi Theo > suggestion is that you save the patches directly into the modular, > which > works. As for the ctr click I think that might have to do with the > fact > that OS X uses the right click feature of the mouse (like a pc) and it > might > be causing a 9 / x conflict. Sorry, I haven?t pointed it out clear enough. The bugs I described ocur with the OS X beta version of the editor. The only flaw of the good old OS 9 version (running OMS with a Midisport 2x2 in Classic mode) is that you simply can?t save patches. Looks like we have to use the OS 9 version to edit and save to the modular and use the OS X version to read back the edits to the comp, oh well . . . > Sorry to get everyones hopes up. I have bombarded Clavia with emails > regarding the lack of OS X support, as I am sure have many others. > The US distributer says that the reaction to the dropping of V 4 was > overwealming and he thinks that there will be a serious X port of the > software (whether v 4 or not) pretty soon. I pray for that !! all the best, Joker ------------------ www.klangbureau.de ------------------ From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 5 18:11:18 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > >The US distributer says that the reaction to the dropping of V 4 was >overwealming and he thinks that there will be a serious X port of the >software (whether v 4 or not) pretty soon. that'd be nice, but really? From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 5 18:15:11 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <06F2A37C-396C-11D7-BD5C-000393DBB2AA@netcologne.de> References: <06F2A37C-396C-11D7-BD5C-000393DBB2AA@netcologne.de> Message-ID: >> >Sorry, I haven?t pointed it out clear enough. The bugs I described >ocur with the OS X beta version of the editor. where? i d beta that sorry, i did a quik peek around and saw nothing of the sort From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 5 18:18:37 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] mac speech In-Reply-To: <1044377523.3e3fefb403b4b@mail.ucla.edu> References: <000c01c2cc60$11ae0860$02fea8c0@soloman> <1044377523.3e3fefb403b4b@mail.ucla.edu> Message-ID: >Quoting dave : > >> Hi there >> >> I would like to do some speeck and singing on my mac (osx) a la aphex t >> and cylog etc. Is there a nice gui or do i have to use applescript etc. I >> know I can highlight text and get it to speak that , but Im sure oin os 9 >> there was an inbuilt app that had all the controls in one window... >> cheers >> dave > >I'm not sure what you are looking for... there is the "speech" control >panel, where you can change the voices and stuff, but that's all I know of. there is an app that you can input the text midi editor styles, and the text above that, yes can t remmeber teh price. twas shareware i think. crippled, though search should find -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030205/695ff68d/attachment.htm From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 5 18:28:21 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <00c501c2cc39$f446d480$66c188d9@TWISTIE> References: <00c501c2cc39$f446d480$66c188d9@TWISTIE> Message-ID: > > Yes, it's fairly simple. I stopped caring what other people were doing >> and focused on my own projects and expanding my own knowledge. > >Yeah, but isn't your knowledge based on other people's work. There's find the allen strange book. http://www.brainwashed.com/mumma/forward.html From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 5 18:47:42 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> Message-ID: > >I must say that I've thought very hard about replacing my Emu E4 with an >internal VST sampler, but the Emu is just sooo much more powerful than >Logic's EXS24- and the converters have so much more weight too. get good convertors for the puter then. i do know the emu sounds nice nice nice From mothra666 at sbcglobal.net Wed Feb 5 20:51:54 2003 From: mothra666 at sbcglobal.net (Mothra) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: That?s because Clavia dropped development on it. > > sorry, i did a quik peek around and saw nothing of the sort > -- Chris http://www.towelhead.net http://www.mp3.com/stemcellvirus http://www.mp3.com/towelhead From resonance at rpsx.nu Thu Feb 6 00:25:17 2003 From: resonance at rpsx.nu (paul seymour) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:02 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <20030205200020.ED3ACA0@roland.code404.com> Message-ID: <85DDA1DD-39AC-11D7-BC3B-0003939EFF7E@rpsx.nu> about the 3.03 osx editor that's floating around: anyone notice the date created and date modified? dated modified march 4th, 2002! so, they were discovering problems with the osx editor a year ago, and just blew it off? then, almost a year later, never got around to doing it right and decided they could just forget about it with their non-commitment statement. at least that's one interpretation of it. quite sad, i'd say, if true. but then again, maybe some brave soul at clavia leaked it out in the first place, to try to make peace with us osx users. even if it's buggy, it's better then nothing! thanks robin hood! From roland.kuit at 12move.nl Thu Feb 6 00:30:56 2003 From: roland.kuit at 12move.nl (Roland Kuit) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] drums References: <06F2A37C-396C-11D7-BD5C-000393DBB2AA@netcologne.de> Message-ID: <000701c2cdba$137d8700$f3b8f1c3@sh927953> Greets, Roland -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Boem boem Boink.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 6780 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030206/48a6cdba/BoemboemBoink.obj From Terryfunken at aol.com Thu Feb 6 01:58:08 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: In a message dated 6/2/03 8:27:34 am, resonance@rpsx.nu writes: >but then again, maybe some brave soul at clavia leaked it out in the >first place, to try to make peace with us osx users. even if it's >buggy, it's better then nothing! thanks robin hood! > That's not making peace, it's just making matters worse. Leaking out something which dosen't work properly just to help satisfy a few owners of the most advanced, up to date OS in ages, is a disgrace. I'd say this would be an excellent business incentive too for Clavia, because we eventually get so pissed off with the lack of a stable working environment, that we would be quite happy to pay the ridiculous costs Clavia charge for a new product when it eventually arrives. (Yes I've changed my tune- but then I'm on war-path of upgrading to OSX). There is no such person as Robin Hood- he dosen't exist. Tom :-) From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 6 02:28:57 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? References: Message-ID: <3E4238E9.7040705@wanadoo.nl> Terryfunken@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/2/03 8:27:34 am, resonance@rpsx.nu writes: >>but then again, maybe some brave soul at clavia leaked it out in the >>first place, to try to make peace with us osx users. even if it's >>buggy, it's better then nothing! thanks robin hood! > That's not making peace, it's just making matters worse. Leaking out > something which dosen't work properly just to help satisfy a few owners of > the most advanced, up to date OS in ages, is a disgrace. > I'd say this would be an excellent business incentive too for Clavia, because > we eventually get so pissed off with the lack of a stable working > environment, that we would be quite happy to pay the ridiculous costs Clavia > charge for a new product when it eventually arrives. (Yes I've changed my > tune- but then I'm on war-path of upgrading to OSX). There is no such person > as Robin Hood- he dosen't exist. Clavia didn't leak the OSX beta version. Some American beta tester did and another 'Robin' spread the thing around. But honestly... Just finished a thread on the NordList which was about how bad Clavia is behaving its customers, 'cause they didn't reply an e-mail. Sometimes I'm thinking about that little boy who wants to run away from home 'cause it will hurt his parents: "Then they'll feel sorry they didn't give me the things I wanted..." Just cynical, I know... My bad habit... Wout From lennart at regebro.nu Thu Feb 6 02:05:53 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? References: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> <193365340872.20030203120340@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <019901c2cdca$5e5c7280$9002a8c0@in.nuxeo.com> From: "Friday's Child" > Well ... surely the most striking thing about that article is the relative > ignorance of developments in the field displayed by Merope Mills who > wrote it. The principal thing the article ignores is that the piano was > not invented out of the blue. [...] Man.... you know too much. :-) Very interesting lecture. From lennart at regebro.nu Thu Feb 6 02:05:49 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? References: <1e3.e7fc06.2b6eafcb@aol.com> Message-ID: <019801c2cdca$5e1ad5a0$9002a8c0@in.nuxeo.com> From: > There was quite an interesting piece in yesterday's "Guardian" newspaper > which I think some people might find interesting (especially all you > pianist's out there! > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,886739,00.html I'm 99.99% sure that this will never take off. It will most likely be hugely expensive (or hard to use), and it's only interesting for people making experimental music. The non-western scales discussed are more easily done with the non-western instruments. :-) From lennart at regebro.nu Thu Feb 6 02:26:39 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: piano References: <1e9.d208f6.2b6f8e51@aol.com><005601c2cb86$8fb73540$2fdcff3e@u4t7d6><183364653904.20030203115213@yefrewenchi.com> <002201c2cbc4$44080500$68dcff3e@u4t7d6> Message-ID: <019a01c2cdca$5ea8bdc0$9002a8c0@in.nuxeo.com> From: "steve.scrambled" > Not saying it _should_. Just wondering if there is some form of harmony that > can be said to apply in a microtonal situation, which I think is releveant > when discussing the usefulness or otherwise of the piano that the article > describes. Well, if you mean "harmony" in the original use of the word, then no, not really. That Harmony is based on certain pitch-intervals being "harmonic". Typically that means that the pitches have certain fixed ratios, like 2/3, 3/5 and such. When you end up with 37/136 it just doesn't harmonize very much anymore. :-) But when it comes to using the word "harmony" as it's often used in music, then it's just a matter of having more than one note. Such harmonies can of course be very "unharmonic". :-) This can of course be explored with microtonal music, but you don't need microtonal music to do it. For example, the tritone (six halftones) was long seen as very unharmonic, and it surely sounds much less "nice" than the more normal harmonies of third, fourths and fifths. This has of course long been explored as a way of adding tension and disharmony into music (at least since the late middle ages), completely without any microtonality, and even before the invention of tempered tuning. :-) From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 6 02:34:52 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? References: Message-ID: <3E423A4C.2000604@wanadoo.nl> Tom, That last mail, that cynical one, wasn't directed personally to you; more to the sentiments as a whole, lately, on the List about the support given by Clavia. I apologize at forehand, if you thought otherwise, 'cause I quoted you. Wout From Terryfunken at aol.com Thu Feb 6 03:21:52 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: In a message dated 6/2/03 10:29:59 am, blommoo@wanadoo.nl writes: >Just cynical, I know... My bad habit... > Wout, I don't think that's a bad habit:) I think you have done an admirable job on the NM@code404 archive- I mean nobody paid you for it, but it's helping Clavia to sell THEIR product, and I think it's quite rude of Clavia to treat you and all the rest of us with such disrespect as they have. Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Thu Feb 6 03:24:22 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <123.1dcb612a.2b739fe6@aol.com> In a message dated 6/2/03 10:35:31 am, blommoo@wanadoo.nl writes: >That last mail, that cynical one, >wasn't directed personally to you; more to the sentiments as a whole, >lately, on the List about the support given by Clavia. >I apologize at forehand, if you thought otherwise, 'cause I quoted you. > Wout, as I said, there was absolutely no offence taken from you. Your name is quoted in many of the NM journals- and with that, I have great respect for you :) Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Thu Feb 6 03:26:14 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] The synthesizer is finally dead? Message-ID: <1cb.1c9b9be.2b73a056@aol.com> In a message dated 6/2/03 10:30:25 am, lennart@regebro.nu writes: >I'm 99.99% sure that this will never take off. It will most likely be hugely > >expensive (or hard to use), and it's only interesting for people making > >experimental music. The non-western scales discussed are more easily done > >with the non-western instruments. :-) Dear Lennart, After Kofi enlightened me, I too share your opinion, but I still think it's a very interesting concept. Tom :-) From Jc105776 at aol.com Thu Feb 6 05:07:07 2003 From: Jc105776 at aol.com (Jc105776@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <1e5.1464ba6.2b73b7fb@aol.com> anyone know where to find this editor for os X? -d From ZakMcraken at aol.com Thu Feb 6 06:24:07 2003 From: ZakMcraken at aol.com (ZakMcraken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] help, uk garage, indian lead patches... Message-ID: <54.93ec11e.2b73ca07@aol.com> any good resy bass patches around? talking uk garage, jungle... drony indian music patches are hard to find aswell, any ideas anyone? thanks, zak. From lennart at regebro.nu Thu Feb 6 08:44:30 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> Message-ID: <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> I got a new computer at work, and I need some nice desktop background. Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures, in large resolutions and standard 4x3 size, like 1024x768? From soc at code404.com Thu Feb 6 09:16:38 2003 From: soc at code404.com (Justin Maxwell) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? In-Reply-To: <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> Message-ID: I'm blanking on his name, but an ex-listmember sent me a bunch of hi-res photos he took inside and out of his NM. I'll put them on code404 this week. On Thu, 6 Feb 2003, Lennart Regebro wrote: > I got a new computer at work, and I need some nice desktop background. > Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures, in large resolutions and > standard 4x3 size, like 1024x768? > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > -- + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.volsoc.com + + + + > compuphonic_machines_program_my_beats___________________> From ico at pruts.nl Thu Feb 6 09:27:23 2003 From: ico at pruts.nl (Ico Doornekamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? In-Reply-To: <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <20030206172723.GD2245@pruts.nl> > I got a new computer at work, and I need some nice desktop background. > Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures, in large resolutions and > standard 4x3 size, like 1024x768? I made a few 3D computer drawings some time ago, resolution up to 1400x1050. They're available on http://zevv.nl/nord/ enjoy, /Ico From dave at 22host24.com Thu Feb 6 09:42:20 2003 From: dave at 22host24.com (dave) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:03 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? References: <1e5.1464ba6.2b73b7fb@aol.com> Message-ID: <001e01c2ce07$19aebc50$02fea8c0@soloman> www.22host24.com/images/nmosxed.app.sit please dont share this url i will move it anyway ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 1:07 PM Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > anyone know where to find this editor for os X? > > -d > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From dave at 22host24.com Thu Feb 6 09:51:25 2003 From: dave at 22host24.com (dave) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? References: <1e5.1464ba6.2b73b7fb@aol.com> <001e01c2ce07$19aebc50$02fea8c0@soloman> Message-ID: <000b01c2ce08$5e9d1bd0$02fea8c0@soloman> sh*t was supposed to be a personal post.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "dave" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 5:42 PM Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > www.22host24.com/images/nmosxed.app.sit > please dont share this url > i will move it anyway > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 1:07 PM > Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > > > > anyone know where to find this editor for os X? > > > > -d > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From lennart at regebro.nu Thu Feb 6 09:46:09 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? In-Reply-To: <20030206172723.GD2245@pruts.nl> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> <20030206172723.GD2245@pruts.nl> Message-ID: <3E429F61.8080501@regebro.nu> Ico Doornekamp wrote: >>I got a new computer at work, and I need some nice desktop background. >>Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures, in large resolutions and >>standard 4x3 size, like 1024x768? > > > I made a few 3D computer drawings some time ago, resolution up to 1400x1050. > They're available on http://zevv.nl/nord/ Ah, yes, Thats what I was thinking of! Thanks! (Although I wouldn't mind seeing thos actual photos Justin have too.) :) From modular at lofi.org Thu Feb 6 10:13:53 2003 From: modular at lofi.org (Tobias Einarsson) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <3E42A5E1.1080502@lofi.org> Well.. it's nothing much, but this is the background i use on my nm-editor laptop. It's 1024x768 and in bmp-format; hence the zip-file. http://www.lofi.org/bg/nordmodular_bg.zip /Tobias Einarsson Lennart Regebro wrote: > I got a new computer at work, and I need some nice desktop background. > Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures, in large resolutions and > standard 4x3 size, like 1024x768? > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From mib303 at gmx.net Thu Feb 6 10:16:28 2003 From: mib303 at gmx.net (Michael Bruder) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com><3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> <3E42A5E1.1080502@lofi.org> Message-ID: <00e301c2ce0b$df530fc0$947ba8c0@yang> > Well.. it's nothing much, but this is the background i use on my > nm-editor laptop. It's 1024x768 and in bmp-format; hence the zip-file. > > http://www.lofi.org/bg/nordmodular_bg.zip > > /Tobias Einarsson nice one, thanks! "Mi3" From Jc105776 at aol.com Thu Feb 6 12:07:37 2003 From: Jc105776 at aol.com (Jc105776@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <11e.1dbf5b68.2b741a89@aol.com> Personally, I think since I paid my hard earned money for a now unsupported product, it's my right to get the beta for OS X, as well as all other current modular users. Just my two cents. Does anyone know what the current built of the software is? -David In a message dated 2/6/03 11:43:20 AM, dave@22host24.com writes: << sh*t was supposed to be a personal post.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "dave" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 5:42 PM Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > www.22host24.com/images/nmosxed.app.sit > please dont share this url > i will move it anyway > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 1:07 PM > Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > > > > anyone know where to find this editor for os X? > > > > -d > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. _______________________________________________ Nord-Modular mailing list Nord-Modular@code404.com http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular _______________________________________________ Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list may not be redistributed without the express consent of the author/creator. ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- Return-Path: Received: from rly-xf03.mx.aol.com (rly-xf03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.227]) by air-xf04.mail.aol.com (v90_r2.5) with ESMTP id MAILINXF44-0206124319; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 12:43:19 -0500 Received: from roland.code404.com (roland.code404.com [66.134.237.195]) by rly-xf03.mx.aol.com (v90_r1.1) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINXF39-0206124256; Thu, 06 Feb 2003 12:42:56 -0500 Received: from roland.code404.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by roland.code404.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BE669A; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:42:48 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: nord-modular@code404.com Delivered-To: nord-modular@roland.code404.com Received: from toto.jofa.co.uk (toto.jofa.co.uk [194.242.136.146]) by roland.code404.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C597F7E for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:42:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from soloman (81-86-178-205.dsl.pipex.com [81.86.178.205]) by toto.jofa.co.uk (Postfix) with SMTP id DE827D3CB for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:42:38 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <000b01c2ce08$5e9d1bd0$02fea8c0@soloman> From: "dave" To: "Nord Modular" References: <1e5.1464ba6.2b73b7fb@aol.com> <001e01c2ce07$19aebc50$02fea8c0@soloman> Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:51:25 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: nord-modular@code404.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Nord Modular List-Id: Nord Modular List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com Errors-To: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com >> From Terryfunken at aol.com Thu Feb 6 13:51:56 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <175.15f69408.2b7432fc@aol.com> In a message dated 6/2/03 8:08:38 pm, Jc105776@aol.com writes: >In a message dated 2/6/03 11:43:20 AM, dave@22host24.com writes: > ><< sh*t was supposed to be a personal post.... > LOL!! ;-) From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 6 13:58:09 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? References: <1e5.1464ba6.2b73b7fb@aol.com> <001e01c2ce07$19aebc50$02fea8c0@soloman> <000b01c2ce08$5e9d1bd0$02fea8c0@soloman> Message-ID: <3E42DA71.9050301@wanadoo.nl> dave wrote: > sh*t was supposed to be a personal post.... >>www.22host24.com/images/nmosxed.app.sit >>please dont share this url I wonder... The one which was send earlier had another File name. Wout From dpeck at euphonix.com Thu Feb 6 14:55:41 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] Synton Syrinx? (Rob?) Message-ID: <001201c2ce32$df74b6d0$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi all, I am intrigued by this synth. The three filters, and the four-way filter routing switch are good stuff. Plus the ability to modulate the filter with an audio osc. I found Rob's patch "SyntonSyrinx", but from what I could tell by cruising the net looking for info on the synth, the Synton has some capabilities that are not implemented in the NM patch. but it's hard to tell, based on the images of the front panel I've been able to find. See it here, and click on the picture of the "sound sheet" http://www.datasynthi.com/dutchsynths/syrinx/ Hey Rob (or anyone else who may have a Synton Syrinx), wanna try making a complete emulation of this thing? And aside from replicating the voice architecture, can you get a NM to sound like a Syrinx? Dave Peck Euphonix, Inc. 220 Portage Ave. Palo Alto, CA 94306 650-846-1192 From 3phase at 3phase.de Thu Feb 6 16:25:22 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <11e.1dbf5b68.2b741a89@aol.com> Message-ID: Yes, MAc support was promised and Mac support is an osx editor these days, I am pretty sure that clavia will finish it...its almost there. Its just that mac is really pressuring OSX now...my machine is from december and don?t installs 9, the new machines coming out wright now don?t even boot in 9 anymore. For people that buy a new mac now there is no mac editor for the nord anymore..at least none thats working. i hope that something is happening after frankfurt in march. On Donnerstag, Feb 6, 2003, at 21:07 Europe/Berlin, Jc105776@aol.com wrote: > Personally, I think since I paid my hard earned money for a now > unsupported > product, it's my right to get the beta for OS X, as well as all other > current > modular users. Just my two cents. Does anyone know what the current > built > of the software is? > > -David > > > In a message dated 2/6/03 11:43:20 AM, dave@22host24.com writes: > > << sh*t was supposed to be a personal post.... > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "dave" > > To: "Nord Modular" > > Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 5:42 PM > > Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > > > >> www.22host24.com/images/nmosxed.app.sit > >> please dont share this url > >> i will move it anyway > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: > >> To: > >> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 1:07 PM > >> Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > >> > >> > >>> anyone know where to find this editor for os X? > >>> > >>> -d > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Nord-Modular mailing list > >>> Nord-Modular@code404.com > >>> http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > >>> may not be redistributed without the express > >>> consent of the author/creator. > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Nord-Modular mailing list > >> Nord-Modular@code404.com > >> http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > >> may not be redistributed without the express > >> consent of the author/creator. > > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > > > ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- > Return-Path: > Received: from rly-xf03.mx.aol.com (rly-xf03.mail.aol.com > [172.20.105.227]) > by air-xf04.mail.aol.com (v90_r2.5) with ESMTP id > MAILINXF44-0206124319; Thu, > 06 Feb 2003 12:43:19 -0500 > Received: from roland.code404.com (roland.code404.com > [66.134.237.195]) by > rly-xf03.mx.aol.com (v90_r1.1) with ESMTP id > MAILRELAYINXF39-0206124256; Thu, > 06 Feb 2003 12:42:56 -0500 > Received: from roland.code404.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) > by roland.code404.com (Postfix) with ESMTP > id 7BE669A; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:42:48 -0800 (PST) > X-Original-To: nord-modular@code404.com > Delivered-To: nord-modular@roland.code404.com > Received: from toto.jofa.co.uk (toto.jofa.co.uk [194.242.136.146]) > by roland.code404.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C597F7E > for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 09:42:39 -0800 > (PST) > Received: from soloman (81-86-178-205.dsl.pipex.com [81.86.178.205]) > by toto.jofa.co.uk (Postfix) with SMTP id DE827D3CB > for ; Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:42:38 +0000 > (GMT) > Message-ID: <000b01c2ce08$5e9d1bd0$02fea8c0@soloman> > From: "dave" > To: "Nord Modular" > References: <1e5.1464ba6.2b73b7fb@aol.com> > <001e01c2ce07$19aebc50$02fea8c0@soloman> > Subject: Re: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? > Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 17:51:25 -0000 > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > X-Priority: 3 > X-MSMail-Priority: Normal > X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 > X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 > X-BeenThere: nord-modular@code404.com > X-Mailman-Version: 2.1 > Precedence: list > Reply-To: Nord Modular > List-Id: Nord Modular > List-Unsubscribe: , > > List-Archive: > List-Post: > List-Help: > List-Subscribe: , > > Sender: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > Errors-To: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > >>> > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From lepetitmartien at macmusic.org Thu Feb 6 17:18:07 2003 From: lepetitmartien at macmusic.org (I've got a LASER, Earthman!) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: le 07/02/2003 01:25, 3phase ? 3phase@3phase.de a ?crit?: > my machine is from december and don?t installs 9, But you can install one ;) he he! Install OSX from the CDs then copy the clasic environement to an other drive ET VOILA ! ;) > the new machines coming out wright now > don?t even boot in 9 anymore. :( (sigh) But for _premium_ price we can still buy OS9 booting computers new from Apple (see Apple shop, powermacs, upper right corner) Denis ??) ================================================ lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In Chief From 3phase at 3phase.de Thu Feb 6 18:10:17 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:04 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? In-Reply-To: <20030206172723.GD2245@pruts.nl> Message-ID: <4D369B62-3A41-11D7-B701-000A957654DE@3phase.de> nice ones...so the buggy osx editor gets high res icons then :-) On Donnerstag, Feb 6, 2003, at 18:27 Europe/Berlin, Ico Doornekamp wrote: >> I got a new computer at work, and I need some nice desktop background. >> Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures, in large resolutions and >> standard 4x3 size, like 1024x768? > > I made a few 3D computer drawings some time ago, resolution up to > 1400x1050. > They're available on http://zevv.nl/nord/ > > enjoy, > > /Ico > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From 3phase at 3phase.de Thu Feb 6 18:29:05 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Freitag, Feb 7, 2003, at 02:18 Europe/Berlin, I've got a LASER, Earthman! wrote: > le 07/02/2003 01:25, 3phase ? 3phase@3phase.de a ?crit?: > >> my machine is from december and don?t installs 9, > > But you can install one ;) he he! > Install OSX from the CDs then copy the clasic environement to an other > drive > ET VOILA ! ;) > Dont gives stable OMS on my machine, a typical phenomenon for copied systems...maybe the german installation is buggy...wouldnt be the first time... From lepetitmartien at macmusic.org Thu Feb 6 18:34:53 2003 From: lepetitmartien at macmusic.org (I've got a LASER, Earthman!) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: le 07/02/2003 03:29, 3phase ? 3phase@3phase.de a ?crit?: > Dont gives stable OMS on my machine, a typical phenomenon for copied > systems...maybe the german installation is buggy...wouldnt be the first > time... Unfortunately, there is no warranty :( (seems pretty temperamental, thanks Apple) Denis ??) ================================================ lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In Chief From lepetitmartien at macmusic.org Thu Feb 6 19:37:34 2003 From: lepetitmartien at macmusic.org (I've got a LASER, Earthman!) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] Elektron news SIDstation special Message-ID: I just received the newsletter from Elektron and they are announcing the end of the SIDstation, the final countdown has begun! They also show some photos of a keyboard? http://www.elektron.se/thelab.php Denis ??) (for NM: sorry for OT :) ================================================ lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In Chief From alex.bennett at attbi.com Thu Feb 6 20:19:58 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] Nice pictures? References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030124231715.015394a8@mail.eggytoast.com> <3E4290EE.8040309@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <007801c2ce60$2d130a40$a90dec0c@attbi.com> > Does anybody know of some nice NM pictures Every couple of weeks I go to the tutorials on Clavia's site and find a nice big patch to set as my wallpaper. I get a lot of reactions from my co-workers. "What the hell is that?" being the most common. Although last week one of our tech guys was in my office and saw it and it turns out he's into synthesis, too. So, hey, you never know! Alex From 3phase at 3phase.de Fri Feb 7 04:24:35 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1E986369-3A97-11D7-91CD-000A957654DE@3phase.de> I wonder if its time to swap the system, on the other hand i did timing measurements under 10.23 ..and its close to the good ol atari. I will have an intensiv comparison with a dell inspirion 8200 from a friend when hes back from holyday and decide then...when windows xp is close to the timing from osx i wont give myself to become a betatester for the next 2 years...i live from making music...i cant afford unstable systems. On Freitag, Feb 7, 2003, at 03:34 Europe/Berlin, I've got a LASER, Earthman! wrote: > le 07/02/2003 03:29, 3phase ? 3phase@3phase.de a ?crit?: > >> Dont gives stable OMS on my machine, a typical phenomenon for copied >> systems...maybe the german installation is buggy...wouldnt be the >> first >> time... > > Unfortunately, there is no warranty :( > (seems pretty temperamental, thanks Apple) > > Denis ??) > > ================================================ > lepetitmartien > http://www.macmusic.org > Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In > Chief > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From Jc105776 at aol.com Fri Feb 7 06:54:43 2003 From: Jc105776 at aol.com (Jc105776@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? Message-ID: <1ee.14428c8.2b7522b3@aol.com> In a message dated 2/7/03 6:21:38 AM, 3phase@3phase.de writes: << I wonder if its time to swap the system, on the other hand i did timing measurements under 10.23 ..and its close to the good ol atari. I will have an intensiv comparison with a dell inspirion 8200 from a friend when hes back from holyday and decide then...when windows xp is close to the timing from osx i wont give myself to become a betatester for the next 2 years...i live from making music...i cant afford unstable systems. >> I am breaking down and purchasing in a titanium powerbook g4 today, as it will be the last fastest mac ever built that still boots in OS 9 alongside X. not enough appz have been ported to OS X in order for me to wholeheartedly switch to that system. The new aluminum powerbooks are nice, but they don't have the tools I use. Where's GRM Tools? Where's Kontakt? Where's Battery? Where's Recycle? I don't want to wait and watch my hardware decrease in value as software is slowly ported to X. I fully support OS X From 3phase at 3phase.de Fri Feb 7 08:24:42 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <1ee.14428c8.2b7522b3@aol.com> Message-ID: The 667 DVI ist not a bad choice aswell, its the most silent Titanium...and its pretty quick in relation to the giga...regarding platinumverbs 14 against 18... And it installs 9 On Freitag, Feb 7, 2003, at 15:54 Europe/Berlin, Jc105776@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 2/7/03 6:21:38 AM, 3phase@3phase.de writes: > > << I wonder if its time to swap the system, on the other hand i did > timing > > measurements under 10.23 ..and its close to the good ol atari. > > I will have an intensiv comparison with a dell inspirion 8200 from a > > friend when hes back from holyday and decide then...when windows xp is > > close to the timing from osx i wont give myself to become a betatester > > for the next 2 years...i live from making music...i cant afford > > unstable systems. > >>> > > I am breaking down and purchasing in a titanium powerbook g4 today, as > it > will be the last fastest mac ever built that still boots in OS 9 > alongside X. > not enough appz have been ported to OS X in order for me to > wholeheartedly > switch to that system. The new aluminum powerbooks are nice, but they > don't > have the tools I use. Where's GRM Tools? Where's Kontakt? Where's > Battery? > Where's Recycle? I don't want to wait and watch my hardware decrease > in > value as software is slowly ported to X. I fully support OS X > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From valis at ucla.edu Fri Feb 7 08:44:20 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1044636260.3e43e26492339@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting 3phase <3phase@3phase.de>: > Its just that mac is really pressuring OSX now...my machine is from > december and don?t installs 9, the new machines coming out wright now > don?t even boot in 9 anymore. For people that buy a new mac now there > is no mac editor for the nord anymore..at least none thats working. I just got a new dual processor G4 about 3 wks ago that came with 9 still installed - Otherwise I couldn't do it. I have not fully switched to OSX yet, but I am slowly gravitating - 10.2 is really great (stable!), I just wish all of my favorite apps thought so, too ;) It is nice to be able to boot either OS, though. That would suck if you could not boot 9 as well :( vV From grantransom at totalise.co.uk Fri Feb 7 08:48:33 2003 From: grantransom at totalise.co.uk (Grant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> Message-ID: <001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> ----- Original Message ----- From: Pedro Monkeyfinger To: Nord Modular Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 2:47 AM Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > > > > >I must say that I've thought very hard about replacing my Emu E4 with an > >internal VST sampler, but the Emu is just sooo much more powerful than > >Logic's EXS24- and the converters have so much more weight too. > > > > get good convertors for the puter then. That depends on where in the chain you want the conversion (Ie. the tonality it provides). If you bounce mixes, it won't make any difference. If you want it on the samples/audio, you can use the Emu as a front end when sampling. If you want the converters on the sampled sounds playback only, you have to use the Emu. I suppose the main difference is, with the Emu's, every note and layer on it can have different envelopes, filters and the like.- The EXS can only provide a single basic 'VA' style dynamics section on the whole patch. With the EXS, you don't use MIDI, so timing is audibly tighter. (including the dubious AMT and the like) The EXS is another process which can crash the system, but it loads everything up with the track. > > i do know the emu sounds nice nice nice > IMHO, I think they're nice, but only really compared to 'project' cards and other samplers. AFAIK, the E3xp was supposed to be the best sounding (Digital-wise) though I never AB'd the various models. (The E3 had analogue filters) I went into studios a few times where, for various reasons (Cookbook Dance producers :-) ), we had to port my samples/programs to an Akai (pre z series). Most things sounded very clangy compared to the EMU and had everyone scratching his head (Akai are the standard, so why didn't it sound better?). Grant. From valis at ucla.edu Fri Feb 7 09:11:56 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> <001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> Message-ID: <1044637916.3e43e8dc9015c@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting Grant : > Most things sounded very clangy compared to the EMU and had everyone > scratching his head (Akai are the standard, so why didn't it sound > better?). While Akai may not have the "best" sound, it is unique/quirky, and it has been used all over the place. You can immediatly tell it signature sound in most cases, and I like it! It just grows on you, I guess. I would never get rid of my S2800; sometimes the "clanginess" is desirable ;) And there are some cool fx too, IMO, crazy lfo delays and digital tape-loop type stuff that you just can't quite get elsewhere. Too bad you can't do audio in. But I know what you are saying... Thinking of gettin a Z-series sometime, even though everyone says go Emu ;) vV (longtime sentimental akai fan) From Terryfunken at aol.com Fri Feb 7 09:22:55 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <1cf.1ec92fb.2b75456f@aol.com> In a message dated 7/2/03 4:47:36 pm, grantransom@totalise.co.uk writes: >(Akai are the standard, so why didn't it sound better?). Probably because, despite being made by a Japanese company, the AKAI was designed and made in England, home of the majority of magazines dedicated to electronic music?, and well........well, I don't know?- The AKAI is supposed to be tighter in its midi timing, but the Emu blows it away with its filters and modular-like matrix modulation programming. Yes it is a shame that the new E5 needs a board to make it work, but has anybody seen or heard the new VSTi sampler from MOTU???- this looks really promising :) BTW I too got a G4 powerbook yesterday- WOOHOOO!!! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Fri Feb 7 09:25:04 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <1dd.1ee0407.2b7545f0@aol.com> In a message dated 7/2/03 5:12:36 pm, valis@ucla.edu writes: >vV > >(longtime sentimental akai fan) I do have an Akai S950- despite only being 2mb, these ROCK! (but I never use it anymore:( Tom :-) From nicolasfournel at sbcglobal.net Fri Feb 7 11:14:51 2003 From: nicolasfournel at sbcglobal.net (Nicolas Fournel) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] For Sale: Nord Modular Rack in the Bay Area In-Reply-To: <1cf.1ec92fb.2b75456f@aol.com> Message-ID: <20030207191451.9545.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com> It's in very good condition (like a new one: no scratch, no nothing: it never left my home-studio, and is working perfectly). With OS 3.03, the manual, and in the original box. 950 USD. Nicolas From nostromo at arkaos.net Fri Feb 7 12:20:12 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:05 2004 Subject: [NM] knowledge update. Message-ID: <015201c2cee6$518f2210$ad83c850@TWISTIE> I've been having fun diving again into 'elements of computer music' lately... the good thing about those book is that as your knowledge increases, you get new things from the reading. But I was wondering if there was other more recent book in the same style, maybe more up to date and not anymore based on cmusic and the like. Any one for a recommendation ? Cheers, M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030207/3fe4943c/attachment.htm From dpeck at euphonix.com Fri Feb 7 14:03:12 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? Message-ID: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi all, I'm thinking about getting a second NM. I currently have a Frontier Dakota midi+audio card in my PC, which has two midi ports. I use one port for the NM Editor and one for the midi sequencer in/out. To run a second NM connected to the Editor, I'll need to add another midi port, correct? Anybody have any experience adding a third midi port to a PC? Especially anybody who is using a Dakota card? Any recommendations? I'm reluctant to change anything on the PC, as I have a history of frustrating problems every time I try to "upgrade". Dave Peck Euphonix, Inc. 220 Portage Ave. Palo Alto, CA 94306 650-846-1192 From lepetitmartien at macmusic.org Fri Feb 7 14:05:53 2003 From: lepetitmartien at macmusic.org (I've got a LASER, Earthman!) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] editor in classic under 10.2 stable? In-Reply-To: <1ee.14428c8.2b7522b3@aol.com> Message-ID: le 07/02/2003 15:54, Jc105776@aol.com ? Jc105776@aol.com a ?crit?: > not enough appz have been ported to OS X in order for me to wholeheartedly > switch to that system. The new aluminum powerbooks are nice, but they don't > have the tools I use. Where's GRM Tools? Where's Kontakt? Where's Battery? > Where's Recycle? I don't want to wait and watch my hardware decrease in > value as software is slowly ported to X. I fully support OS X Protools out out this month, Performer is still on hold, the NI stuff is available around spring (depends of the product, no date for Kontakt or Battery sorry), no news on GRM, no date for recycle. The drivers horizon is clearing though The software the most lagging behind are either coming from small companies (propellerheads it's a 17 crew?) or plug-ins? reasonably you should have most of them in less than 6 months. I'm sure the developpers are doing their best, but with OSX finalised for audio and midi only in jaguar, some few changes again in 10.2.3, the major sequencers/audio editors still not all running (it's almost over fortunately, I'm waiting DP for a LOOOOOOOONG time). I prefer a slow port for a good soft, than speedy and chitty. And there are still computers available booting on 9 (with a premium price thanks to Apple) transition time are not easy? :( Denis ??) ================================================ lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In Chief From mib303 at gmx.net Fri Feb 7 14:11:30 2003 From: mib303 at gmx.net (Michael Bruder) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? References: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: <01e701c2cef5$df475aa0$947ba8c0@yang> > I'm thinking about getting a second NM. I currently have a Frontier Dakota > midi+audio card in my PC, which has two midi ports. I use one port for the > NM Editor and one for the midi sequencer in/out. > I would recommend a bigger midi interface like the ones emagic has... and if you have the chance, try one before you buy it ;-> "Mi3" From lepetitmartien at macmusic.org Fri Feb 7 14:11:42 2003 From: lepetitmartien at macmusic.org (I've got a LASER, Earthman!) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <1cf.1ec92fb.2b75456f@aol.com> Message-ID: le 07/02/2003 18:22, Terryfunken@aol.com ? Terryfunken@aol.com a ?crit?: > but has anybody seen or heard the new > VSTi sampler from MOTU???- this looks really promising :) It seems cool, it's MAS too ;) (for a MOTU product, you bet !) It was shown at Paris Apple Expo (but I wasn't there) And it's a french developement from the guys at Univers Sons /Plugsound we'll see :) Denis ??) ================================================ lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In Chief From dpeck at euphonix.com Fri Feb 7 15:31:28 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Friday's patch Message-ID: <002001c2cf01$09f3e150$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi all, Here's a big fat warm pulse pad. Detuned PWM oscs, then a broad, leaky, overdriven BPF and a notch filter in parallel, with a cross fader for filter/direct osc mix, then an 18dB dynamics filter with a clipper distorion circuit & crossfader. A tip - note the level settings of the knobs in mixer1 (osc mix). When using detuned pulse or square waves, especially with distortion circuits after the osc mixer, it can sound smoother if the oscs are set to different levels. You still get the fat detuning effect, but without the annoying rhythmic WUBwub WUBwub artifacts. Enjoy! Dave Peck Euphonix, Inc. 220 Portage Ave. Palo Alto, CA 94306 650-846-1192 -------------- next part -------------- [Header] Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 8 600 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 [/Header] [ModuleDump] 1 1 4 3 17 2 1 0 30 3 97 0 20 4 10 0 15 5 30 0 18 7 10 0 10 8 30 0 13 9 97 0 25 10 19 0 3 12 19 1 5 11 49 1 0 13 30 1 10 14 62 1 7 15 19 2 6 6 10 0 5 16 30 0 8 17 51 2 0 18 30 1 12 19 97 1 14 20 18 2 10 21 92 2 14 22 61 2 24 24 19 2 20 25 87 2 22 26 20 1 30 27 43 1 21 28 71 1 18 29 20 2 30 30 50 3 31 31 19 3 29 32 18 3 26 23 18 2 27 33 28 0 23 34 66 0 33 35 47 3 20 36 30 3 23 [/ModuleDump] [ModuleDump] 0 [/ModuleDump] [CurrentNoteDump] 64 0 0 64 0 0 [/CurrentNoteDump] [CableDump] 1 3 4 0 0 3 0 1 3 7 0 0 4 0 0 3 6 0 0 7 0 0 3 5 0 0 9 0 1 3 8 0 0 5 0 0 3 16 0 0 8 0 0 0 10 1 0 7 0 1 0 10 0 0 4 0 1 1 4 1 0 5 0 1 1 7 1 0 8 0 1 0 12 2 0 11 2 1 0 12 1 0 11 1 1 0 12 0 0 11 0 1 0 11 1 0 10 0 1 0 17 2 0 11 1 0 0 20 0 0 17 2 0 0 14 0 0 12 0 1 0 15 0 0 14 0 0 0 10 2 0 6 0 1 1 6 1 0 16 0 1 1 14 1 0 13 0 1 1 11 0 0 14 1 0 1 17 0 0 18 0 1 0 15 1 0 14 0 1 0 15 2 0 17 0 1 3 18 0 0 19 0 1 3 13 0 0 18 0 0 0 20 1 0 15 0 1 0 24 0 0 21 0 1 0 23 0 0 24 0 0 0 22 0 0 24 0 1 0 25 0 0 22 0 1 0 23 1 0 22 0 1 0 24 2 0 25 0 1 2 26 1 0 2 1 1 2 29 1 0 26 1 0 1 28 0 0 27 0 1 1 21 0 0 28 0 1 1 21 1 0 26 0 1 1 9 1 0 2 0 1 1 19 0 0 9 1 0 0 32 1 0 31 0 1 0 29 0 0 23 0 1 0 30 0 0 29 1 1 0 32 0 0 30 0 0 0 21 2 0 20 0 1 1 3 1 0 33 0 1 1 34 1 0 2 2 1 1 26 3 0 34 0 1 0 31 1 0 30 0 1 0 31 2 0 30 2 1 1 35 1 0 36 0 1 0 35 0 0 32 0 1 0 1 1 0 35 0 1 0 1 0 0 35 1 1 [/CableDump] [CableDump] 0 [/CableDump] [ParameterDump] 1 1 4 3 116 0 0 3 97 5 64 64 1 0 0 4 10 5 64 63 64 38 0 5 30 1 15 6 10 5 64 65 64 34 0 7 10 5 64 64 64 40 0 8 30 1 18 9 97 5 70 64 0 0 105 10 19 3 105 127 113 11 49 4 85 0 86 34 12 19 3 84 127 85 13 30 1 31 14 62 2 25 40 15 19 3 85 120 127 16 30 1 20 17 51 10 3 0 41 77 0 0 0 1 0 0 18 30 1 26 19 97 5 54 64 0 98 0 20 18 2 0 113 21 92 7 60 28 29 19 93 1 0 22 61 3 0 0 0 23 18 2 0 47 24 19 3 105 127 120 25 87 1 20 26 20 6 0 81 100 66 91 0 27 43 2 0 1 28 71 2 127 116 29 20 6 0 45 101 94 87 0 30 50 3 112 12 0 31 19 3 127 127 110 32 18 2 0 46 33 28 1 101 34 66 5 0 127 0 117 1 35 47 2 0 64 36 30 1 27 [/ParameterDump] [ParameterDump] 0 [/ParameterDump] [MorphMapDump] 116 0 66 0 1 3 4 1 27 1 4 0 0 0 1 4 1 0 -15 1 6 0 0 0 1 6 1 0 15 1 35 0 2 30 1 36 0 2 8 [/MorphMapDump] [KnobMapDump] 1 9 0 1 1 19 0 2 1 20 1 3 1 21 0 6 1 21 2 9 1 23 1 4 1 26 1 7 1 26 2 10 1 26 3 13 1 26 4 16 1 27 0 20 1 29 1 8 1 29 2 11 1 29 3 14 1 29 4 17 1 32 1 5 1 34 3 12 2 1 0 0 2 1 2 15 [/KnobMapDump] [CtrlMapDump] 2 1 1 1 [/CtrlMapDump] [CustomDump] 1 3 1 0 4 1 0 5 1 1 6 1 0 7 1 0 8 1 1 9 1 0 11 1 0 13 1 1 16 1 1 17 1 0 18 1 1 19 1 0 21 1 0 30 1 0 33 1 1 36 1 1 [/CustomDump] [CustomDump] 0 [/CustomDump] [NameDump] 1 1 Dave Peck 2 Keyboard1 3 MasterOsc1 4 OscSlvB1 5 LFOSlvE1 6 OscSlvB3 7 OscSlvB2 8 LFOSlvE2 9 PWM = KN2 10 Mixer1 11 FilterD1 12 Mixer2 13 LFOSlvE3 14 Overdrive1 15 SweepSum 16 LFOSlvE4 17 FilterE1 18 LFOSlvE5 19 fc Sweep=KN3 20 SweepmixKN4 21 fc/res=KN7/10 22 Clip1 23 HEAT=KN5 24 Mixer5 25 FilterB1 26 8 11 14 17 27 Aftertouch 28 EnvFollower1 29 9 12 15 18 30 FilterC1 31 Mixer6 32 Warmth=KN6 33 Vibrato 34 EG AMT=KN13 35 Pan1 36 LFOSlvE6 [/NameDump] [NameDump] 0 [/NameDump] From J.Punter at iaf.nl Fri Feb 7 16:15:20 2003 From: J.Punter at iaf.nl (Jan Punter) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? References: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: <3E444C18.88430511@iaf.nl> Dave Peck wrote: > To run a second NM connected to the Editor, I'll need to add another midi > port, correct? Yes you'll have to and you are, respectively. Just as a remark, FWIW ... I had this same feeling about not wanting to change anything on my PC as it was working (it has relatively many ISA cards inside, getting the interrupt settings right was quite a puzzel, don't touch it !!). This made me decide to go for a USB device (midiman 2x2) which turned out to work very well for me. Jan. From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Fri Feb 7 19:09:37 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? In-Reply-To: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com> References: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: <15199826693.20030207190937@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/7/2003 Dave Peck wrote: > I'm thinking about getting a second NM. Greedy man! > To run a second NM connected to the Editor, I'll need to add another midi > port, correct? Partly. Adding another port is not quite the same thing as adding another interface. > Anybody have any experience adding a third midi port to a PC? Yes. > Especially anybody who is using a Dakota card? I'm not ... but this shouldn't make any difference. > Any recommendations? Yes. > I'm > reluctant to change anything on the PC, as I have a history of frustrating > problems every time I try to "upgrade". OK ... then ... the Emagic AMT-8 or Unitor. This interface works over USB so you won't have to take the top off your beloved PC and install a card. The most you'll need to do is install a driver off the accompanying CD-ROM. There is therefore nothing to upgrade. The AMT8 or Unitor will immediately give you 8 ins and 8 outs. Or is that overkill for you? It's also very easy to configure. Works a treat with one NM, and I can't see why it wouldn't work just as well with two. It has its little idiosyncrasies, but on the whole a pretty good efficient "install it and forget it" workhorse. Suggestion: I know you're close to them. Maybe Computers and Music over in SF would help you out "try-it-out" wise? I think they have the Unitors in stock. Maybe yer takes yer puter and yer Nord and yer susses it all out on site? -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From b.hawk at shaw.ca Fri Feb 7 20:06:55 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> <001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> Message-ID: > > > i do know the emu sounds nice nice nice >> >IMHO, I think they're nice, but only really compared to 'project' cards and >other samplers. yeah but it s 16bit. it s nice From b.hawk at shaw.ca Fri Feb 7 20:21:30 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Synton Syrinx? (Rob?) In-Reply-To: <001201c2ce32$df74b6d0$640314cf@euphonix.com> References: <001201c2ce32$df74b6d0$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: THOSE ARE THE BEST FILTERS EVER!! wow! like, i shake just thinking about them i ll post urls to mp3s of some reocrdings done with a borrowed syrinx last month. must be heard to be believed.... wow... my buddy diego had david s (http://www.buchla.com/BarberShoppe/index.htm) syrinx keyboard at his place for a bit. he used it on a track or 2, then we did some 2 track recordings - i d go, then he d lay something on top, then he d go first. i think we did 4 tracks like that... what a synth... anyways, now diego s got this exact synth at his place: http://www.synthmuseum.com/stp/stpsynthacon01.html complete with weird sticker i thought the synthacon was the best monosynth =) it does have the best filters though =) too bad these things aren t more abundant. From b.hawk at shaw.ca Fri Feb 7 20:11:23 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <1044637916.3e43e8dc9015c@mail.ucla.edu> References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com> <001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> <1044637916.3e43e8dc9015c@mail.ucla.edu> Message-ID: >Thinking of gettin a Z-series sometime, even though everyone says go Emu ;) nah man, the z seris is really worth checking out. emu has to do something different. if they changed a few things with their 'modular' synthesis (or whatever. the virtual patch cord thing with their modulation section) i d probably be more interested but right now i m looking at diving into reaktor and max/msp for sample action, and sticking with the emax for hardware sampler =) the emax makes me smile =) From b.hawk at shaw.ca Fri Feb 7 20:29:58 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] Synton Syrinx? (Rob?) In-Reply-To: References: <001201c2ce32$df74b6d0$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: > >i thought the synthacon was the best monosynth =) >it does have the best filters though =) sorry, typos all over the place in that post.... the above was supposed to read 'i thought the syrinx was the best monosynth' diego blew up his monitors with the synthacon. it s a beast From chsinger at localnet.com Fri Feb 7 21:09:22 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings References: Message-ID: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> Hi everyone, Does anyone know the relative dB values for the stops on Hammond organ drawbars? I'm looking to model some drawbar settings I remember from long ago, and nothing I've done sounds quite "right" yet. Thanks, Chet From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Fri Feb 7 21:29:04 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:06 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings In-Reply-To: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> Message-ID: <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/7/2003 Chet Singer wrote: > Does anyone know the relative dB values for the stops on Hammond organ > drawbars? I'm looking to model some drawbar settings I remember from long > ago, and nothing I've done sounds quite "right" yet. Would these help? http://theatreorgans.com/grounds/docs/history.html http://users.pandora.be/saelsm/hambasic.htm -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From alex.bennett at attbi.com Fri Feb 7 23:54:32 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? References: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com> <15199826693.20030207190937@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <003e01c2cf47$514e2a60$a90dec0c@attbi.com> I use an AMT8, but since I picked up a second Micro I've switched my editor handling duties over to a separate Midiman 4x4. It does the job well, although now Logic is giving me hell (again - but I won't bother you with all that!). If you don't want to buy the 8x8's, I do recommend the midiman 4x4. It gets the job done very nicely, and costs less. After all my bad experiences with Emagic, I'd say go for the Midiman 8x8 before the AMT, as well. By the way, I notice that I am only able to save to the "first" of my two MM's from the editor. The editor does not give me the option of saving to the other MM. Is this something others have experienced as well? Alex From alex.bennett at attbi.com Sat Feb 8 00:07:11 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? References: <001d01c2cef4$b54cb340$640314cf@euphonix.com><15199826693.20030207190937@yefrewenchi.com> <003e01c2cf47$514e2a60$a90dec0c@attbi.com> Message-ID: <004401c2cf49$15a6a440$a90dec0c@attbi.com> Does anyone know the diameter of the mounting holes on the bottom of the Micro? I'd like to mount mine onto a rack shelf . . . thanks! Alex From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 01:53:45 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <127.21ed7b83.2b762da9@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 4:23:45 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: >yeah > >but it s 16bit. it s nice > So what? I don't get all this fuss about 24bit this and 24bit that people then go chasing after sounds that are 8 bit etc. For example, vinyl definately sounds better than CD if it wasn't for the sound of the turntable rumble in the background (unless you are lucky enough to own a Linn Sondek or similar), but then those rumbles and crackles ADD to the sound making it warmer- what's wrong with a bit of hiss and slight lack of definition? I think lack of definition adds a certain mystery- your brain fills in the gaps and hears sounds and textures that aren't actually there, by compensating a bit. You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. Go on-let your brain do some work for once! ;-) (apologies for the first rant of the morning hehehe!) Tom :-) From RolandKuit at Koorenhuis.nl Sat Feb 8 02:13:15 2003 From: RolandKuit at Koorenhuis.nl (Roland Kuit) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: [] When it can be perfect, imperfection will be the new standard:) Roland > >yeah > > > >but it s 16bit. it s nice > > > So what? I don't get all this fuss about 24bit this and 24bit that people > then go chasing after sounds that are 8 bit etc. For example, vinyl > definately sounds better than CD if it wasn't for the sound of the > turntable > rumble in the background (unless you are lucky enough to own a Linn Sondek > or > similar), but then those rumbles and crackles ADD to the sound making it > warmer- what's wrong with a bit of hiss and slight lack of definition? I > think lack of definition adds a certain mystery- your brain fills in the > gaps > and hears sounds and textures that aren't actually there, by compensating > a > bit. You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. > > Go on-let your brain do some work for once! ;-) > > (apologies for the first rant of the morning hehehe!) > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030208/09a1ae18/attachment.htm From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 02:06:10 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: In a message dated 8/2/03 4:25:06 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: >nah man, the z seris is really worth checking out. >emu has to do something different. if they changed a few things >with their 'modular' synthesis (or whatever. the virtual patch cord >thing with their modulation section) i d probably be more interested > I beg to differ. I'm not on about which-is-better-than-what products, but new features won't make you a better musician ;-). Why shouldn't Emu do something different? (I mean that IS what you want, isn't it???) The modulation patchcord system on the Emu is almost as versatile as the NM- what more do you want??? I think the main problem with the Emu is that it's intially very confusing because it IS so powerful- It does help however, to be able to think and visualize in 3 dimensions (or more) to get the best out of the matrix. It's all in there- you just have to find it and then to requote; "let it discover you" ;-) best Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 02:13:06 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? Message-ID: <129.226ae1f7.2b763232@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 7:57:00 am, alex.bennett@attbi.com writes: >If you don't want to buy the 8x8's, I do recommend the midiman 4x4. It >gets > >the job done very nicely, and costs less. After all my bad experiences >with > >Emagic, I'd say go for the Midiman 8x8 before the AMT, as well. > > I guess it all depends on what computer you are on too?. For eg, I've had only good experiences with my mt4 compared to my old midisport2x2. Although when I started using the NM I had a midisport and it was fine (better than the mt4 infact) until one day, for absolutely no apparent reason, it stopped working (???????????!!!). If there is still people on Macs having these problems, try turning off the "USB OMSMIDI" driver- this made my mt4 VERY stable again :-))))) Tom :-) From d.rave at freesurf.fr Sat Feb 8 02:54:39 2003 From: d.rave at freesurf.fr (D.Ravé) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [2] [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: Terryfunken once said : > I beg to differ. I'm not on about which-is-better-than-what products, but new  > features won't make you a better musician ;-).  AND >So what? I don't get all this fuss about 24bit this and 24bit that people Beware. Here is what a narrow minded pal (me) would guess from your statements : - One doesn't need no "features". Music is about being the best musician, not fun. You should never experiment with new features, which is a waste of time. Furthermore you should never buy new instruments, but stick with... err... your fingers and one natural instrument (bottle, stone, furniture, flute if you're lucky). So forget modular synths... - One should never help the listener hear music. No record should contain more than one sine wave : the listener then can make his brains work to reconstruct the whole symphony you had in mind. In most cases though, silent tracks should be the rule. Funny way to consider things from someone playing with a techno gadget like the modular. -- Damien Ravé d.rave@freesurf.fr http://www.capharnaum.cjb.net From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 04:02:35 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <26.346ff5ac.2b764bdb@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 10:06:57 am, RolandKuit@Koorenhuis.nl writes: << [] When it can be perfect, imperfection will be the new standard:) >> As always!! hehe. I think it is a lot easier to moan than actually getting on with it ;) From RolandKuit at Koorenhuis.nl Sat Feb 8 04:18:49 2003 From: RolandKuit at Koorenhuis.nl (Roland Kuit) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: [] I think it has something to do with emotions. Greets, Roland > << [] When it can be perfect, > imperfection will be the new standard:) > >> > > As always!! hehe. I think it is a lot easier to moan than actually getting > on > with it ;) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030208/b21b76ac/attachment.htm From cancelgretl at hotmail.com Sat Feb 8 04:57:41 2003 From: cancelgretl at hotmail.com (Cancel Gretl) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [2] [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: Message-ID: i'm pretty sure that's not what he meant ;] ----- Original Message ----- From: "D.Rav?" To: Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 4:54 AM Subject: RE:[2] [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > Terryfunken once said : > > I beg to differ. I'm not on about which-is-better-than-what products, but new > > features won't make you a better musician ;-). > AND > >So what? I don't get all this fuss about 24bit this and 24bit that people > > Beware. Here is what a narrow minded pal (me) would guess from your statements : > - One doesn't need no "features". Music is about being the best musician, not fun. You should never experiment with new features, which is > a waste of time. Furthermore you should never buy new instruments, but stick with... err... your fingers and one natural instrument (bottle, > stone, furniture, flute if you're lucky). So forget modular synths... > - One should never help the listener hear music. No record should contain more than one sine wave : the listener then can make his brains > work to reconstruct the whole symphony you had in mind. In most cases though, silent tracks should be the rule. > > Funny way to consider things from someone playing with a techno gadget like the modular. > > -- > Damien Rav? > d.rave@freesurf.fr > http://www.capharnaum.cjb.net > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 05:18:10 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [2] [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <65.9540620.2b765d92@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 11:45:57 am, d.rave@freesurf.fr writes: >Beware. Here is what a narrow minded pal (me) would guess from your statements >: > >- One doesn't need no "features". Music is about being the best musician, >not fun. You should never experiment with new features, which is > >a waste of time. Furthermore you should never buy new instruments, but >stick with... err... your fingers and one natural instrument (bottle, > >stone, furniture, flute if you're lucky). So forget modular synths... > >- One should never help the listener hear music. No record should contain >more than one sine wave : the listener then can make his brains > >work to reconstruct the whole symphony you had in mind. In most cases though, >silent tracks should be the rule. > > > >Funny way to consider things from someone playing with a techno gadget >like the modular. > > A patch- especially for dave the rave (who dosen't send any patches- EVER- or if he does, they are very boring, because I don't recall any of them;) The moral?- please don't take the piss on list, in such a personal manner, otherwise you will be made to feel like an idiot yourself;) Tom :-) (what sense of humour???;) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: DavetheRave.pch.zip Type: application/zip Size: 383 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030208/21fdefab/DavetheRave.pch.zip From chsinger at localnet.com Sat Feb 8 06:17:18 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:07 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> Kofi, Thanks for the links. There's a lot of useful information in there. There are lists of sample registrations that I'm saving :-) Unfortunately, they didn't contain quite what I'm looking for. I'm trying to figure out how loud a drawbar is at each of it's 8 settings. For example, if a registration is 884 560 470, how much quieter is the third drawbar (pulled out to 4) than the first two (pulled out to 8), and so on. I don't have access to a Hammond, or to a good clone like an Electro. Chet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Friday's Child" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 12:29 AM Subject: Re: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings > On 2/7/2003 Chet Singer wrote: > > > Does anyone know the relative dB values for the stops on Hammond organ > > drawbars? I'm looking to model some drawbar settings I remember from long > > ago, and nothing I've done sounds quite "right" yet. > > > Would these help? > http://theatreorgans.com/grounds/docs/history.html > http://users.pandora.be/saelsm/hambasic.htm > > > -- > > With every good wish, > K(ofi) B(usia) > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 06:52:01 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings In-Reply-To: <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> Message-ID: <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> Hi Chet, > Thanks for the links. > Unfortunately, they didn't contain quite what I'm looking for. Sorry. Now that I reread it, your original email was very clear. My apologies. This http://theatreorgans.com/hammond/drawbar.htm doesn't _completely_ answer your question but you might find it fun. I think it's a bit closer? It's nice to play around with the applet, anyway! Unfortunately, you can't hear what you're seeing, which is what you're really after, I think? But ... it might give you some clues. Enjoy. If I come across anything else stashed here on my PC I'll be sure to send it over. Good luck, and looking forward to the patch. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 06:54:53 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] OT OT OT: Bill Gates is not alone Message-ID: <194142142780.20030208065453@yefrewenchi.com> Hi Sorry for this OT, but I found it very droll. Apparently ... if you use static banners, tabs, links and other such web navigational aids on your site or use a video screen, then you owe SBC or PanIP respectively some licensing fees for the privilege. They each claim to have outstanding patents on the underlying web technology. http://www2.museumtour.com/sbc.html http://www.youmaybenext.com Man but what an amazing world we live in. Please form an orderly queue with your cheque books. Make them out to me!!!!!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 07:04:02 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings In-Reply-To: <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <43142691910.20030208070402@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/8/2003 Friday's Child wrote: > http://theatreorgans.com/hammond/drawbar.htm Actually, Chet, that should be exactly what you're looking for, no? That site says that each stop represents a gain of 3db ... and you originally said ... "Does anyone know the relative dB values for the stops on Hammond organ drawbars?" Or have I misunderstood you again? For some reason I had that one filed under "wave shapes" rather than under "Hammond". Very much hope that it answers your question, anyway. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From d.rave at freesurf.fr Sat Feb 8 07:12:24 2003 From: d.rave at freesurf.fr (D.Ravé) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [2] RE:[2] [NM] Please share your synth programming learning Message-ID: Terryfunken@aol.com wrote on 08/02/2003 09:18:10: I have to send public apologies to Terryfunken whom I never meant to offense. This was intended as a humoristic interpretation of his words, not an attack. Please excuse me. And yes I sent some pitiful patches, and I should hide in a hole forever for not being able to do a better job. -- Damien Rave (not Dave the Rave) >In a message dated 8/2/03 11:45:57 am, d.rave@freesurf.fr writes: >A patch- especially for dave the rave (who dosen't send any patches- EVER- or >if he does, they are very boring, because I don't recall any of them;) > >The moral?- please don't take the piss on list, in such a personal manner, >otherwise you will be made to feel like an idiot yourself;) > >Tom :-) (what sense of humour???;) > >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. Damien Ravé d.rave@freesurf.fr http://www.capharnaum.cjb.net From Monkeybaitqh at cs.com Sat Feb 8 08:36:05 2003 From: Monkeybaitqh at cs.com (Monkeybaitqh@cs.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) Message-ID: <75.96fd448.2b768bf5@cs.com> Hi, I'm planning on selling my Yamaha AN1X. It's a 61 key synth so with the box it's pretty big. I have the original box w/ the styrofoam. Is that enough to ship? or do i need to put it in a bigger box w/ packing peanuts? Just a bit nervous b/c the only synth I ever shipped was a little micromod. thanks for your help, Quinn Hanratty From bbeausej at pobox.com Sat Feb 8 12:32:21 2003 From: bbeausej at pobox.com (Benoit Beausejour) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) References: <75.96fd448.2b768bf5@cs.com> Message-ID: <3E456955.6000904@pobox.com> Hi Quinn, I shipped a Yamaha AN1x 2 months ago. (Sold on ebay, got a crazy price for it too). I packed it using a Gibson SG box I got from my local music store.(they had leftovers) I used some old styrofoam to cover the knobs and make the synth sit tight in the box. I then filled the box with newspaper (not too much). The important part was that I duck taped the corners and sides of the box, those areas are more prone to destruction during a move. I shipped with UPS and the synth made it without any problems. Hope that helped :) Ben Benoit Beausejour Turbulent -- http://www.turbulent.ca Monkeybaitqh@cs.com wrote: >Hi, > >I'm planning on selling my Yamaha AN1X. It's a 61 key synth so with the box >it's pretty big. I have the original box w/ the styrofoam. Is that enough >to ship? or do i need to put it in a bigger box w/ packing peanuts? Just a >bit nervous b/c the only synth I ever shipped was a little micromod. >thanks for your help, > >Quinn Hanratty >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. > > > > From cancelgretl at hotmail.com Sat Feb 8 09:34:56 2003 From: cancelgretl at hotmail.com (Cancel Gretl) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) References: <75.96fd448.2b768bf5@cs.com> Message-ID: if there were any keyboard you could commit inhumane 'gear cruelty' with, it might just be the an1x or the cs1x. those things are horses. thin plastic housing is deceptive, i guess... however, as a rule, I would always ship in a bigger box w/padding. to boot, and more off topic, thursday, i saw a ups delivery character drop a 21" trinitron on the ground from the back of his truck (about 4 ft). he looked around to see if anyone saw him, and then he 'gently' carried it into my building. i saw him. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 10:36 AM Subject: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) > Hi, > > I'm planning on selling my Yamaha AN1X. It's a 61 key synth so with the box > it's pretty big. I have the original box w/ the styrofoam. Is that enough > to ship? or do i need to put it in a bigger box w/ packing peanuts? Just a > bit nervous b/c the only synth I ever shipped was a little micromod. > thanks for your help, > > Quinn Hanratty > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From alex.bennett at attbi.com Sat Feb 8 09:48:24 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) References: <75.96fd448.2b768bf5@cs.com> Message-ID: <004901c2cf9a$4707c540$a90dec0c@attbi.com> It's worth it to get bubble wrap to wrap the synth up where the styrofoam isn't protecting it. If it's possible, double boxing is the ultimate protection. IMO, putting effort into extra protection is a lot better than getting a damaged synth on the other end. But, don't overpack or your packaging could actually damage things! Alex From boskk_ at hotmail.com Sat Feb 8 10:00:37 2003 From: boskk_ at hotmail.com (boskk _) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis Message-ID: does anyone know, pray tell, if barebones granulising is possible on the modular? _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From nostromo at arkaos.net Sat Feb 8 10:11:20 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis References: Message-ID: <007701c2cf9d$7bed9ca0$77cec850@TWISTIE> although some in possible (see: http://pch.zevv.nl/search.php?searchstring=granular )... I personally don't think it is the best plateform for it. Sure enough you can generate grains, mix them and so on but to me the granular approach works best when sample based and the NM does unfortunately not have any room for that. Depending on your puter, you'll find plenty of nice lil' software to experiment with it Cheers, M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "boskk _" To: Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 7:00 PM Subject: [NM] granular synthesis > does anyone know, pray tell, if barebones granulising is possible on the > modular? > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > > From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 10:12:42 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] OT OT OT: Bill Gates is not alone Message-ID: <1d4.20587df.2b76a29a@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 2:55:33 pm, afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com writes: >Apparently ... if you use static banners, tabs, links and other such >web navigational aids on your site or use a video screen, then you owe >SBC or PanIP respectively some licensing fees for the privilege. They >each claim to have outstanding patents on the underlying web technology. well Kofi, the last government in this country privatised water....which I find an insult. There is always going to be some tosser out there who claims royalties for anything. long live plaintext!! Tom ;-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 10:19:57 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] shipping a synth/ Mac music system for sale (OT) Message-ID: <10f.1e29c20f.2b76a44d@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 4:37:05 pm, Monkeybaitqh@cs.com writes: >I'm planning on selling my Yamaha AN1X. It's a 61 key synth so with the >box >it's pretty big. that's funny, I too am selling my AN1x too- but the problem I have is that it comes with a metal flightcase!!!!!!!! I'm also selling a complete Mac G3 music system, complete with Logic Audio Gold (with dongle and unregistered), an Audiowerk8 card and 2 large monitors- If anyone is interested, please mail me off-list:) - oh and also an Akai MPC2000! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Sat Feb 8 10:22:27 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis Message-ID: <19a.1055b466.2b76a4e3@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 6:01:16 pm, boskk_@hotmail.com writes: >does anyone know, pray tell, if barebones granulising is possible on the > >modular? A sort of granulator is possible, Rob put together an excellent one using sinewaves- but don't hold your breath too much- as you know it is nigh impossible to load in samples to the nm- lets hope a nm2 will come someday! Tom :-) From eneff at lodinet.com Sat Feb 8 10:46:41 2003 From: eneff at lodinet.com (eneff@lodinet.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:08 2004 Subject: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) In-Reply-To: <004901c2cf9a$4707c540$a90dec0c@attbi.com> Message-ID: <001c01c2cfa2$6e6c2d30$0b00000a@Aluminum> If you have the original box you are usually in good shape. After all it made it in the first place. Some shippers only warranty if you ship in the original packing. If I don't have the original packing, I pay the shipping place to do it so I get their warranty as well. > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com] On Behalf Of Alex Bennett > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 9:48 AM > To: Nord Modular > Subject: Re: [NM] shipping a synth (OT) > > > It's worth it to get bubble wrap to wrap the synth up where > the styrofoam isn't protecting it. If it's possible, double > boxing is the ultimate protection. > > IMO, putting effort into extra protection is a lot better > than getting a damaged synth on the other end. But, don't > overpack or your packaging could actually damage things! > > Alex > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-> modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From grantransom at totalise.co.uk Sat Feb 8 11:06:52 2003 From: grantransom at totalise.co.uk (Grant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: <1e1.128c005.2b72376b@aol.com><001c01c2cec8$c3f9bc20$0987fea9@grantransom> <1044637916.3e43e8dc9015c@mail.ucla.edu> Message-ID: <003901c2cfa5$43f86160$0987fea9@grantransom> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Nord Modular Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 5:11 PM Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > Quoting Grant : > > > Most things sounded very clangy compared to the EMU and had everyone > > scratching his head (Akai are the standard, so why didn't it sound > > better?). > > While Akai may not have the "best" sound, it is unique/quirky, and it has > been used all over the place. You can immediatly tell it signature sound > in most cases, and I like it! It just grows on you, I guess. I would > never get rid of my S2800; sometimes the "clanginess" is desirable ;) And > there are some cool fx too, IMO, crazy lfo delays and digital tape-loop > type stuff that you just can't quite get elsewhere. Too bad you can't do > audio in. But I know what you are saying... Actually, I do use Akai's now and then, but it's hard to cover everything in a short post. One thing I really do like over the Emu, is the s5/6xxx and Zx adopted file system. ie. a generic system that is readable by most computers, therefore libraries, maintenance of files, backing up and editing is acheivable at a level you would expect from a pro machine. This is the reason I've moved towards software sampling for some jobs. Emu have IMHO, made some other really questionable choices in their system. ( in much the same tradition as Macintosh, and I'm not bringing windows into the equasion, I just somehow expect more from Macintosh). A while ago, I was emailing Emu with some ideas for functionality in their samplers. A dos compatible file system. The ability to instantly dump all samples and programs that arn't needed. (ie. not referenced on the Multi page) - Though in EOS there is now sort of a way to do this. An automatic algorythm to chop up a long sample (of different pitches) find the fundamental in each slice, create a keymapped preset, ready to be looped and finished by hand. (I'd like one of these in my computer too): Instant Multisample presets. An option of a 'modular' building block style filter section, with feedback and distortion using their 'cord' system. (a sampler section in the NM would be killer though). I never even got a reply - maybe they're just not good ideas. Maybe like Roland they're way too clever to accept/acknowledge any user input. Either way, As the softsamplers get better, the hardware will disapear from my equipment list, except for some live work. Grant. From chsinger at localnet.com Sat Feb 8 11:06:09 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> <43142691910.20030208070402@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <002701c2cfa5$25627c40$ca9428cf@207d511> Kofi, Yes, that's exactly what I was looking for. Thanks much! Chet ----- Original Message ----- From: "Friday's Child" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 10:04 AM Subject: Re: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings > On 2/8/2003 Friday's Child wrote: > > > http://theatreorgans.com/hammond/drawbar.htm > > Actually, Chet, that should be exactly what you're looking for, no? > > That site says that each stop represents a gain of 3db ... and you > originally said ... "Does anyone know the relative dB values for the > stops on Hammond organ drawbars?" Or have I misunderstood you again? > > For some reason I had that one filed under "wave shapes" rather than > under "Hammond". Very much hope that it answers your question, anyway. > > -- > > With every good wish, > K(ofi) B(usia) > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 11:59:05 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <127.21ed7b83.2b762da9@aol.com> References: <127.21ed7b83.2b762da9@aol.com> Message-ID: <124160395125.20030208115905@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/8/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > For example, vinyl definately sounds better than CD Now that I agree with completely. > if it wasn't for the sound of the turntable > rumble in the background Even with that ... it still sounds better. I'm just a bit of a Neanderthal, really!! > (unless you are lucky enough to own a Linn Sondek or > similar), Aaaah!!! Fancy someone mentioning those!!!!! My God!!!! I have one of those. Cost me an arm and a leg back in '76 I think, and it's been rumbling along very happily ever since. Not given me a lick of trouble in all that time. All I've ever had to do is replace the belt a couple of times. A really great piece of kit and one of the best buys I ever made!! Apart from the Nord, of course. http://www.linn.co.uk/spec_sound/products.cfm?range=turntable&refererURL=http://www.linn.co.uk/#6 > but then those rumbles and crackles ADD to the sound making it > warmer- Agreed. Not just wormer though. Kind of ... well ... rumblier and cracklier!!! > what's wrong with a bit of hiss and slight lack of definition? Agreed again. > I think lack of definition adds a certain mystery- your brain fills in the gaps > and hears sounds and textures that aren't actually there, by compensating a > bit. Agreed yet again. > You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. > Go on-let your brain do some work for once! ;-) OK ... but ... only if you do the same!!!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 11:59:22 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <121160411689.20030208115922@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/8/2003 Roland Kuit wrote: > [] When it can be perfect, > imperfection will be the new standard:) Satori! The Zen master has spoken!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 12:00:14 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [2] [NM] Please share your synth programming learning In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2160464025.20030208120014@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/8/2003 D.Rav? wrote: > And yes I sent some pitiful patches, Which patches are those? I have never seen a pitiful patch. I would really like to see one. !!!! > and I should hide in a hole forever for not being able to do a better job. That is just a little bit long, no? Ah well ... if you must do that then please don't forget to take your Nord Modular with you. I don't have mine at the moment so all I can do is doodle with the editor. It's not nearly so much fun! (Just out of curiosity -- are you the same as the Dax Rav? who already has some patches in the archive?) -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sat Feb 8 12:00:29 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] dB values for drawbar settings In-Reply-To: <002701c2cfa5$25627c40$ca9428cf@207d511> References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> <43142691910.20030208070402@yefrewenchi.com> <002701c2cfa5$25627c40$ca9428cf@207d511> Message-ID: <68160478776.20030208120029@yefrewenchi.com> On 2/8/2003 Chet Singer wrote: > Kofi, > Yes, that's exactly what I was looking for. Thanks much! You're more than welcome. It's nice when once every so often a piece of totally useless information that I have tucked away actually comes in handy. Almost makes gives my mundane life a sense of purpose and meaning!! -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From ianhattwick at attbi.com Sat Feb 8 14:47:51 2003 From: ianhattwick at attbi.com (Ian Hattwick) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? In-Reply-To: <004401c2cf49$15a6a440$a90dec0c@attbi.com> Message-ID: <5A92FC40-3BB7-11D7-87CB-00039307260A@attbi.com> A standard rack screw fits the hole perfectly- which makes things easy. I think most half rack sized units use that standard now. Ian On Saturday, February 8, 2003, at 12:07 AM, Alex Bennett wrote: > Does anyone know the diameter of the mounting holes on the bottom of the > Micro? I'd like to mount mine onto a rack shelf . . . thanks! > > Alex > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From des1gner at optusnet.com.au Sat Feb 8 16:18:29 2003 From: des1gner at optusnet.com.au (des1gner@optusnet.com.au) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? In-Reply-To: <5A92FC40-3BB7-11D7-87CB-00039307260A@attbi.com> References: <5A92FC40-3BB7-11D7-87CB-00039307260A@attbi.com> Message-ID: I don't think my 'standard' rack screw fits into the bottom mounting holes of my nord. You may want to double check that Ian. >A standard rack screw fits the hole perfectly- which makes things >easy. I think most half rack sized units use that standard now. > >Ian > > > >On Saturday, February 8, 2003, at 12:07 AM, Alex Bennett wrote: > >>Does anyone know the diameter of the mounting holes on the bottom of the >>Micro? I'd like to mount mine onto a rack shelf . . . thanks! >> >>Alex From andre at sansserif.com.au Sat Feb 8 17:05:52 2003 From: andre at sansserif.com.au (andre@sansserif.com.au) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular OSX Beta (doesnt work for me) In-Reply-To: <20030207200014.30BDF9E@roland.code404.com> Message-ID: Hi. the beta version of the editor doesnt work for me. .it cant find the synth in the midi window (OSX 10.2.3, USB Midisport 4x4) anyway, seeing as there IS a beta version.. does this not prove clavia are working on it, or at least started to work on it?? any more news on progress with this? thanks. + sansserifgrafik andre.ruello - junior vice president http://www.sansserif.com.au From nostromo at arkaos.net Sun Feb 9 01:19:39 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] GearJ References: Message-ID: <002301c2d01c$6013d790$aa86c850@TWISTIE> Yesterday, I saw a belgian act called 'noirfluo' based on singer+scratcher+modular rack+computer... boy, the modular sounds nice on a big PA ! Cheers, M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ From Terryfunken at aol.com Sun Feb 9 03:59:18 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:09 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> In a message dated 8/2/03 8:00:03 pm, afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com writes: >> You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. >Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. Kofi, everything I've ever heard in 24bit (although it's very high quality) has sounded; "Placed back in a mix" ie, if you try to mix it in with analogue or 16bit signals it sounds 'muddy'. I don't know if anyone else has encountered this? I have had a Line6 Delay modeller that did this and a Boss VF-1 (sucessor to the SE-70)- both of which I ended up getting rid of because their definition was too light. (I much prefer the 'in your face' sound produced by analogue processors and 16-18 bit sound sources. PS Vinyl rules!!! Tom :-) From 3phase at 3phase.de Sun Feb 9 05:12:21 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1F3FA404-3C30-11D7-8E6E-000A957654DE@3phase.de> I tryed it..one went pretty well...dont know if its the right one i post now...no possibility to check -------------- next part -------------- Skipped content of type multipart/appledouble-------------- next part -------------- On Samstag, Feb 8, 2003, at 19:00 Europe/Berlin, boskk _ wrote: > does anyone know, pray tell, if barebones granulising is possible on > the modular? > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From richard at chorlton.com Sun Feb 9 05:24:06 2003 From: richard at chorlton.com (Richard) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> Message-ID: <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> depends on the gear I think and the purpose - vocals and acoustic instruments recorded with great mics and great pres are almost always worth 24bit processing, but the 16 bit on my MPC200xl is just fantastic for drum and rhythm sounds - and it seems to get even better passing it through the shitty 16bit converters on a korg kaoss pad My mate who sold his MPC2000 with the new MCP4000 reckons the new 24bit doesn't sound as good for just the reasons you suggest, but I can't say I prefer crappy old brittle 16 bit CD players to newer higher bit models personally, I'd like to hear a higher resolution NM vinyl certainly does rule and so do tubes but this is not because they are equivalent to a lower bit rate - on the contrary the resolution is surely virtually infinite with older analogue technolgy, in theory at least 24bit/32bit should be able to get closer to this Richard ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 11:59 AM Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > > In a message dated 8/2/03 8:00:03 pm, afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com writes: > > >> You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. > >Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. > > Kofi, everything I've ever heard in 24bit (although it's very high quality) > has sounded; "Placed back in a mix" ie, if you try to mix it in with analogue > or 16bit signals it sounds 'muddy'. I don't know if anyone else has > encountered this? > > I have had a Line6 Delay modeller that did this and a Boss VF-1 (sucessor to > the SE-70)- both of which I ended up getting rid of because their definition > was too light. (I much prefer the 'in your face' sound produced by analogue > processors and 16-18 bit sound sources. > > PS Vinyl rules!!! > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Sun Feb 9 05:26:29 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: If I remember correctly it is a M6 (6 mm) screw that fits on the MM. Anyway it is a European standard screw. I think Quicklock also use M6 screws for their racks, but other brands might use different sizes. Rob > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of > des1gner@optusnet.com.au > Sent: zondag 9 februari 2003 1:18 > To: Nord Modular > Subject: Re: [NM] Mounting hole size? > > > I don't think my 'standard' rack screw fits into the bottom mounting > holes of my nord. You may want to double check that Ian. > > >A standard rack screw fits the hole perfectly- which makes things > >easy. I think most half rack sized units use that standard now. > > > >Ian > > > > > > > >On Saturday, February 8, 2003, at 12:07 AM, Alex Bennett wrote: > > > >>Does anyone know the diameter of the mounting holes on the bottom of the > >>Micro? I'd like to mount mine onto a rack shelf . . . thanks! > >> > >>Alex > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From jneumann at ece.cmu.edu Sun Feb 9 05:29:17 2003 From: jneumann at ece.cmu.edu (John Neumann) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM] microtonality: Tuva? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Try this. It's not "microtonal", but you could easily make it. It uses a low frequency clicky sound sent through the vocal filter with resonance to simulate throat singing. By the way- I pulled it off my Nord onto my computer using "EditorMacOSXD5", which seems to work fine so far. Thanks! -John At 00:32 -0500 2/4/03, e. mokur wrote: >on 2/3/03 2:52 PM, Friday's Child at afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com wrote: > >> Well ... in the case of Indian, not really. > >Are there any Tuva voice like patch in the NM achive? > > >Thanks > > >e. mokur > >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. -------------- next part -------------- Skipped content of type multipart/appledouble-------------- next part -------------- -- John Neumann Project Engineer Micro-electro-mechanical systems (MEMS) ECE Department 1209 Hamerschlag Hall Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA 15213 office: (412) 268-4404 home: (412) 421-2164 FAX: (412) 268-4595 jneumann@ece.cmu.edu http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~jneumann From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Sun Feb 9 05:47:40 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? References: Message-ID: <3E465BFC.3050308@wanadoo.nl> Rob Hordijk wrote: > If I remember correctly it is a M6 (6 mm) screw that fits on the MM. Anyway > it is a European standard screw. I think Quicklock also use M6 screws for > their racks, but other brands might use different sizes. I know we had this discussion before, but M4 fits perfectly, Rob. Although there's always the possibility all my M6 screws are in my M4 tray :-) Could be a M3, though. Anyway, it's a metric one and certainly not M6. And I think we are talking about the two holes at the bottom of the MM...? Not the positions mentioned to mount it in the rack itself, 'cause the MM has no ears... Wout From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Sun Feb 9 08:08:26 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Subject: [NM] granular synthesis > > > does anyone know, pray tell, if barebones granulising is possible on the > modular? > Definitely not if it should be based on samples. (Granular synthesis goes back to the fifties and real vintage granular should of course be done by slicing tape, preferrably on e.g. a Revox A77. Those sound quite well for granular. :-) But if the grains are filled with material from oscillators it is very well possible. The idea is to use one oscillator to generate a stream of grains. By using a S&H on the pitch input of this oscillator and clocking this S&H with the output of the oscillator an irregular stream of grain envelopes can be generated, depending on the signal (e.g. noise) and signallevel on the input of the S&H. By hardsyncing other oscillators and multiplying (=ringmodulating) their outputs with the grain envelopes signal by using a Gain Controller or AM input on the second oscillator module, the grains come into being. To understand the thing it is best to draw the successive waveforms on a piece of scrappaper. An empty packet of cigarettes picked up from the floor and the gorilla at the bar his girlfriend's eyeliner pencil will definitely work. ;-)) Here is an example of some messing about. Nothing really serious, just to give an idea. Have fun, Rob > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Granular_Example.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 4011 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030209/14f82304/Granular_Example.obj From walters at doubtfulpalace.com Sun Feb 9 10:32:31 2003 From: walters at doubtfulpalace.com (Tim Walters) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> Message-ID: >the resolution is surely >virtually infinite with older analogue technolgy, in theory at least This is a common belief, but it's quite wrong. "Virtually infinite" resolution would mean a "virtually infinite" signal-to-noise ratio, which vinyl certainly doesn't have. -- Free Exquisite Music : The Doubtful Palace : http://www.doubtfulpalace.com From afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com Sun Feb 9 10:49:06 2003 From: afromodulator at yefrewenchi.com (Friday's Child) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:10 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> Message-ID: <82242597576.20030209104906@yefrewenchi.com> In an earlier message Terryfunken had written: >>> You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. To which Friday's Child responded: >>Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. On 2/9/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > Kofi, everything I've ever heard in 24bit (although it's very high quality) > has sounded; "Placed back in a mix" I think I know what you mean. > ie, if you try to mix it in with analogue > or 16bit signals it sounds 'muddy'. I wouldn't have chosen those words, but again I think I know what you mean. > I don't know if anyone else has > encountered this? A cautious "Yes" from me!! Probably because of a different choice of words. > I have had a Line6 Delay modeller that did this and a Boss VF-1 (sucessor to > the SE-70)- both of which I ended up getting rid of because their definition > was too light. I.e. "less you can do with it"?? That's to say, all you ever got was "more of the same", rather than a variation in sounds across its spectrum? > (I much prefer the 'in your face' sound produced by analogue > processors and 16-18 bit sound sources. I basically agree. > PS Vinyl rules!!! I definitely agree. But ... errrrr .... all of this, Tom, gets perilously close to that old chestnut of a debate about "digital versus analogue", with one lot saying "analogue rules, digital sucks" and the other lot saying the opposite. All that's generated is a lot of heat. As that Zen Master, Sensei Roland said ... > [] When it can be perfect, > imperfection will be the new standard:) Bottom line ... I personally much prefer analogue. But I think it's also because it's what I grew up with. I've therefore formed the basic gut feeling that that's what things SHOULD sound like. However, there's a lot of people messing around with sound and sound design these days who've possibly never even seen a vinyl record, never mind had their hands on a nice Linn Sondek or similar. My children's friends think my record collection is "cool", but don't really take it seriously as a recording medium. They'd rather have their CD's. The basic difference between the two, as far as I can see, is that of how recorded information is encoded. Analogue: a continuously changing signal; digital: the assigning of finite values to finite data over a finite periods of time. To an analogue device an incoming signal is continuously changing in level, while to a digital device it's something that's broken up into samples with each of those samples having a definite numerical value. That value is held for the entire duration of the sample, even though the period of the sample can be very short. The supporters of digital argue that the higher is the sampling rate, the more "accurate" is the sound. Contrariwise, the lower is the sampling rate then the less accurate is the resulting approximation to "the real thing". Given a high enough sampling rate then the real question becomes ... can a human really perceive that they're not "really" getting a "real" e.g. sine wave out of the device. But ... IMO the above is a bit of a simplistic question in a musical context. There's never "only" the one factor. Take a chorus effect, for example. In a digital unit the oscillator doing the chorusing is digital. If it is running slowly then you can run into "problems" if the sampling rate is not particularly high. Same with a digitally controlled wah-wah effect. Here, the filter position is not infinitely variable but has to do a hop, a skip and a jump from one value to another. Now ... the question of whether or not these are "real" choruses or "real" wah-wahs surely in the end depends upon what the person is used to, and the precise nature of the effect that they want to apply. It's very easy to call these artefacts "so-obviously-digital" ... but only when you've actually heard the analogue variety often enough to be able to make an informed and critical comparison. And even then, it becomes a question of which one a person prefers. But ... even setting stuff down on TAPE alters it somewhat from "the real thing". Or ... one can spend hours trying to decide upon a choice and placement of mikes in order to "get the best" out of a performance. Analogue has its own issues, and they're so often a part of the "tube versus transistor" debate. A tube amp has a very characteristic way of clipping sounds. That's what produces that very special distortion beloved by many electric guitarists. Tubes round off the peaks of sound signals. As the volume is increased and the tubes are driven harder, so do those peaks become more and more flattened. The input sound is therefore increasingly "squashed" and "flattened". The spikes and "hard edges" are rounded off. This is what makes the whole thing sound so velvety smooth and "warm" and "rich". There's a constant change in the nature of the signal because it is a constantly variable one. Additionally, the signal has a "natural" amount of compression applied to it. So ... the harder the tube amp is driven, the "richer" it becomes. It never really sounds "harsh" in the way that's characteristic of digital and/or transistorized devices. Transistors and digital stuff don't only hard-clip audio signals. They can create harsh and sharp corners where there seemed to de none before. You end up with a signal that has hard and sharp tops and bottoms. And not only that, but when you crank the volume up you just make the harshness louder and not warmer. Moral ... if you want to keep all that really annoying high end harsh sounding stuff out of your and your ears, then get a good tube amp. Immediate result ... "better" sounding (a little factoid from Kofi not to be mistaken for a "mere opinion"); "warmer" sounding (another little factoid from Kofi also not to be mistaken for a "mere opinion") music. So simply by going to tape, you've immediately got some gentle rounding and compression going on. That's by the very simple nature of the medium. You just don't get that with digital. But ... that's because in it's own kind of way, a digital recorder has the possibility to be "better". A good digital recorder working doesn't really DO anything to the sound. It "just" converts that sound "straight" to a string of samples and at a resolution that really does quite a good job of fooling the ear that it's "natural". If you throw a sound with lots of jagged peaks at such a converter, then that's what you'll get out. You'll get none of the "warmth" and "presence" that analogue recording seems to give. There's just not that rounding or compression. Of course, the old digital devices were not nearly as "good" as the ones there are around now. And ... probably effects like overdrive should really always be done analogue, just as there are some effects you don't have a prayer of creating outside the digital medium. Overall, though, the unique characteristics given to a recorded sound by analogue treatments simply have no correspondence in the digital arena ... but the same applies the other way too. Yes ... people are designing some rather good algorithms to get closer and closer to "the real thing", but I sometimes wonder why they bother. But ... that's just me. But once again ... you have to have something to compare your digital overdrive to before you can make such comparisons. Yes ... I totally agree that a digital overdrive gadget does sound a bit like crunchy glass in the ear, once you've heard "the real thing" ... but that's only because people like me feel that they already know what "the real thing" SHOULD sound like. And personally ... I prefer the tube driven sound. For the same reason. IMHO it's what that effect SHOULD sound like. But ... I do think this is a personal preference. I do find it a bit hard to understand how anyone could prefer the digital variety once they've heard both ... but there's a lot of weirdos and wackos in the world and I guess it's best to just pray that people like that don't get their hands on guns and nuclear bombs and weapons of mass destruction otherwise we're all in trouble ... and then just leave it at that!! So, as far as I can see, Tom, this is a matter of choosing your favourite brand of poison. Why does analogue produce it's particular brand of effects? As far as I can see it's because it suffers from exactly the same problem that digital suffers from, and that's the intrinsic imperfection of the world. It's not exactly as if there's a simple choice between the digital problems of signal-to-noise and the analogue ones. Analogue has trouble too, and that's what gives it its character. All that stuff about distortion and compression is happening precisely because of the same issues of signal to noise that one basically has in the digital domain. This is partly why people argue for hours about "what are the best speakers" etc. Signal-to-noise problems are intrinsic here, and so it just becomes a question of which particular kind of baggage you prefer. I don't see that this is a question of "rightness" or "wrongnees", although to be honest in my humble opinion anyone who "prefers" digital is a bit cloth-eared and a few trees short of a full forest but that's another issue. Essentially, though, this question of tube and transistor, analogue and digital will probably never go away because it's humans who make the ultimate decision on "betterness" and "appropriateness". And that immediately means that there's more involved than just how the equipment "sounds" per se. Immediately involved in how it SHOULD sound ... and often in a specific context. And ... different people simply have a different idea on what "a good sound" is. And to those who've spent most of their lives listening to digital, they're usually pretty clear how things SHOULD sound -- no if's and's or but's!! My opinion? Pretty close to yours, I guess. I'm an unashamed Neanderthal and retrograde. I actually LIKE analogue. I _like_ vinyl. I prefer it. But then again ... hey!!! ... I even like the sound of the crumhorn, the lute and the kora (which is still going strong, I might add!!). But ... truth is ... I also LOVE the sound of my modular. And ain't nothing analogue there. Except that nice red paint, maybe. And as to what you said above ... > (I much prefer the 'in your face' sound produced by analogue > processors and 16-18 bit sound sources. I agree. There's a nice "graininess" to 16-bit that you can really play around with. It's like going up a staircase ... you can put a creak in here and a slide there and really mess around with it. 24 bit doesn't let you in the cracks so easily. All depending on what you want to do, of course. But ... that said I'd rather record 24 if possible, because it's "better" ... and then downsample it to 16-bit if that's what I decide I want. Which is often, to be honest. In any case, it's where you're going to end up if you want CD's. > PS Vinyl rules!!! I definitely agree. You got no quarrel whatever from me there. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) From richard at chorlton.com Sun Feb 9 12:45:36 2003 From: richard at chorlton.com (Richard) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> Message-ID: <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> but I think high quality tube circuits potentially have a massive dynamic range ? on vinyl - suppose I mean "virtually infinite" resolution within a limited dynamic range.. or is that complete nonesense? Richard ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Walters" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 6:32 PM Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > >the resolution is surely > >virtually infinite with older analogue technolgy, in theory at least > > This is a common belief, but it's quite wrong. "Virtually infinite" > resolution would mean a "virtually infinite" signal-to-noise ratio, > which vinyl certainly doesn't have. > -- > Free Exquisite Music : The Doubtful Palace : http://www.doubtfulpalace.com > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From caphar at wanadoo.fr Sun Feb 9 14:38:39 2003 From: caphar at wanadoo.fr (caphar@wanadoo.fr) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Noisy bass Message-ID: >A patch- especially for dave the rave (who dosen't send any patches- EVER- or  >if he does, they are very boring, because I don't recall any of them;) My turn : a patch dedicated to Terry the Funken (hey, YOU first played with my name :). Yours was...er... educative. Hope now i'll spend more time contributing patches than ridiculous attempts at making fun. And hope you won't find it too boring... :) And yes, I have posted patches under Dax Rave's nickname (well, Ravé isn't exactly a nick, since it's my real name). Sometimes it's a real pain to update all your lists subscriptions with new email addresses. -- Damien Ravé d.rave@freesurf.fr http://www.capharnaum.cjb.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1735 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030209/60673fe2/attachment.obj From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Sun Feb 9 15:07:18 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? References: <3E465BFC.3050308@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: <3E46DF26.5010605@wanadoo.nl> Wout Blommers wrote: > Rob Hordijk wrote: >> If I remember correctly it is a M6 (6 mm) screw that fits on the MM. > I know we had this discussion before, but M4 fits perfectly, Rob. > Although there's always the possibility all my M6 screws are in my M4 > tray :-) Sorry, Rob, but that M5 screw you gave me doesn't fit in the MM. Definitely it is a M4 (4 mm), or maybe Clavia changed it in the past, so it was M5 at first, but changed to M4. Wout From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Sun Feb 9 16:26:54 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? In-Reply-To: <3E46DF26.5010605@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: OK! What I remember (swapped the Micro for a rack maybe two years ago) is that I had to stick some plastic under the Micro and use a plastic screw to avoid a groundloop in the rack it was mounted to. This might be of interest to some. The plastic screw was definitely M5 (just found the bag), but I don't remember how much force I had to use to get that plastic screw in place... So, M4 it is,... however, if one uses a plastic screw and one has a lot of muscle one might be able to go up to M6. ;-)) Rob > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of Wout Blommers > Sent: maandag 10 februari 2003 0:07 > To: Nord Modular > Subject: Re: [NM] Mounting hole size? > > > Wout Blommers wrote: > > Rob Hordijk wrote: > >> If I remember correctly it is a M6 (6 mm) screw that fits on the MM. > > I know we had this discussion before, but M4 fits perfectly, Rob. > > Although there's always the possibility all my M6 screws are in my M4 > > tray :-) > > Sorry, Rob, but that M5 screw you gave me doesn't fit in the MM. > Definitely it is a M4 (4 mm), or maybe Clavia changed it in the past, so > it was M5 at first, but changed to M4. > > Wout > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From alex.bennett at attbi.com Sun Feb 9 17:46:37 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? References: Message-ID: <008301c2d0a6$404f90e0$a90dec0c@attbi.com> Thanks everyone. As usual, a simple question gets as thorough a response as one could possibly hope for! I've also sent the question to Clavia, and I'll report back what they have to say. Alex From lepetitmartien at macmusic.org Sun Feb 9 18:01:35 2003 From: lepetitmartien at macmusic.org (I've got a LASER, Earthman!) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? In-Reply-To: <008301c2d0a6$404f90e0$a90dec0c@attbi.com> Message-ID: le 10/02/2003 02:46, Alex Bennett ? alex.bennett@attbi.com a ?crit?: > I've also sent the question to Clavia, and I'll report back what they have > to say. "Despite earlier information, Clavia has today decided to stop the work of the screw upgrade for the Nord Modular system. Instead, Clavia will focus its development resources on new projects. As a result, Clavia can promise new and exciting screws releases during 2003. Stay tuned!" Denis ??) couldn't resist :))))))))) (for the young and innocent: it's the V4 editor PR a little modified ;) ================================================ lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org Mod?rateur In Chef Moderator In Chief From b.hawk at shaw.ca Sun Feb 9 20:38:08 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <82242597576.20030209104906@yefrewenchi.com> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <82242597576.20030209104906@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: kofi how fast do you type? From b.hawk at shaw.ca Sun Feb 9 20:36:49 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In-Reply-To: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> Message-ID: >In a message dated 8/2/03 8:00:03 pm, afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com writes: > >>> You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. >>Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. > >Kofi, everything I've ever heard in 24bit (although it's very high quality) >has sounded; "Placed back in a mix" ie, if you try to mix it in with analogue check out the new eventide stuff From b.hawk at shaw.ca Sun Feb 9 20:52:48 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> Message-ID: sounds like you re thinking sample rate??? lets not even start with that till someone does a real test with that how would you do that? b+k flat to 100k micing some gangling keys fed to a number of systems, each at a different sample rate feeding a speaker system suitable for the situation that the listener can switch between sample rates? >but I think high quality tube circuits potentially have a massive dynamic >range ? > >on vinyl - suppose I mean "virtually infinite" resolution within a limited >dynamic range.. or is that complete nonesense? > >Richard > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tim Walters" >To: "Nord Modular" >Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 6:32 PM >Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > > >> >the resolution is surely >> >virtually infinite with older analogue technolgy, in theory at least >> >> This is a common belief, but it's quite wrong. "Virtually infinite" >> resolution would mean a "virtually infinite" signal-to-noise ratio, >> which vinyl certainly doesn't have. >> -- >> Free Exquisite Music : The Doubtful Palace : http://www.doubtfulpalace.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Nord-Modular mailing list >> Nord-Modular@code404.com >> http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >> _______________________________________________ >> Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >> may not be redistributed without the express >> consent of the author/creator. >> > >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. From walters at doubtfulpalace.com Sun Feb 9 21:23:08 2003 From: walters at doubtfulpalace.com (Tim Walters) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> Message-ID: >but I think high quality tube circuits potentially have a massive dynamic >range ? Lots of electronic circuits have more dynamic range than 16-bit digital (96 dB). None that I'm aware of has more than 24-bit digital (144 dB in principle, but limited by the analog circuitry in the converter to rather less than that). >on vinyl - suppose I mean "virtually infinite" resolution within a limited >dynamic range.. or is that complete nonesense? Basically, yeah. :) By resolution we mean how closely you can match the voltage that came in. With noise present you can only specify it within + or - some amount. That's the resolution limit. It's true that there's no arbitrary division of voltage in an analog system, but if your error in determining the voltage is considerably greater than those divisions, that doesn't do you any good. Unless you just like the particular qualities of vinyl--the way it changes the sound--which is a matter of taste (sometimes I do, usually I don't). -- Free Exquisite Music : The Doubtful Palace : http://www.doubtfulpalace.com From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 10 01:38:14 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences Message-ID: <1cf.22e29ae.2b78cd06@aol.com> In a message dated 9/2/03 6:50:06 pm, afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com writes: >But ... errrrr .... >all of this, Tom, gets perilously close to that old chestnut of a >debate about "digital versus analogue", with one lot saying "analogue >rules, digital sucks" and the other lot saying the opposite. All >that's generated is a lot of heat. As that Zen Master, Sensei Roland >said ... >> [] When it can be perfect, >> imperfection will be the new standard:) Don't get me wrong, I use digital all the time to record- recording on this powerbook is a hell of a lot simpler and more convienient than using tape (although I have often thought about getting a Revox to master onto (but there is that very clever Craig Anderton trick of recording through a revox, taking the the signal from the playback head and recording back into the computer- a trick still used for recording vocals because of tape's unique compression ability.). I think 24 bit is much better suited to recording entirely acoustic signals too in most cases, but 16 bit files use far less disk space too!! > I have had a Line6 Delay modeller that did this and a Boss VF-1 (sucessor to > the SE-70)- both of which I ended up getting rid of because their definition > was too light. I.e. "less you can do with it"?? That's to say, all you ever got was "more of the same", rather than a variation in sounds across its spectrum? Interesting, very interesting!- I think you hit the nail on the head here. I suppose one arguement that most people have for 24 bit is its 'dynamic range', but I find quite the oppersite;). This was the thing I observed when I tried out the Access Virus. Although the sound and interface were inpressive, it still sounded very 'flat'- odd. Perhaps it's down to the power of algorhythm programming- who knows? Isn't most setting up of digital signals done by maths and not ear??- Perhaps this could be the next stage forward? I know that you can tweek all the internal parameters of programs such as 'T-Racks'- getting a sweeter audio signal (actually T-racks is the one 24 bit processor that does sound good to my ears!:) Long live BOTH digital and analogue!!! Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 10 02:14:17 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit Message-ID: <30.38120836.2b78d579@aol.com> In a message dated 10/2/03 4:53:15 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: >lets not even start with that till someone does a real test with that Tests??, this is what I mean! Everything is made out on tests and how good it looks on paper, but the real test is 'how does it sound with my ears??" Perhaps the whole programming thing needs to be re-thought? Perhaps using analogue circuit emulators (like CAD design programs), where potentiometers could be placed in the circuit, then circuits could be built in the old fashion analogue way but under digital control- and tweeked by ear rather than old fashioned mathematical techniques taken from Hal Chaimberlains "Musical applications of microprocessors". Then the design characteristics of old transistors and valves could emulated in software and then 'pulled' into the circuit from a virtual tool box? (of course the computer would have to be liquid nitrogen-cooled!!) But another interesting thing was when CD's originally came out, the sampling was taken higher and higher until some wise spark thought that 1 bit (Sony?) sounded better than 24 bit times oversampling (Phillips?) Tom :-) From gaunitz at konstfack.se Mon Feb 10 03:21:04 2003 From: gaunitz at konstfack.se (Andreas Gaunitz) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <30.38120836.2b78d579@aol.com> References: <30.38120836.2b78d579@aol.com> Message-ID: >But another interesting thing was when CD's originally came out, the sampling >was taken higher and higher until some wise spark thought that 1 bit (Sony?) >sounded better than 24 bit times oversampling (Phillips?) > >Tom :-) Noone thought 1-bit with x times over sampling sounded better than real 16 bit DAC. It was just cheaper. -A. From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 10 03:57:42 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:11 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit Message-ID: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> In a message dated 10/2/03 11:17:33 am, gaunitz@konstfack.se writes: >Noone thought 1-bit with x times over sampling sounded better than >real 16 bit DAC. It was just cheaper. hmmm- I did! From gaunitz at konstfack.se Mon Feb 10 05:28:59 2003 From: gaunitz at konstfack.se (Andreas Gaunitz) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> Message-ID: At 06.57 -0500 03-02-10, Terryfunken@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 10/2/03 11:17:33 am, gaunitz@konstfack.se writes: > >>Noone thought 1-bit with x times over sampling sounded better than >>real 16 bit DAC. It was just cheaper. > >hmmm- I did! OK, maybe it did, but the reason for the industry to develop 1-bit with higher numbers of oversampling instead of higher bit DACs was economy, if I'm not very mistaken. -A. From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 10 06:19:27 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis Message-ID: <1d2.23439a4.2b790eef@aol.com> In a message dated 9/2/03 4:11:02 pm, rhordijk@xs4all.nl writes: >Definitely not if it should be based on samples. (Granular synthesis goes > >back to the fifties and real vintage granular should of course be done >by > >slicing tape, preferrably on e.g. a Revox A77. Those sound quite well for > >granular. :-) Hey Rob, have you heard 'Luna Park' by Tod Dockstader?- If not, you can get it from 'Starkland Records' (based in the USA). - It's the most fantastic tape manipulation (very musical too:) I've heard yet- recommended, highly! (what's more incredible, is that it contains NO synthesisers whatsover- that's of course if you don't count an old Heathkit test oscillator with the ground removed, (to make it ultra-unstable) as a synth! Most of these recordings were made with 3 reel to reel tape machines, and whatever Dockstader could lay his hands on (including a totally mad sample of Adolf Hitler sped up and down, while a horny alley-cat cries in the distance!!!!) As Eric Dolphy would say;- "Out to Lunch!" best, Tom :-) From grantransom at totalise.co.uk Mon Feb 10 06:48:26 2003 From: grantransom at totalise.co.uk (Grant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] granular synthesis References: <1d2.23439a4.2b790eef@aol.com> Message-ID: <001b01c2d113$78d36960$0987fea9@grantransom> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [NM] granular synthesis > > In a message dated 9/2/03 4:11:02 pm, rhordijk@xs4all.nl writes: > > >Definitely not if it should be based on samples. (Granular synthesis goes > > > >back to the fifties and real vintage granular should of course be done > >by > > > >slicing tape, preferrably on e.g. a Revox A77. Those sound quite well for > > > >granular. :-) > > Hey Rob, have you heard 'Luna Park' by Tod Dockstader?- If not, you can get > it from 'Starkland Records' (based in the USA). - It's the most fantastic > tape manipulation (very musical too:) I've heard yet- recommended, highly! > (what's more incredible, is that it contains NO synthesisers whatsover- > that's of course if you don't count an old Heathkit test oscillator with the > ground removed, (to make it ultra-unstable) as a synth! Most of these > recordings were made with 3 reel to reel tape machines, and whatever > Dockstader could lay his hands on (including a totally mad sample of Adolf > Hitler sped up and down, while a horny alley-cat cries in the distance!!!!) > > As Eric Dolphy would say;- "Out to Lunch!" Not Granular, but I thaught this page was very interesting, regarding the "Dr Who" theme. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Mark_Ayres/DWTheme.htm Grant. From lennart at regebro.nu Mon Feb 10 07:14:18 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli> <002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> Message-ID: <3E47C1CA.6030405@regebro.nu> Richard wrote: > on vinyl - suppose I mean "virtually infinite" resolution within a limited > dynamic range.. or is that complete nonesense? Yes, it is. :) You don't have virtually infinte resolution with analog. In fact, you don't have "resolution" in the digital sense at all. You have noise/hiss instead. What you do have in both systems are bandwidth, and dynamic range. I guess that in theory these are both better in vinyl, but in practice they are almost always better on CD. But on CD you have some digital artifacts which together twith the virtually flat frequency response often gives you a sound that sounds harder than analog, which often has some lumps and bumps, frequently emphasizing bass and deemphasizing treble. All in all this means that some people prefer analog thanks to it's warm, fuzzy sound, while in the 80's, when the digital sound still was new, most people preferred digital, thanks to the clean, flat sound. Today it's mostly a matter of taste/religion. From lennart at regebro.nu Mon Feb 10 07:17:03 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> Andreas Gaunitz wrote: > OK, maybe it did, but the reason for the industry to develop 1-bit with > higher numbers of oversampling instead of higher bit DACs was economy, > if I'm not very mistaken. Yes, because if you made a standard 16-bit DAC for the same cost as a 1-bit oversampling one, it would sound like shit. So, yes, 1-bit sounded better, if you considered cost. I'm sure that with enough money you could probably make a 1-bit oversampling DAC that sounded just as good as a high-quality 16-bit one. :) From kyrilgv at mail.ru Mon Feb 10 07:22:28 2003 From: kyrilgv at mail.ru (Kyril Golovatchev) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special References: <20030209200019.23556A3@roland.code404.com> Message-ID: <257.030211@mail.ru> Dear List, I have never owned any real Moog synths, though I admire at sounds people produce with ones. This time it was Another Mellow Winter by Mellow that forced me to get close to details of the bass sound in the song. Fat (sorry for a banal description) but not intrusive bass makes me feel that it is a filter that makes the bass sound so warm but distinctive. The problem is when I filter a Saw in my NMK the sound gets a bit dull. I admit that micromodulations of pitch and/or something else can improve the simulation of that moogy basses. But I think the problem with my filtering is a diminution of high-freq component. As I closely listen to that moogy bass I feel there are high freqs that make the sound distinctive. By not filtering, I get an irritating saw-or-something (after eq-ing) sound lacking the warmth. I understand, the best imitation of a moog is the moog. But what is special with it? It doesn't sound dull, though not harsh, just warm and mellow. NM? Kyril From zwart.1 at hccnet.nl Mon Feb 10 05:55:51 2003 From: zwart.1 at hccnet.nl (Black Noise) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <82242597576.20030209104906@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <000001c2d119$a1d873e0$e58979c3@zwart> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pedro Monkeyfinger" < b.hawk@shaw.ca > To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 5:38 AM Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > kofi how fast do you type? Well... yes how fast is your typerate. 16 or 24? I gess my typerate is less then yours. But dous that mean that what I have to say is better? Or do you just like it better (or not ;). Is'nt it just that what it is all about? I can not type so fast so I try to say it in a few words. Inperfection is not the new standard. It's just the way of things. It's all IMVVVHO about what inperfections you personaly like better. J(ohan) Z(wart) > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From zwart.1 at hccnet.nl Mon Feb 10 07:26:41 2003 From: zwart.1 at hccnet.nl (Black Noise) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com> <82242597576.20030209104906@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <000101c2d119$a31efda0$e58979c3@zwart> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Friday's Child" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 7:49 PM Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences > In an earlier message Terryfunken had written: > >>> You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. > > To which Friday's Child responded: > >>Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. > > On 2/9/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > > Kofi, everything I've ever heard in 24bit (although it's very high quality) > > has sounded; "Placed back in a mix" > I think I know what you mean. I just was listening to a violin concerto (24 bit recording) and I never had the impression that the violin was placed back in the mix. Although there were some intrumens that sounded is if the were in the back of the orchestra. > > > ie, if you try to mix it in with analogue > > or 16bit signals it sounds 'muddy'. My guess is that "it" depends or how "it " is recorded and what "it" is that is recorded. "It" is never going to be better then the original (unless you use close micing in a acousticly terrible space you may get more likeble results). But in other cases you may like the distorted sound of the recording better. Technicly spoken 24 bit 96 Khz is better and 24 bit 128 Khz even more so becouse it means less harmonic distortion. (btw. dynamic range is the same) You may still ending up liking the 16 bit or analog recording better. Maybe just becouse you mis the old familiar rumble, tiks and cracles. Or the smell of the vinil end the paper from the cover. (I personaly like the smell of the Scotch tape.) A taperecording on 15 or 7.5 inch p/s is technicly better then on 3 3/4 inch p/s on the same tapemachine with the same tape. In the end you just use the most suiteble technic for the job at hand what ever that may be. Kofi has written > So, as far as I can see, Tom, this is a matter of choosing your > favourite brand of poison. Well there you have it > I don't see > that this is a question of "rightness" or "wrongnees", Precisely It all ands up being analog. although to be > honest in my humble opinion anyone who "prefers" digital is a bit > cloth-eared and a few trees short of a full forest but that's another > issue. Yes that it is. > > Essentially, though, this question of tube and transistor, analogue > and digital will probably never go away because it's humans who make > the ultimate decision on "betterness" and "appropriateness". And that > immediately means that there's more involved than just how the > equipment "sounds" per se. Immediately involved in how it SHOULD sound > ... and often in a specific context. And ... different people simply have a > different idea on what "a good sound" is. And to those who've spent > most of their lives listening to digital, they're usually pretty clear > how things SHOULD sound -- no if's and's or but's!! > > My opinion? Pretty close to yours, I guess. I'm an unashamed Neanderthal and retrograde. As one of the old dinasours I second that. > > PS Vinyl rules!!! > I definitely agree. Vinyl dus not rule IMVVVMO, but vinyl may be your rule. Anyway I dont want to be ruled out {:-) J(ohan) Z(wart) > > With every good wish, > K(ofi) B(usia) > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From duofauve at videotron.ca Mon Feb 10 07:41:22 2003 From: duofauve at videotron.ca (Pierre A Gauthier) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special References: <20030209200019.23556A3@roland.code404.com> <257.030211@mail.ru> Message-ID: <006a01c2d11a$dd447040$9600a8c0@DUOFAUVE> I owned a large modular MooG (system 55) All I can tell you is it's so special because the 904 Lowpass filter is a masterpiece of design considering that it's all made with transistor no IC and to proove that the filter is the heart of the system Bob Moog told me that in the early days he did not have the money to patent the whole system so he choose to have the 904 lowpas filter to be patented (as the original design) And also the Modular MooG was made with military grade componants. almost indestructible. I still have the shematics (plans) of the whole Moog system if tou want to take a closer look. Pierre A Gauthier autchose@videotron.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kyril Golovatchev" To: Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 10:22 AM Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > Dear List, > > I have never owned any real Moog synths, though I admire at sounds > people produce with ones. This time it was Another Mellow Winter by > Mellow that forced me to get close to details of the bass sound in the > song. > > Fat (sorry for a banal description) but not intrusive bass makes me > feel that it is a filter that makes the bass sound so warm but > distinctive. The problem is when I filter a Saw in my NMK the sound > gets a bit dull. I admit that micromodulations of pitch and/or > something else can improve the simulation of that moogy basses. But I > think the problem with my filtering is a diminution of high-freq > component. As I closely listen to that moogy bass I feel there are > high freqs that make the sound distinctive. By not filtering, I get > an irritating saw-or-something (after eq-ing) sound lacking the > warmth. > > I understand, the best imitation of a moog is the moog. But what is > special with it? It doesn't sound dull, though not harsh, just warm > and mellow. > > NM? > > Kyril > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From kulagin at car-music.ru Mon Feb 10 07:49:48 2003 From: kulagin at car-music.ru (Alexander Kulagin) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com><002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli><002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> Message-ID: <02d801c2d11c$0d3287a0$da0110ac@carmus> Regrettably, quality record does not depend from converters stright. If speak of ADC, that sometimes old linear 16-bit or 18-bit converters sounded better, than modern 24-x bit ADC. Depends on concrete realization and from technology. The Majority modern 24-bit converters work on Delta-Sigma algorithm that tells on quality of the record. WBR, Alexander > >but I think high quality tube circuits potentially have a massive dynamic > >range ? > > Lots of electronic circuits have more dynamic range than 16-bit > digital (96 dB). None that I'm aware of has more than 24-bit digital > (144 dB in principle, but limited by the analog circuitry in the > converter to rather less than that). > From brendanheading at clara.co.uk Mon Feb 10 08:21:00 2003 From: brendanheading at clara.co.uk (Brendan Heading) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:12 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special Message-ID: > I owned a large modular MooG (system 55) All I can tell you is it's so > special because the 904 Lowpass filter is a masterpiece of design Actually I would say the reason why the RA Moog filter sounds so unique is because it was *not* a masterpiece of design from an electronics point of view. A triangle wave coming from a Moog oscillator does not look very triangular when you put it through an oscilloscope. However it was certainly pleasing from a musical point of view :) > considering that it's all made with transistor no IC All filters made at that time were like this. However none of them sound like a Moog filter. Even now, even using the same schematics, it' s tricky to reproduce that sound. > And also the Modular MooG was made with military grade componants. almost > indestructible. I can assure you that if I took a coal hammer to the Modular Moog it would be quite easy to destroy it. Military grade components are just like ordinary ones, except they have much tighter tolerances. It doesn't usually mean they are more durable. It depends on how old your Modular is; the later oscillators were built using mil. spec components for tuning stability. Certainly later revisions of the Minimoog had these too. However I don't think this is anything to do with the filter. -- Brendan -- From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 10 09:00:23 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special Message-ID: <8f.29407a6c.2b7934a7@aol.com> In a message dated 10/2/03 4:59:41 pm, Terryfunken writes: >In a message dated 10/2/03 3:25:56 pm, kyrilgv@mail.ru writes: > >>Fat (sorry for a banal description) > >I hate that word 'fat' (or even worse, 'phat' !;). Warm is a much better >description :) - How can a korg 700 or a yamaha cs5 ever sound 'fat'? I >think it is funny when dealers try to flog junk by calling it 'vintage-rare'- >when the whole reason it was rare in the first place was because it WAS >crap!! hehehe > >My favourite ever Moog was the Rogue (although I wouldn't scoff at the >mini or micro (a real bargain too:) if I owned one! > >Tom :-) From tdecker61 at hotmail.com Mon Feb 10 09:03:24 2003 From: tdecker61 at hotmail.com (P. Todd Decker) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? Message-ID: Yes, this is bad news. But I happent to have an unreleased beta-screw that still will work with the old modulars. It was secretly leaked from a beta-tester, but since Clavia has halted development of screws I release it to all in the name of rightesness. :-) >From: "I've got a LASER, Earthman!" >Reply-To: Nord Modular >To: Nord Modular >Subject: Re: [NM] Mounting hole size? >Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 03:01:35 +0100 > >le 10/02/2003 02:46, Alex Bennett à alex.bennett@attbi.com a écrit : > > > I've also sent the question to Clavia, and I'll report back what they >have > > to say. > >"Despite earlier information, Clavia has today decided to stop the work of >the screw upgrade for the Nord Modular system. Instead, Clavia will focus >its development resources on new projects. > >As a result, Clavia can promise new and exciting screws releases during >2003. Stay tuned!" > >Denis žž) couldn't resist :))))))))) >(for the young and innocent: it's the V4 editor PR a little modified ;) >================================================ >lepetitmartien http://www.macmusic.org >Modérateur In Chef Moderator In >Chief > >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From Terryfunken at aol.com Mon Feb 10 09:10:48 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special Message-ID: <125.1e0d6c21.2b793718@aol.com> In a message dated 10/2/03 4:21:58 pm, brendanheading@clara.co.uk writes: >All filters made at that time were like this. However none of them >sound like a Moog filter. Even now, even using the same schematics, it' >s tricky to reproduce that sound. > Interesting enough, Lovetone once told me that they copied the original EH Big Muff design and put it on a veroboard (-later using a CAD design program) all with original spec components and it still didn't sound like the original. It was only when the circuit track design of the board (including any tolerence built into the copper strip) was faithfully reproduced, that the sound came very close to that of the original. Strange but interesting. Tom :-) From dpeck at euphonix.com Mon Feb 10 10:13:21 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? In-Reply-To: <15199826693.20030207190937@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <002801c2d130$18094010$640314cf@euphonix.com> Thanks to all for the suggestions! I'll check it out. Dave Peck > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of Friday's Child > Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 7:10 PM > To: Nord Modular > Subject: Re: [NM] Multiple NM's on a PC? > > > On 2/7/2003 Dave Peck wrote: > > > I'm thinking about getting a second NM. > > The AMT8 or Unitor will immediately give you 8 ins and 8 outs. From dpeck at euphonix.com Mon Feb 10 11:24:11 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] (OT) 16bit In-Reply-To: <30.38120836.2b78d579@aol.com> Message-ID: <002901c2d139$fd918a30$640314cf@euphonix.com> FWIW, I have found this to be true. It is possible to build audio circuits (analog or digital) that have good looking specs, but just don't reproduce a signal very well when you put actual musical signals through them. Things like the balance of high order harmonic distortion to low order harmonic distortion, the ability to reproduce successive fast transients accurately, etc., can greatly affect transparency. Part of my job involves critical A/B listening tests to evaluate high resolution digital converters running at up to 24 bit/192kHz. And when you have accurate amps, revealing speakers with proper imaging, and good source material for the A/B, it is surprising how well the human ear can detect flaws in even the best audio circuits. Depending on the type of distortion, the type of audio material, and other factors, in some cases you can clearly hear distortion products which are more than -100dBfs. This distortion can manifest in the form of a sudden widening or narrowing of the stereo image when A/B switching, less detail and resolution in complex acoustic signals like acoustic reverb tails, etc. You may not know that you are hearing a cluster of distortion spikes from the 6th through 10th harmonic at -108dBfs, but you definitely hear that there is something different about the signal when you A/B. And conversely, some circuits that don't have the most impressive numbers can sound "good", although they may not be any more "accurate". You'll still hear a difference when you A/B, but the difference may not be perceived as objectionable or as having less resolution. (Regarding analog vs. digital, just for the record, my opinion based on my experience is that good analog and digital sound good, and bad analog and digital sound bad.) Dave Peck > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of > Terryfunken@aol.com > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 2:14 AM > To: nord-modular@code404.com > Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > > > > In a message dated 10/2/03 4:53:15 am, b.hawk@shaw.ca writes: > > >lets not even start with that till someone does a real test with that > > Tests??, this is what I mean! Everything is made out on tests and > how good it > looks on paper, but the real test is 'how does it sound with my ears??" > From dpeck at euphonix.com Mon Feb 10 13:01:38 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special In-Reply-To: <257.030211@mail.ru> Message-ID: <002a01c2d147$9a3baac0$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi Kyril, Well, I don't have a Minimoog, but I do have a Moog Prodigy, which is sort of the Minimoog's dorky little brother. I bought it for $50 at a garage sale many years ago. It's no Minimoog, but it does sound nice and rather Moogish. I had fun working on the virtual Chroma and the virtual Arp Odyssey, maybe I could try to make a decent virtual Prodigy. Or if anyone on the list wants to, uh, "loan" me their Minimoog for an indefinite period of time I could try to replicate it :-) Dave Peck > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of Kyril Golovatchev > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 7:22 AM > To: nord-modular@code404.com > Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > > > Dear List, > > I have never owned any real Moog synths, though I admire at sounds > people produce with ones. This time it was Another Mellow Winter by > Mellow that forced me to get close to details of the bass sound in the > song. > > Fat (sorry for a banal description) but not intrusive bass makes me > feel that it is a filter that makes the bass sound so warm but > distinctive. The problem is when I filter a Saw in my NMK the sound > gets a bit dull. I admit that micromodulations of pitch and/or > something else can improve the simulation of that moogy basses. But I > think the problem with my filtering is a diminution of high-freq > component. As I closely listen to that moogy bass I feel there are > high freqs that make the sound distinctive. By not filtering, I get > an irritating saw-or-something (after eq-ing) sound lacking the > warmth. > > I understand, the best imitation of a moog is the moog. But what is > special with it? It doesn't sound dull, though not harsh, just warm > and mellow. > > NM? > > Kyril > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From grantransom at totalise.co.uk Mon Feb 10 13:19:53 2003 From: grantransom at totalise.co.uk (Grant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special References: <125.1e0d6c21.2b793718@aol.com> Message-ID: <003301c2d14a$2ae60d20$0987fea9@grantransom> ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 5:10 PM Subject: Re: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > In a message dated 10/2/03 4:21:58 pm, brendanheading@clara.co.uk writes: > > >All filters made at that time were like this. However none of them > >sound like a Moog filter. Even now, even using the same schematics, it' > >s tricky to reproduce that sound. > > > Interesting enough, Lovetone once told me that they copied the original EH > Big Muff design and put it on a veroboard (-later using a CAD design program) > all with original spec components and it still didn't sound like the > original. It was only when the circuit track design of the board (including > any tolerence built into the copper strip) was faithfully reproduced, that > the sound came very close to that of the original. > > Strange but interesting. Yep, and goes some way to explain why people are continually debating Point-to-point wiring versus Circuitboard in Guitar Amps. My home made FuzzFace does sound great though, even with metal resistors et al. :-) (But of course...handpicked ac128's) Grant. From steve.whiteley at spirentcom.com Mon Feb 10 14:12:51 2003 From: steve.whiteley at spirentcom.com (Whiteley, Steve) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Vinyl love was:Please share your synth programming lea rning experiences Message-ID: <629E717C12A8694A88FAA6BEF9FFCD446FDDA1@brigadoon.spirentcom.com> I remember hearing that the vinyl masters had a trade off relationship between signal compression and groove width (playing time). Could this (playing time) compression contribute to the sound difference also? Would music mastered to take advantage of CD technology sound as good on vinyl? -----Original Message----- From: Friday's Child [mailto:afromodulator@yefrewenchi.com] Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 10:49 AM To: Nord Modular Subject: Re: [NM] Please share your synth programming learning experiences In an earlier message Terryfunken had written: >>> You don't get this -imo- with 24bit. To which Friday's Child responded: >>Well ... that bit I'm not QUITE so sure about that. On 2/9/2003 Terryfunken wrote: > Kofi, everything I've ever heard in 24bit (although it's very high quality) > has sounded; "Placed back in a mix" I think I know what you mean. > ie, if you try to mix it in with analogue > or 16bit signals it sounds 'muddy'. I wouldn't have chosen those words, but again I think I know what you mean. > I don't know if anyone else has > encountered this? A cautious "Yes" from me!! Probably because of a different choice of words. > I have had a Line6 Delay modeller that did this and a Boss VF-1 (sucessor to > the SE-70)- both of which I ended up getting rid of because their definition > was too light. I.e. "less you can do with it"?? That's to say, all you ever got was "more of the same", rather than a variation in sounds across its spectrum? > (I much prefer the 'in your face' sound produced by analogue > processors and 16-18 bit sound sources. I basically agree. > PS Vinyl rules!!! I definitely agree. But ... errrrr .... all of this, Tom, gets perilously close to that old chestnut of a debate about "digital versus analogue", with one lot saying "analogue rules, digital sucks" and the other lot saying the opposite. All that's generated is a lot of heat. As that Zen Master, Sensei Roland said ... > [] When it can be perfect, > imperfection will be the new standard:) Bottom line ... I personally much prefer analogue. But I think it's also because it's what I grew up with. I've therefore formed the basic gut feeling that that's what things SHOULD sound like. However, there's a lot of people messing around with sound and sound design these days who've possibly never even seen a vinyl record, never mind had their hands on a nice Linn Sondek or similar. My children's friends think my record collection is "cool", but don't really take it seriously as a recording medium. They'd rather have their CD's. The basic difference between the two, as far as I can see, is that of how recorded information is encoded. Analogue: a continuously changing signal; digital: the assigning of finite values to finite data over a finite periods of time. To an analogue device an incoming signal is continuously changing in level, while to a digital device it's something that's broken up into samples with each of those samples having a definite numerical value. That value is held for the entire duration of the sample, even though the period of the sample can be very short. The supporters of digital argue that the higher is the sampling rate, the more "accurate" is the sound. Contrariwise, the lower is the sampling rate then the less accurate is the resulting approximation to "the real thing". Given a high enough sampling rate then the real question becomes ... can a human really perceive that they're not "really" getting a "real" e.g. sine wave out of the device. But ... IMO the above is a bit of a simplistic question in a musical context. There's never "only" the one factor. Take a chorus effect, for example. In a digital unit the oscillator doing the chorusing is digital. If it is running slowly then you can run into "problems" if the sampling rate is not particularly high. Same with a digitally controlled wah-wah effect. Here, the filter position is not infinitely variable but has to do a hop, a skip and a jump from one value to another. Now ... the question of whether or not these are "real" choruses or "real" wah-wahs surely in the end depends upon what the person is used to, and the precise nature of the effect that they want to apply. It's very easy to call these artefacts "so-obviously-digital" ... but only when you've actually heard the analogue variety often enough to be able to make an informed and critical comparison. And even then, it becomes a question of which one a person prefers. But ... even setting stuff down on TAPE alters it somewhat from "the real thing". Or ... one can spend hours trying to decide upon a choice and placement of mikes in order to "get the best" out of a performance. Analogue has its own issues, and they're so often a part of the "tube versus transistor" debate. A tube amp has a very characteristic way of clipping sounds. That's what produces that very special distortion beloved by many electric guitarists. Tubes round off the peaks of sound signals. As the volume is increased and the tubes are driven harder, so do those peaks become more and more flattened. The input sound is therefore increasingly "squashed" and "flattened". The spikes and "hard edges" are rounded off. This is what makes the whole thing sound so velvety smooth and "warm" and "rich". There's a constant change in the nature of the signal because it is a constantly variable one. Additionally, the signal has a "natural" amount of compression applied to it. So ... the harder the tube amp is driven, the "richer" it becomes. It never really sounds "harsh" in the way that's characteristic of digital and/or transistorized devices. Transistors and digital stuff don't only hard-clip audio signals. They can create harsh and sharp corners where there seemed to de none before. You end up with a signal that has hard and sharp tops and bottoms. And not only that, but when you crank the volume up you just make the harshness louder and not warmer. Moral ... if you want to keep all that really annoying high end harsh sounding stuff out of your and your ears, then get a good tube amp. Immediate result ... "better" sounding (a little factoid from Kofi not to be mistaken for a "mere opinion"); "warmer" sounding (another little factoid from Kofi also not to be mistaken for a "mere opinion") music. So simply by going to tape, you've immediately got some gentle rounding and compression going on. That's by the very simple nature of the medium. You just don't get that with digital. But ... that's because in it's own kind of way, a digital recorder has the possibility to be "better". A good digital recorder working doesn't really DO anything to the sound. It "just" converts that sound "straight" to a string of samples and at a resolution that really does quite a good job of fooling the ear that it's "natural". If you throw a sound with lots of jagged peaks at such a converter, then that's what you'll get out. You'll get none of the "warmth" and "presence" that analogue recording seems to give. There's just not that rounding or compression. Of course, the old digital devices were not nearly as "good" as the ones there are around now. And ... probably effects like overdrive should really always be done analogue, just as there are some effects you don't have a prayer of creating outside the digital medium. Overall, though, the unique characteristics given to a recorded sound by analogue treatments simply have no correspondence in the digital arena ... but the same applies the other way too. Yes ... people are designing some rather good algorithms to get closer and closer to "the real thing", but I sometimes wonder why they bother. But ... that's just me. But once again ... you have to have something to compare your digital overdrive to before you can make such comparisons. Yes ... I totally agree that a digital overdrive gadget does sound a bit like crunchy glass in the ear, once you've heard "the real thing" ... but that's only because people like me feel that they already know what "the real thing" SHOULD sound like. And personally ... I prefer the tube driven sound. For the same reason. IMHO it's what that effect SHOULD sound like. But ... I do think this is a personal preference. I do find it a bit hard to understand how anyone could prefer the digital variety once they've heard both ... but there's a lot of weirdos and wackos in the world and I guess it's best to just pray that people like that don't get their hands on guns and nuclear bombs and weapons of mass destruction otherwise we're all in trouble ... and then just leave it at that!! So, as far as I can see, Tom, this is a matter of choosing your favourite brand of poison. Why does analogue produce it's particular brand of effects? As far as I can see it's because it suffers from exactly the same problem that digital suffers from, and that's the intrinsic imperfection of the world. It's not exactly as if there's a simple choice between the digital problems of signal-to-noise and the analogue ones. Analogue has trouble too, and that's what gives it its character. All that stuff about distortion and compression is happening precisely because of the same issues of signal to noise that one basically has in the digital domain. This is partly why people argue for hours about "what are the best speakers" etc. Signal-to-noise problems are intrinsic here, and so it just becomes a question of which particular kind of baggage you prefer. I don't see that this is a question of "rightness" or "wrongnees", although to be honest in my humble opinion anyone who "prefers" digital is a bit cloth-eared and a few trees short of a full forest but that's another issue. Essentially, though, this question of tube and transistor, analogue and digital will probably never go away because it's humans who make the ultimate decision on "betterness" and "appropriateness". And that immediately means that there's more involved than just how the equipment "sounds" per se. Immediately involved in how it SHOULD sound ... and often in a specific context. And ... different people simply have a different idea on what "a good sound" is. And to those who've spent most of their lives listening to digital, they're usually pretty clear how things SHOULD sound -- no if's and's or but's!! My opinion? Pretty close to yours, I guess. I'm an unashamed Neanderthal and retrograde. I actually LIKE analogue. I _like_ vinyl. I prefer it. But then again ... hey!!! ... I even like the sound of the crumhorn, the lute and the kora (which is still going strong, I might add!!). But ... truth is ... I also LOVE the sound of my modular. And ain't nothing analogue there. Except that nice red paint, maybe. And as to what you said above ... > (I much prefer the 'in your face' sound produced by analogue > processors and 16-18 bit sound sources. I agree. There's a nice "graininess" to 16-bit that you can really play around with. It's like going up a staircase ... you can put a creak in here and a slide there and really mess around with it. 24 bit doesn't let you in the cracks so easily. All depending on what you want to do, of course. But ... that said I'd rather record 24 if possible, because it's "better" ... and then downsample it to 16-bit if that's what I decide I want. Which is often, to be honest. In any case, it's where you're going to end up if you want CD's. > PS Vinyl rules!!! I definitely agree. You got no quarrel whatever from me there. -- With every good wish, K(ofi) B(usia) _______________________________________________ Nord-Modular mailing list Nord-Modular@code404.com http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular _______________________________________________ Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list may not be redistributed without the express consent of the author/creator. From zwart.1 at hccnet.nl Mon Feb 10 07:48:25 2003 From: zwart.1 at hccnet.nl (Black Noise) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com><002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli><002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli> <3E47C1CA.6030405@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <000001c2d157$6478e640$5dd579c3@zwart> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lennart Regebro" To: "Richard" ; "Nord Modular" Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 4:14 PM Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > Richard wrote: > > on vinyl - suppose I mean "virtually infinite" resolution within a limited > > dynamic range.. or is that complete nonesense? > > Yes, it is. :) > > You don't have virtually infinte resolution with analog. In fact, you > don't have "resolution" in the digital sense at all. You have noise/hiss > instead. > > What you do have in both systems are bandwidth, and dynamic range. I > guess that in theory these are both better in vinyl, but in practice > they are almost always better on CD. Well not in practise so due to meganical limitations of the medium. But on CD you have some digital > artifacts which together twith the virtually flat frequency response > often gives you a sound that sounds harder than analog, which often has > some lumps and bumps, frequently emphasizing bass and deemphasizing treble. > > All in all this means that some people prefer analog thanks to it's > warm, fuzzy sound, while in the 80's, when the digital sound still was > new, most people preferred digital, thanks to the clean, flat sound. > Today it's mostly a matter of taste/religion. Preferrence is always personal. That's why the duscussion has no end it just wil never be conclusive. Greetings Johan Zwart > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From erase at analogue.org Mon Feb 10 14:56:07 2003 From: erase at analogue.org (D.E) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special References: <002a01c2d147$9a3baac0$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: <008301c2d157$9935e040$1671d7d9@BoNet> wasn?t the prodigy something cooked by bobmoog and sequential ? so I?ve heard. therefore not sound as "moogish" as say the rogue, mini and so on... anyone ? d ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Peck" To: "Kyril Golovatchev" ; "Nord Modular" Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 10:01 PM Subject: RE: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > Hi Kyril, > > Well, I don't have a Minimoog, but I do have a Moog Prodigy, which is sort > of the Minimoog's dorky little brother. I bought it for $50 at a garage sale > many years ago. It's no Minimoog, but it does sound nice and rather Moogish. > > I had fun working on the virtual Chroma and the virtual Arp Odyssey, maybe I > could try to make a decent virtual Prodigy. Or if anyone on the list wants > to, uh, "loan" me their Minimoog for an indefinite period of time I could > try to replicate it :-) > > Dave Peck > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of Kyril Golovatchev > > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 7:22 AM > > To: nord-modular@code404.com > > Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > > > > > > Dear List, > > > > I have never owned any real Moog synths, though I admire at sounds > > people produce with ones. This time it was Another Mellow Winter by > > Mellow that forced me to get close to details of the bass sound in the > > song. > > > > Fat (sorry for a banal description) but not intrusive bass makes me > > feel that it is a filter that makes the bass sound so warm but > > distinctive. The problem is when I filter a Saw in my NMK the sound > > gets a bit dull. I admit that micromodulations of pitch and/or > > something else can improve the simulation of that moogy basses. But I > > think the problem with my filtering is a diminution of high-freq > > component. As I closely listen to that moogy bass I feel there are > > high freqs that make the sound distinctive. By not filtering, I get > > an irritating saw-or-something (after eq-ing) sound lacking the > > warmth. > > > > I understand, the best imitation of a moog is the moog. But what is > > special with it? It doesn't sound dull, though not harsh, just warm > > and mellow. > > > > NM? > > > > Kyril > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Mon Feb 10 16:14:45 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] Pianet N Message-ID: <3E484075.6050002@wanadoo.nl> Hi, Clavia is in search of a Hohner Pianet N. Anyone? See http://www.clavia.se/News/pianetn.htm Wout From soc at code404.com Mon Feb 10 16:29:24 2003 From: soc at code404.com (Justin Maxwell) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:13 2004 Subject: [NM] The Annual Hotmail Cleansing Message-ID: A few times a year, hotmail's servers screw up and reject all mail for a few days. This makes the server think your account has been disabled. So, if you're a hotmail user, you may need to log in to the code404 control panel and re-enable your subscription. By now you should know how to do this and not ask me & wout to do it for you :) Thanks, Justin -- + + + + + + + + + + + + + http://www.volsoc.com + + + + > compuphonic_machines_program_my_beats___________________> From akubiak1 at tampabay.rr.com Mon Feb 10 16:38:44 2003 From: akubiak1 at tampabay.rr.com (Anthony Kubiak) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] Attachments not coming through References: Message-ID: <001001c2d165$ef318fe0$1eb82041@cas.usf.edu> Again, does anyone know why the patch attachments are greyed out when I use Outlook Express 6.0? I can't open, save, move, etc. any of the patches. tony K. From chsinger at localnet.com Mon Feb 10 16:48:06 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] [OT] Dumping ExpressionMate settings References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> Message-ID: <001401c2d167$407855e0$1d5f20d0@207d511> Hi everyone, I recently bought a Kurzweil ExpressionMate, mostly for its breath controller. It can save its contents via MIDI sysex, and I'd like to do this before I start reprogramming it. Can anyone recommend a small, free MIDI recorder/player, so I can save this sysex info, and restore it into the ExpressionMate if necessary? I've looked around the web, and there seem to be hundreds of them. It's OT, but kinda NM-related... ;^) Chet From gwaltzer at optonline.net Mon Feb 10 17:25:33 2003 From: gwaltzer at optonline.net (Greg Waltzer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] [OT] Dumping ExpressionMate settings References: <001c01c2cf30$3f181d40$0432a141@207d511> <124108193644.20030207212904@yefrewenchi.com> <003501c2cf7c$caae2560$d49428cf@207d511> <93141970622.20030208065201@yefrewenchi.com> <001401c2d167$407855e0$1d5f20d0@207d511> Message-ID: <3E48510D.8070601@optonline.net> Once you learn to program it, you will realize that the presets are not very useful. You would need to customize them for your setup anyway. Also, there is a command to restore any or all of the presets from rom, so you don't need to dump them. Chet Singer wrote: >Hi everyone, > >I recently bought a Kurzweil ExpressionMate, mostly for its breath >controller. It can save its contents via MIDI sysex, and I'd like to do >this before I start reprogramming it. Can anyone recommend a small, free >MIDI recorder/player, so I can save this sysex info, and restore it into the >ExpressionMate if necessary? > >I've looked around the web, and there seem to be hundreds of them. > >It's OT, but kinda NM-related... ;^) > >Chet > > >_______________________________________________ >Nord-Modular mailing list >Nord-Modular@code404.com >http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >_______________________________________________ >Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >may not be redistributed without the express >consent of the author/creator. > > > From alex.bennett at attbi.com Mon Feb 10 18:01:48 2003 From: alex.bennett at attbi.com (Alex Bennett) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] Mounting hole size? References: Message-ID: <001101c2d171$89e9b660$a90dec0c@attbi.com> The official word: Hi Alex, They should be 'M4' threads. Best regards Fredrik, Clavia From jjclark_music at sympatico.ca Mon Feb 10 19:17:55 2003 From: jjclark_music at sympatico.ca (jjclark) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] [PCH] [JJC] References: Message-ID: <001301c2d17c$2b6a93b0$0501a8c0@clarkhome> Some patches. One mellow, the others not. jjclark -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: talk radio.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3289 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030210/a8140ec6/talkradio.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: meditation.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1326 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030210/a8140ec6/meditation.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: harsh filter fm clav.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1767 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030210/a8140ec6/harshfilterfmclav.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: kerouac and the whales.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1946 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030210/a8140ec6/kerouacandthewhales.obj From kyrilgv at mail.ru Tue Feb 11 00:17:44 2003 From: kyrilgv at mail.ru (Kyril Golovatchev) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] Re: Why Minimoog is so special References: <20030210200021.70558A5@roland.code404.com> Message-ID: <3762.030211@mail.ru> From: Pierre A Gauthier > All I can tell you is it's so special because the 904 Lowpass filter > is a masterpiece of design [...] filter is the heart of the system > I still have the shematics (plans) of the whole Moog system if tou want to > take a closer look. From: Brendan Heading > I would say the reason why the RA Moog filter sounds so unique > is because it was *not* a masterpiece of design from an electronics > point of view. A triangle wave coming from a Moog oscillator does not > All filters made at that time were like this. However none of them > sound like a Moog filter. Even now, even using the same schematics, it' > s tricky to reproduce that sound. From: Terryfunken@aol.com > It was only when the circuit track design of the board (including > any tolerence built into the copper strip) was faithfully reproduced, that > the sound came very close to that of the original. [filter design] Well, I guess we can assume that it was the moog filter design that makes its sound unique. Then, what kind of frequency content it makes? Being not a specialist in the field of electronics I have always thought that LP filter just cuts off the high-band range of a sound. (right?) According to that assumption I may say it would not be any high frequences in the sound. But what I hear is at least an illusion of somewhat of a high freq. [osc producing shaped waves] If the triangle is not a pure triangle then I guess one can shape it to some extent. Personally I have an old analog synth that produces a "saw" which barely looks like one. I used equing to get a similar look in the osciloscope (after making all these experiments I got too tired to have an "objective" point of hearing - I don't know whether both simulated and original shaped saws _sounded_ similar). Anyway, that moogy sound really has a very mellow character but cuts trough the mix, absolutely not obtrusive but consistent. Special filtering, osc shaping or something else? Kyril From Terryfunken at aol.com Tue Feb 11 00:52:02 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] Pianet N Message-ID: <107.1f4e035b.2b7a13b2@aol.com> In a message dated 11/2/03 12:16:24 am, blommoo@wanadoo.nl writes: >Clavia is in search of a Hohner Pianet N. >Anyone? Why do they want to imitate that pile of shit?- I wish they would search for a UNIX programmer instead!!!!! From b.hawk at shaw.ca Tue Feb 11 01:06:16 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> Message-ID: >you considered cost. I'm sure that with enough money you could >probably make a 1-bit oversampling DAC that sounded just as good as >a high-quality 16-bit one. :) no, math sez you can t From olaf at interactivelink.nl Tue Feb 11 01:55:16 2003 From: olaf at interactivelink.nl (Olaf Molenveld) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <102.26095aa7.2b779c96@aol.com><002c01c2d03e$8717d130$082d7ad5@richardw98tcli><002101c2d07c$34589d60$75067ad5@richardw98tcli><3E47C1CA.6030405@regebro.nu> <000001c2d157$6478e640$5dd579c3@zwart> Message-ID: <004101c2d1b3$aef41c60$0100a8c0@olaf> my opinions after doing a lot of reading and research into this matter: * most important: conditioning... we're used to hearing stuff produced, recorded and mastered for and on analogue devices like 2tracks, tubes, vinyl etc.... the characteristics applied to the sound are what we are used to.... * a vinyl recording is much worse than a digital recording (even a 16bits 44.1KHz) but the vinyl reproduction chain (ie turntable, cartridge, needle, phono preamp etc) create all kinds of distortions, phase-shifts (these first two mainly due to the needle tracking the groove), and frequency boosts and cuts (this mainly due to resonance and feedback in the cartridge and tone-arm) so in the end some big kind of enhancement is going on to the sound....it's like a exciter/compressor/EQ doing it's work on the audio cut in vinyl.. Olaf ----- Original Message ----- From: Black Noise To: Nord Modular Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lennart Regebro" > To: "Richard" ; "Nord Modular" > > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 4:14 PM > Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > > > > Richard wrote: > > > on vinyl - suppose I mean "virtually infinite" resolution within a > limited > > > dynamic range.. or is that complete nonesense? > > > > Yes, it is. :) > > > > You don't have virtually infinte resolution with analog. In fact, you > > don't have "resolution" in the digital sense at all. You have noise/hiss > > instead. > > > > What you do have in both systems are bandwidth, and dynamic range. I > > guess that in theory these are both better in vinyl, but in practice > > they are almost always better on CD. > Well not in practise so due to meganical limitations of the medium. > > But on CD you have some digital > > artifacts which together twith the virtually flat frequency response > > often gives you a sound that sounds harder than analog, which often has > > some lumps and bumps, frequently emphasizing bass and deemphasizing > treble. > > > > All in all this means that some people prefer analog thanks to it's > > warm, fuzzy sound, while in the 80's, when the digital sound still was > > new, most people preferred digital, thanks to the clean, flat sound. > > Today it's mostly a matter of taste/religion. > Preferrence is always personal. That's why the duscussion has no end it just > wil never be conclusive. > > Greetings > Johan Zwart > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From jjclark_music at sympatico.ca Tue Feb 11 06:26:47 2003 From: jjclark_music at sympatico.ca (jjclark) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pedro Monkeyfinger" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 4:06 AM Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > > >you considered cost. I'm sure that with enough money you could > >probably make a 1-bit oversampling DAC that sounded just as good as > >a high-quality 16-bit one. :) > > > > no, math sez you can t Which math is this? Sigma-Delta (or Delta-Sigma) converters can get arbitrarily high accuracy, depending on the over-sampling ratio. Basically, oversampling spreads the quantization error noise over the frequency range of the oversampling clock. Of course, 1-bit quantization error is larger than say 16-bit quantization, but this error is spread over, say a bandwidth that is 128 times larger. Then you can add in noise-spectrum shaping techniques, where the quantization noise is concentrated in a frequency band above the audio band, where it can be mostly filtered out. Recent multi-level techniques (equivalent to 2 bits) improve this even more. >From a cost-standpoint the main advantage is that it is simple these days to make digital circuits that can run at a very high speed, but still very difficult to make analog circuits that run at a high speed. So the sigma-delta converters can take advantage of the high speed of digital circuits to do analog conversion. Jim From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Tue Feb 11 06:21:49 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Subject: Re: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > > > > I owned a large modular MooG (system 55) All I can tell you is it's > so > > special because the 904 Lowpass filter is a masterpiece of design > > Actually I would say the reason why the RA Moog filter sounds so unique > is because it was *not* a masterpiece of design from an electronics > point of view. A triangle wave coming from a Moog oscillator does not > look very triangular when you put it through an oscilloscope. However > it was certainly pleasing from a musical point of view :) > To quote the Memorymoog service manual (page 18): (Start of quote - ) The filter signal is obtained differentially by a 353 BIFET OP AMP U20A and U20B. The 353 has a gain factor of approximately 4, which brings the signal up to about 100 millivolts, when the filter is all the way up. That signal has enough drive to obtain distortion in U22, the 3080 OTA, for a "fat" overdrive sound. The distortion is severe enough to alter a triangle waveform into a sinewave at the output with the LEVEL controls up and the VCF "open" all the way. The offset is cancelled with VCA TRIM R140 which takes out any "thumping sounds". Next, the signal is applied to a 3080 OTA, the EMPHASIS amplifier U21, where it is attenuated because distortion is wanted in the final output VCA but NOT in the EMPHASIS circuit as it creates undesirable sound effects. ( - End of quote) My guess is Bob Moog had to recreate the sound of the ladder filter as close as possible on the Memorymoog, but with the option for voltage control of the emphasis setting to be able to use presets. (Yes my dear Watson, there must be a decisive clue here.) The ladder filter itself appears to be a clean filter, but the trick seems to be to add the overdrive while extracting the filter output signal from the ladder directly into the VCA and overloading the VCA inputs. So it is not the filter itself, it is how one extracts the signal from the filter and what happens during that extraction. In the original design the transistors used to extract the filtered signal probably exhibited some nonlinearities that Bob simulated in the Memorymoog by overdriving the VCA chip. But another important thing about the ladder filter is that when emphasis is somewhat higher the filter also seems to emphasise the reverberant character of unisono tuned sawwaves, creating a sound with a definite spatial depth. Other filters tend to sound much more "right in the face" and appear to reduce this sense of depth. Anyway, on the Memorymoog the sawwaves are generated by CEM3340 VCO chips which are fed clean into the filters, these sawwaves are about perfect. Still the synth has this typical Moog sound. Apart from the coupling of the filter to the VCA nothing else 'out of the order' happens to the audio signal. Rob From kulagin at car-music.ru Tue Feb 11 06:43:50 2003 From: kulagin at car-music.ru (Alexander Kulagin) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:14 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> Message-ID: <015801c2d1db$fdcfeb20$da0110ac@carmus> Can be a mad thought, but since I'm new in this list, dare to ask. No what or possibility attach to Nord Modular digital output SPDIF? I don't have high quality ADC (my Wamirack 24 not so good), but I want record the sound more better. Alexander From bbeausej at pobox.com Mon Feb 10 19:10:36 2003 From: bbeausej at pobox.com (Benoit Beausejour) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Pianet N References: <107.1f4e035b.2b7a13b2@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E4869AC.5000501@pobox.com> > > >Why do they want to imitate that pile of shit?- I wish they would search for >a UNIX programmer instead!!!!! > > > Amen to that. -b Benoit Beausejour From Modular at fishtank.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 11 08:25:22 2003 From: Modular at fishtank.demon.co.uk (Leo Skirenko) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com><3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu><001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> <015801c2d1db$fdcfeb20$da0110ac@carmus> Message-ID: <000401c2d1ea$2d1f3e90$5001a8c0@LeosWorld> I've been looking into doing this. It wouldn't be too much effort to build a circuit to take the digital signals going into the DACs and route them through to an S/PDIF transmitter. I haven't yet taken the time to work on a circuit design for it but I hope to get round to it some time. Leo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alexander Kulagin" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:43 PM Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out > Can be a mad thought, but since I'm new in this list, dare to ask. No what > or possibility attach to Nord Modular digital output SPDIF? I don't have > high quality ADC (my Wamirack 24 not so good), but I want record the sound > more better. > > Alexander > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From lennart at regebro.nu Tue Feb 11 08:47:21 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Pianet N In-Reply-To: <3E4869AC.5000501@pobox.com> References: <107.1f4e035b.2b7a13b2@aol.com> <3E4869AC.5000501@pobox.com> Message-ID: <3E492919.805@regebro.nu> Benoit Beausejour wrote: >> >> >> Why do they want to imitate that pile of shit?- I wish they would >> search for a UNIX programmer instead!!!!! >> >> >> > > Amen to that. Hey you two: 1. Call Motorola and ask for a development kit on processors Clavia use. They used to be practically free. 2. Then learn how to program the little bastards. Make yourselves a cool mono-synth or a reverb or something. 3. Suddenly realize that you don't want to move to such a boring and cold place as Stockholm anyway (trust me on this), and that one year of free time spent on that stupid Motorola processor was completely wasted. :) From olaf at interactivelink.nl Tue Feb 11 08:57:50 2003 From: olaf at interactivelink.nl (Olaf Molenveld) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Pianet N References: <107.1f4e035b.2b7a13b2@aol.com> <3E4869AC.5000501@pobox.com> <3E492919.805@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <003901c2d1ee$b7450290$0100a8c0@olaf> or buy chameleon ;) ----- Original Message ----- From: Lennart Regebro To: Nord Modular Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 5:47 PM Subject: Re: [NM] Pianet N > Benoit Beausejour wrote: > >> > >> > >> Why do they want to imitate that pile of shit?- I wish they would > >> search for a UNIX programmer instead!!!!! > >> > >> > >> > > > > Amen to that. > > Hey you two: > > 1. Call Motorola and ask for a development kit on processors Clavia use. > They used to be practically free. > > 2. Then learn how to program the little bastards. Make yourselves a cool > mono-synth or a reverb or something. > > 3. Suddenly realize that you don't want to move to such a boring and > cold place as Stockholm anyway (trust me on this), and that one year of > free time spent on that stupid Motorola processor was completely wasted. :) > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From grantransom at totalise.co.uk Tue Feb 11 10:22:59 2003 From: grantransom at totalise.co.uk (Grant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special References: Message-ID: <001f01c2d1fa$9ee48200$0987fea9@grantransom> ----- Original Message ----- From: Rob Hordijk To: ; Nord Modular Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:21 PM Subject: RE: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > > Subject: Re: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special > > > > > > > I owned a large modular MooG (system 55) All I can tell you is it's > > so > > > special because the 904 Lowpass filter is a masterpiece of design > > > > Actually I would say the reason why the RA Moog filter sounds so unique > > is because it was *not* a masterpiece of design from an electronics > > point of view. A triangle wave coming from a Moog oscillator does not > > look very triangular when you put it through an oscilloscope. However > > it was certainly pleasing from a musical point of view :) > > > > To quote the Memorymoog service manual (page 18): > > (Start of quote - ) The filter signal is obtained differentially by a 353 > BIFET OP AMP U20A and U20B. The 353 has a gain factor of approximately 4, > which brings the signal up to about 100 millivolts, when the filter is all > the way up. That signal has enough drive to obtain distortion in U22, the > 3080 OTA, for a "fat" overdrive sound. The distortion is severe enough to > alter a triangle waveform into a sinewave at the output with the LEVEL > controls up and the VCF "open" all the way. The offset is cancelled with VCA > TRIM R140 which takes out any "thumping sounds". > > Next, the signal is applied to a 3080 OTA, the EMPHASIS amplifier U21, where > it is attenuated because distortion is wanted in the final output VCA but > NOT in the EMPHASIS circuit as it creates undesirable sound effects. ( - End > of quote) > > My guess is Bob Moog had to recreate the sound of the ladder filter as close > as possible on the Memorymoog, but with the option for voltage control of > the emphasis setting to be able to use presets. (Yes my dear Watson, there > must be a decisive clue here.) The ladder filter itself appears to be a > clean filter, but the trick seems to be to add the overdrive while > extracting the filter output signal from the ladder directly into the VCA > and overloading the VCA inputs. So it is not the filter itself, it is how > one extracts the signal from the filter and what happens during that > extraction. In the original design the transistors used to extract the > filtered signal probably exhibited some nonlinearities that Bob simulated in > the Memorymoog by overdriving the VCA chip. > > But another important thing about the ladder filter is that when emphasis is > somewhat higher the filter also seems to emphasise the reverberant character > of unisono tuned sawwaves, creating a sound with a definite spatial depth. > Other filters tend to sound much more "right in the face" and appear to > reduce this sense of depth. > > Rob So, The next question on my mind is... How would one get as close as possible using EVERY NM trick, regardless of 'cost'. I've used feedback with Diodes, OD, gain control, a dash of Random Lfo on cutoff (and res, depending on configuration), some of your 'warmth' ideas (inverted HP etc). They're tricky, because they have to be 'tuned' to work right across all ranges of Cutoff and Resonance. Applying a good moog 'sounding' filter to other things would open up some interesting avenues. > Anyway, on the Memorymoog the sawwaves are > generated by CEM3340 VCO chips which are fed clean into the filters, these > sawwaves are about perfect. Still the synth has this typical Moog sound. > Apart from the coupling of the filter to the VCA nothing else 'out of the > order' happens to the audio signal. It's interesting, a link on the list about some software synth (RE: [NM] TAE and the Nord Modular) was banging on about how Moog saws were convex. Does this mean the 'experts' working on the synth had viewed the waveform *after* the filter section? Anyway... Dave peck was mentioning how to emulate this waveform. I've mixed raw and shaped WF's before, but not dave's cool 'shift up' idea, so I combined this with another idea. I used a S&H random value triggered by the oscillator itself to mix/shape the waveform slightly every cycle to introduce some variation. (See attatchment) The problem is, the triggering gets a bit noisy. Would an analogue in this configuration produce the same noise, or is it inherent in the use of the NM S&H in this manner? Or one could just use a free running LFO (See second attatchment). Grant. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Shape WF test GR.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1476 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030211/a67450e9/ShapeWFtestGR.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Shape WF2testGR.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1151 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030211/a67450e9/ShapeWF2testGR.obj From 3phase at 3phase.de Tue Feb 11 12:07:04 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out In-Reply-To: <000401c2d1ea$2d1f3e90$5001a8c0@LeosWorld> Message-ID: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> would be interesting...i think the main reason for the a bit thin Nord sound is the analog backend...its just powered with 5V...this dont sounds too beafy for me... would be interesting if somebody would do a test with an other converter...i really would like to know if i am wright or not... On Dienstag, Feb 11, 2003, at 17:25 Europe/Berlin, Leo Skirenko wrote: > I've been looking into doing this. It wouldn't be too much effort to > build > a circuit to take the digital signals going into the DACs and route > them > through to an S/PDIF transmitter. I haven't yet taken the time to > work on a > circuit design for it but I hope to get round to it some time. > > > Leo > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alexander Kulagin" > To: "Nord Modular" > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 2:43 PM > Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out > > >> Can be a mad thought, but since I'm new in this list, dare to ask. No >> what >> or possibility attach to Nord Modular digital output SPDIF? I don't >> have >> high quality ADC (my Wamirack 24 not so good), but I want record the >> sound >> more better. >> >> Alexander >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Nord-Modular mailing list >> Nord-Modular@code404.com >> http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular >> _______________________________________________ >> Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list >> may not be redistributed without the express >> consent of the author/creator. > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From bauke at darkambient.net Tue Feb 11 12:26:04 2003 From: bauke at darkambient.net (Bauke van der Wal) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] RE: Vinyl love In-Reply-To: <20030211200017.3DE799F@roland.code404.com> References: <20030211200017.3DE799F@roland.code404.com> Message-ID: >I remember hearing that the vinyl masters had a trade off relationship >between signal compression and groove width (playing time). >Could this (playing time) compression contribute to the sound difference >also? very informative info on mastering: http://www.aardvarkmastering.com/ for vinyl mastering info. a general very informattive site is here: http://www.digido.com/ >Would music mastered to take advantage of CD technology sound as good on >vinyl? nope. i've just worked on two new releases, one for CD and one for vinyl (both out in april / may ;-) the difference between both is a LF cutoff (20Hz vs 40Hz) and some other differences (like max freqency). the above mentioned pages also hold info about over-levelling (mastering at +3 dB or even +6 dB) while a cd will never be over the 0 dB level. oh, by the way: both releases are made with clavia and waldorf gear, which make it kinda almost maybe list-related right ? greets, bauke ps: tubes rule too ! -- the [law-rah] collective : http://www.darkambient.net vogon poetry : http://www.vogonpoetry.net ant-zen : http://www.ant-zen.com From jimmy.m at home.se Tue Feb 11 12:41:14 2003 From: jimmy.m at home.se (Jimmy Myhrman) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out References: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> Message-ID: <00ae01c2d20d$f13b7a50$f0f90bc1@glass> Don't expect the sound to change *at all* when adding an SPDIF output. With a decent DAC, the character of the sound relies pretty much only on the algorithms used in the DSP. BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the analog outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of analog noise from the digital out). /Jimmy.M (http://myhrman.iuma.com) 3phase wrote: > would be interesting...i think the main reason for the a bit thin Nord > sound is the analog backend...its just powered with 5V...this dont > sounds too beafy for me... > would be interesting if somebody would do a test with an other > converter...i really would like to know if i am wright or not... > > From kevin at unitcircle.com Tue Feb 11 13:37:28 2003 From: kevin at unitcircle.com (Kevin Goldsmith) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out Message-ID: <200302111637.AA13697184@mail.unitcircle.com> >BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was >confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the analog >outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of analog noise >from the digital out). > This alone would make it worth it to me. I'm constantly amazed at how few synths feature digital out. Even with high end converters into your recording gear, you're still doing an extra D/A and A/D with all the extra noise and sampling issues associated with it. I'd love to add SPDIF to all my synths (especially my Access and Nord gear). I'd also want it for the inputs too. Kevin -- ------------------------------------------------------------- Kevin Goldsmith kevin@unitcircle.com Unit Circle Media http://www.unitcircle.com ------------------------------------------------------------- New From Unit Circle: Intonarumori - "Material" http://www.unitcircle.com/rekkids/releases/tUC075/ -- From 3phase at 3phase.de Tue Feb 11 14:26:47 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out In-Reply-To: <00ae01c2d20d$f13b7a50$f0f90bc1@glass> Message-ID: hmm... Sofar i havent heard 2 DA?s that sounded identical...but its realy possibel that the differnce is very small. Its just a that all equipment i owned that gave me a good punch in the lowend was powered with at least +/12 V equal to 24V. And all Equipment that didnt satisfied my stommage was this lowwwvoltage smd shit..so...i at least would like to know... at least the converters in the Nord are pretty good...the analog output circuit looks a bit soundcard standart. Tiny capaciators and lowvoltage smd op-amps...nothing you would like to have in your mixingdesk. On Dienstag, Feb 11, 2003, at 21:41 Europe/Berlin, Jimmy Myhrman wrote: > Don't expect the sound to change *at all* when adding an SPDIF output. > With a decent DAC, the character of the sound relies pretty much only > on > the algorithms used in the DSP. > > BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was > confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the analog > outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of analog noise > from the digital out). > > /Jimmy.M (http://myhrman.iuma.com) > > 3phase wrote: >> would be interesting...i think the main reason for the a bit thin Nord >> sound is the analog backend...its just powered with 5V...this dont >> sounds too beafy for me... >> would be interesting if somebody would do a test with an other >> converter...i really would like to know if i am wright or not... >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From Alex_Rieger at national.com.au Tue Feb 11 15:16:04 2003 From: Alex_Rieger at national.com.au (Alex_Rieger@national.com.au) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:15 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out Message-ID: Kevin, this raises some interesting points. The problem with all this equipment with digital outs is that they do not have a digital clock input to sync to - effectively they all want to act as a master clock. It's the cheap alternative. It all sounds nice and good, but you try and plug all that equipment into a digital mixer (also running at it's own clock) at the same time and see what you get. None of the incoming data from each of the sources lines up. You can only effectively use one bit of equipment at a time. Why do so few synths feature a digital out (or in)? A good digital out on any gear needs to be implemented properly and it adds to the synth's cost and you need to clock it's output to a master clock in. Not as simple as it seems. It has to be incorporated in it's design. A cost which most aren't prepared to go to considering the small percentage of people that would (be able to) use it. Especially consider what happens with digital clock in, your equipment has to sync up to that clock speed. What happens when that master clock drifts? So does the synth. Resampling disparate clocks to decouple this problem is even more expensive. And I don't think I need to talk about aliasing problems... The sinal to noise ratio on most analog gear is good enough that you won't hear the noise floor while you play anyway. Especially with other instruments playing at the same time. If you have gear that has "background" noise the bleeds through while not playing, use a (noise) gate. Alex "Kevin Goldsmith" @code404.com on 12/02/2003 08:37:28 Please respond to kevin@unitcircle.com; Please respond to Nord Modular Sent by: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com To: "Nord Modular" , Nord Modular cc: Subject: Re: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out >BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was >confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the analog >outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of analog noise >from the digital out). > This alone would make it worth it to me. I'm constantly amazed at how few synths feature digital out. Even with high end converters into your recording gear, you're still doing an extra D/A and A/D with all the extra noise and sampling issues associated with it. I'd love to add SPDIF to all my synths (especially my Access and Nord gear). I'd also want it for the inputs too. Kevin From kevin at unitcircle.com Tue Feb 11 15:41:18 2003 From: kevin at unitcircle.com (Kevin Goldsmith) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out Message-ID: <200302111841.AA21495968@mail.unitcircle.com> >The problem with all this equipment with digital outs is that they do not >have a digital clock input to sync to - effectively they all want to act as >a master clock. It's the cheap alternative. It all sounds nice and good, >but you try and plug all that equipment into a digital mixer (also running >at it's own clock) at the same time and see what you get. None of the >incoming data from each of the sources lines up. You can only effectively >use one bit of equipment at a time. > Agreed, but for recording (which is the main reason this would be useful), that is more than an acceptable comprimise for a synth. For an effect processor, it's a different story (which goes against my desire for SPDIF in, but this is a wishlist kind of thing anyway). >Why do so few synths feature a digital out (or in)? >A good digital out on any gear needs to be implemented properly and it adds >to the synth's cost and you need to clock it's output to a master clock in. >Not as simple as it seems. It has to be incorporated in it's design. A >cost which most aren't prepared to go to considering the small percentage >of people that would (be able to) use it. Especially consider what happens >with digital clock in, your equipment has to sync up to that clock speed. >What happens when that master clock drifts? So does the synth. > The cost argument was expected, but they have been plenty of lower-price-range gear that features SPDIF out. I think the relative costs of this have come down fairly significantly. Even so, I'd have no problem pony'ing up the extra cash for this small feature on a synth that I wanted. >Resampling disparate clocks to decouple this problem is even more >expensive. And I don't think I need to talk about aliasing problems... > I have an increasingly digital studio, believe me, I'm well aware of these problems. I'd be happy for the simple case of hooking up my Nord to the SPDIF in of my mixer or audio interface to record the output two channels at a time to reduce overall noise. >The sinal to noise ratio on most analog gear is good enough that you won't >hear the noise floor while you play anyway. Especially with other >instruments playing at the same time. >If you have gear that has "background" noise the bleeds through while not >playing, use a (noise) gate. > Well of course that is what I do now, but that doesn't mean I should find it acceptable in a synth that costs more than many computers (which feature SPDIF out!). Kevin -- ------------------------------------------------------------- Kevin Goldsmith kevin@unitcircle.com Unit Circle Media http://www.unitcircle.com ------------------------------------------------------------- New From Unit Circle: Intonarumori - "Material" http://www.unitcircle.com/rekkids/releases/tUC075/ -- From disjunction at couchblip.com Tue Feb 11 18:17:02 2003 From: disjunction at couchblip.com (7uke) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out References: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> <00ae01c2d20d$f13b7a50$f0f90bc1@glass> Message-ID: <007601c2d23c$d4856d60$0300000a@analogue> > BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was > confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the analog > outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of analog noise > from the digital out). Hey Jimmy, do you have the details for doing that handy? I'd like to do it to mine just for convienience sake. cheers 7uke From lennart at regebro.nu Wed Feb 12 00:55:59 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out In-Reply-To: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> References: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> Message-ID: <3E4A0C1F.3040202@regebro.nu> 3phase wrote: > would be interesting...i think the main reason for the a bit thin Nord > sound is the analog backend...its just powered with 5V...this dont > sounds too beafy for me... My NM is powered with 220. Maybe you should try that? From 3phase at 3phase.de Wed Feb 12 02:41:55 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out In-Reply-To: <3E4A0C1F.3040202@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <9AA6FB40-3E76-11D7-94DC-000A957654DE@3phase.de> ha ha h? :-/ I rather try to set it to 12 Volts one day..in a new housing..very slim...a slimline modular...i dont need the knobs anyway anymore...i do this with my gamepads now... than i have everything in my laptopbag again...like in good ol micromodular days. On Mittwoch, Feb 12, 2003, at 09:55 Europe/Berlin, Lennart Regebro wrote: > 3phase wrote: >> would be interesting...i think the main reason for the a bit thin >> Nord sound is the analog backend...its just powered with 5V...this >> dont sounds too beafy for me... > > My NM is powered with 220. Maybe you should try that? > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From carl_lofgren at yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 03:09:10 2003 From: carl_lofgren at yahoo.com (Carl Löfgren) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Best MINIMoog patch? Message-ID: <20030212110910.47911.qmail@web20504.mail.yahoo.com> Hi... I'm looking for a good MiniMoog patch. I'm not looking for a special sound, but more of a accurate structure. I've got The Minimax software synthesizer for Pulsar II which is really good and I was thinking of converting some of my favorite sounds to get that NM touch. Cheers, Carl. ===== -Carl Löfgren __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From nostromo at arkaos.net Wed Feb 12 03:33:21 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Best MINIMoog patch? References: <20030212110910.47911.qmail@web20504.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001b01c2d28a$8c513fd0$d801a8c0@nostromo> That is interesting::: what is the outcome of NM Vs Minimax according 2U ? M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carl L?fgren" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:09 PM Subject: [NM] Best MINIMoog patch? > Hi... I'm looking for a good MiniMoog patch. I'm not > looking for a special sound, but more of a accurate > structure. I've got The Minimax software synthesizer > for Pulsar II which is really good and I was thinking > of converting some of my favorite sounds to get that > NM touch. > > Cheers, > > Carl. > > ===== > -Carl L?fgren > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > http://shopping.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From olaf at interactivelink.nl Wed Feb 12 03:43:32 2003 From: olaf at interactivelink.nl (Olaf Molenveld) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Best MINIMoog patch? References: <20030212110910.47911.qmail@web20504.mail.yahoo.com> <001b01c2d28a$8c513fd0$d801a8c0@nostromo> Message-ID: <00c501c2d28b$f9769320$0100a8c0@olaf> http://www.till.com/articles/moog/index.html#articles From carl_lofgren at yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 06:18:45 2003 From: carl_lofgren at yahoo.com (Carl Löfgren) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Best MINIMoog patch? In-Reply-To: <001b01c2d28a$8c513fd0$d801a8c0@nostromo> Message-ID: <20030212141845.54113.qmail@web20512.mail.yahoo.com> Well... so far I haven't tested the NM capabilities yet (that's why I asked for if someone knew a good Minimoog patch) :-) But I can say this much... the Minimax for the Pulsar II is _very_ good. Some guy on the Creamware list did a comparison and in many cases you couldn't hear any difference. Personally, I don't know. I just think it sounds wonderful and that's enough for me... :-) Carl. --- "M-.-n" wrote: > That is interesting::: what is the outcome of NM Vs > Minimax according 2U ? > > M-.-n > > http://n0s.10pm.org/ > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carl Löfgren" > To: "Nord Modular" > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:09 PM > Subject: [NM] Best MINIMoog patch? > > > > Hi... I'm looking for a good MiniMoog patch. I'm > not > > looking for a special sound, but more of a > accurate > > structure. I've got The Minimax software > synthesizer > > for Pulsar II which is really good and I was > thinking > > of converting some of my favorite sounds to get > that > > NM touch. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Carl. > > > > ===== > > -Carl Löfgren > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. ===== -Carl Löfgren __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From kulagin at car-music.ru Wed Feb 12 06:55:07 2003 From: kulagin at car-music.ru (Alexander Kulagin) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out References: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> <00ae01c2d20d$f13b7a50$f0f90bc1@glass> Message-ID: <010801c2d2a6$bc151ea0$da0110ac@carmus> Possibly I can't hear difference between the analog outs and the digital out (I have no doubt in NM DAC quality), but after record in multitrack sequencer via analog sound loses mellowness or something... This does not occur when I record my other synthesizer Roland XV-5080 on digital path via SPDIF. Regrettably do not possess expensive equipment for qualitative analog record :( Exactly so I feel necessity digital output in Nord Modular, but on whole visibility of the experience such overpatching while nor beside who no... With best regards, Alexander > Don't expect the sound to change *at all* when adding an SPDIF output. > With a decent DAC, the character of the sound relies pretty much only on > the algorithms used in the DSP. > > BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was > confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the analog > outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of analog noise > from the digital out). > > /Jimmy.M (http://myhrman.iuma.com) > From lennart at regebro.nu Wed Feb 12 07:25:42 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out In-Reply-To: <010801c2d2a6$bc151ea0$da0110ac@carmus> References: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de> <00ae01c2d20d$f13b7a50$f0f90bc1@glass> <010801c2d2a6$bc151ea0$da0110ac@carmus> Message-ID: <3E4A6776.8040009@regebro.nu> Alexander Kulagin wrote: > Possibly I can't hear difference between the analog outs and the digital out > (I have no doubt in NM DAC quality), but after record in multitrack > sequencer via analog > sound loses mellowness or something... This does not occur when I record > my other synthesizer Roland XV-5080 on digital path via SPDIF. If both synthesizers have the same loss when doing the, it's probably your soundcards A/D converter that is the problem. But sure, digital out would be nice. Unessesary conversions should of course be avoided. From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 12 09:01:19 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out Message-ID: In a message dated 12/2/03 3:27:49 pm, lennart@regebro.nu writes: >If both synthesizers have the same loss when doing the, it's probably >your soundcards A/D converter that is the problem. > >But sure, digital out would be nice. Unessesary conversions should of >course be avoided. > Agreed. Not only that, but the quality of your cabling, and your mixing desk etc. Think of it like a "Hi-Fi". If you have an expensive CD player or record deck and you put it through some shitty amplifier, it won't 'shine' as well as it would through a more expensive amp. But it's a real slippery slope from then onwards, because once you get into that mindset, you'll be so concerned about what is right and what is wrong, that you won't be able to make any music ever again! ;-) Tom :-) From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 12 09:06:33 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Why Minimoog is so special/ Best MINIMoog patch? Message-ID: <16d.1907f9df.2b7bd919@aol.com> So the fight is on again? I must say I was quite impressed with your Memorymoog patch Rob. The use of delay lines was a real eye-opener!! (or should that be 'emphasis-opener'?;) whoops- new computer, no NM Editor (am I loosing it??;). I was going to offer a patch- but I can't for now. :(..........now where is OMS and that editor software.....?! Tom :-) From john at johntennant.com Wed Feb 12 09:35:40 2003 From: john at johntennant.com (John Tennant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Distorted Singer Lead Message-ID: Hey everyone, This is my first patch contribution since joining the list a couple of weeks ago. I'm really enjoying my new little micromodular. It seems to fit into my mixes just right... Anyways, the patch is a mean sounding lead/bass in stereo. Knobs 1,2,3 are used. But none else b/c I only got the micro. Hope it's not too elementary for the list! John -- http://www.johntennant.com -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1786 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030212/8d2730c4/attachment.obj From Terryfunken at aol.com Wed Feb 12 09:52:28 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Distorted Singer Lead Message-ID: <12a.2299b0dc.2b7be3dc@aol.com> In a message dated 12/2/03 5:37:39 pm, john@johntennant.com writes: >Anyways, the patch is a mean sounding lead/bass in stereo. Knobs 1,2,3 >are >used. But none else b/c I only got the micro. Hope it's not too elementary >for the list! > Well I ALWAYS encourage MM patches:-) Wel-o-come to the red-fun-house!!! Tom (on list for quite a while now and proud father of 2 young micromodulars!) From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Wed Feb 12 15:48:47 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:16 2004 Subject: [NM] Distorted Singer Lead In-Reply-To: <12a.2299b0dc.2b7be3dc@aol.com> Message-ID: > > Tom (on list for quite a while now and proud father of 2 young > micromodulars!) Hey, that means twice the amount of patches your share with us!!! ;-)) Rob From theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com Wed Feb 12 16:11:36 2003 From: theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com (Theo.:.) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Here are some new ones PLUS stupid question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hey This is my first patch post on the list and I thought I would do a three in one jobby. I hope they sound kind of interesting and not too unoriginal. I also have a Really basic question. What does the midi out do? I have tried to send sequencer out of it and even tried to send gated messages out but to no avail. Is there something really obvious. Is there any use for the midi out or am I just smoking crack? Peace Nord peeps Theo > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1898 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030212/7a44194d/attachment.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2993 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030212/7a44194d/attachment-0001.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1478 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030212/7a44194d/attachment-0002.obj From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Wed Feb 12 16:20:58 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Here are some new ones PLUS stupid question References: Message-ID: <3E4AE4EA.7090204@wanadoo.nl> Theo.:. wrote: > I also have a Really basic question. What does the midi out do? > I have tried to send sequencer out of it and even tried to send gated > messages out but to no avail. Is there something really obvious. Is there > any use for the midi out or am I just smoking crack? 'cause you are just smoking crack ;-) Midi out sends: MidiNotes Knob movements if assigned to a parameter which is also assigned to a Midi CC. [Manual Page 39 & 40] Program Change (Rotary Dial) Wout From theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com Wed Feb 12 18:06:55 2003 From: theoloniusmonk at hotmail.com (Theo.:.) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Here are some new ones PLUS stupid question In-Reply-To: <3E4AE4EA.7090204@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: On 2/12/03 7:20 PM, "Wout Blommers" wrote: > Theo.:. wrote: >> I also have a Really basic question. What does the midi out do? >> I have tried to send sequencer out of it and even tried to send gated >> messages out but to no avail. Is there something really obvious. Is there >> any use for the midi out or am I just smoking crack? > > 'cause you are just smoking crack ;-) > > Midi out sends: > MidiNotes > Knob movements if assigned to a parameter which is also assigned to a > Midi CC. [Manual Page 39 & 40] > Program Change (Rotary Dial) > > Wout > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > Thanks Wout it would be cool if there was a way to get it to send out the sequencer data (like Max) So to be able to use it to sequence other instruments. Oh well. I have a rack any way so I guess I won't be using the midi out much... Thanks From kris at phidelity.com Wed Feb 12 19:09:34 2003 From: kris at phidelity.com (Kris Northern) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] welcome back potter! Message-ID: <001701c2d30d$56100040$2c0aa8c0@SLACKER> Hey guys... i unsubbed from the list over a year ago but Im back to lurk again! (Insert muttered conversation here ie: I didnt even know he was here in the first place much less unsubbed!) Anyways Im trying to get my modular up and running again and im running into a problem... Im using windows XP Ive installed the drivers for my midisport 2x2 properly they show up as working fine in my device manager Installed the nord editor however when i goto to midi to specift the ins and outs the editor doesnt list the midisport as an option. Does anyone know what I can do to fix this? Havent found much on the midiman or NM site. thanks in advance! Kris -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030212/9f2ecdde/attachment.htm From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 12 11:16:52 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> Message-ID: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Pedro Monkeyfinger" >To: "Nord Modular" >Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 4:06 AM >Subject: Re: [NM]16bit > > >> >> >you considered cost. I'm sure that with enough money you could >> >probably make a 1-bit oversampling DAC that sounded just as good as >> >a high-quality 16-bit one. :) >> >> >> >> no, math sez you can t > >Which math is this? sorry, math that i don t *really* understand fully, but when i went to a lecture at the banff center in oct (?) stanley lipshitz explained it all quite very very well. he made it quite clear that the convertors being used in the dts (? the super high sampling rate stuff. not pt hd 192) are just pure stupid. they re using a 1bit convertor, when in fact they should be using an 8bit one. 8bit makes sense. now, i m not sure if i spelt his name right. some snooping around on google should uncover what he was talking about at banff there. sorry, i d have done all this snopping, but i m not even connected as i type this =) later BRAD From b.hawk at shaw.ca Wed Feb 12 23:00:48 2003 From: b.hawk at shaw.ca (Pedro Monkeyfinger) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> Message-ID: >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Pedro Monkeyfinger" >>To: "Nord Modular" >>Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 4:06 AM >>Subject: Re: [NM]16bit >> >>> >>> >you considered cost. I'm sure that with enough money you could >>> >probably make a 1-bit oversampling DAC that sounded just as good as >>> >a high-quality 16-bit one. :) >>> >>> >>> >>> no, math sez you can t >> >>Which math is this? > > > > >sorry, math that i don t *really* understand fully, but when i went >to a lecture at the banff center in oct (?) stanley lipshitz >explained it all quite yeah sorry, here s that: http://www.banffcentre.ca/music/audio/aes_news.asp lipshitz explained it so well that i thought i totally understood it, except now i can t recall exactly what it was he said. it was a really interesting evening, if you can believe it. he talked at extreme length about it all, and amazingly it was all very interesting. dammit, i should ve taken notes. he did all of his examples in 8bit to make everything much more apparent, and i got some interesting ideas of how to use what he was doing with the nord modular for some very wild distortions... shuks... From initiatrix at softhome.net Wed Feb 12 23:55:11 2003 From: initiatrix at softhome.net (initiatrix@softhome.net) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] welcome back potter! In-Reply-To: <001701c2d30d$56100040$2c0aa8c0@SLACKER> References: <001701c2d30d$56100040$2c0aa8c0@SLACKER> Message-ID: <25508541.20030213075511@softhome.net> Hey Potter.... right click the Modular editor exe file...choose properties....click the "Compatibility" tab...check "Run this program in compatibilty mode for..." and choose Windows 98/Windows ME sorted jon KN> Hey guys... i unsubbed from the list over a year ago but Im back to lurk again! (Insert muttered conversation here ie: I didnt even know he was here in the first place much less unsubbed!) KN> Anyways Im trying to get my modular up and running again and im running into a problem... KN> Im using windows XP KN> Ive installed the drivers for my midisport 2x2 properly KN> they show up as working fine in my device manager KN> Installed the nord editor however when i goto to midi to specift the ins and outs the editor doesnt list the midisport as an option. KN> Does anyone know what I can do to fix this? KN> Havent found much on the midiman or NM site. KN> thanks in advance! KN> Kris From lennart at regebro.nu Thu Feb 13 01:21:38 2003 From: lennart at regebro.nu (Lennart Regebro) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> Message-ID: <3E4B63A2.6060608@regebro.nu> Pedro Monkeyfinger wrote: > lipshitz explained it so well that i thought i totally understood it, > except now i can t recall exactly what it was he said. Well, I just needed the summary. :) When you dither, you add noise, by randomly twiddling the lower bit. This can't be done properly in 1-bit converters, he got a point there. I would probably need to listen to the whole lecture to form an opinion if this really is something that outweighs the benefits. And Math really doesn't have that much impact here, since maths will assume a lot of perfection that doesn't exist in reality. So even if it's not theoretically possible to built a 1-bit converter that is as good as a 16-bit converter, in practice it may very well be. From andre at sansserif.com.au Wed Feb 12 22:14:17 2003 From: andre at sansserif.com.au (andre@sansserif.com.au) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Getting the nord to act as a midi controller for software Message-ID: <621C7BF9-3F1A-11D7-B7E0-0003939B3B7C@sansserif.com.au> Hi. ive got a modular keyboard, im trying to get it to act as a midi controller for REASON.. i can get it to act as a master keyboard (playing notes) but when i try to assign the nord knobs to parameters within REASON, REASON does not seem to pick up any of the midi output while turning the knobs.. ive configured reason to work with a midiman Oxygen 8 controller.. so i dont know where the problem is.. im running mac OSX 10.2.3, Midiman 4x4 interface (latest drivers).. any ideas? thanks. + lo.rez / hi.rez / and.rez andre.ruello - sansserifgrafik http://www.sansserif.com.au From Terryfunken at aol.com Thu Feb 13 02:00:01 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Distorted Singer Lead Message-ID: <6d.9e857ca.2b7cc6a1@aol.com> In a message dated 12/2/03 11:51:22 pm, rhordijk@xs4all.nl writes: >Hey, that means twice the amount of patches your share with us!!! > >;-)) Rob I wish! hehe- the problem is Rob, that I have to 'feed them with knowledge' before they will 'speak' ;-) Tom :-) From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 13 02:07:16 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Here are some new ones PLUS stupid question References: Message-ID: <3E4B6E54.6090708@wanadoo.nl> Theo.:. wrote: > it would be cool if there was a way to get it to send out the sequencer data > (like Max) > So to be able to use it to sequence other instruments. Oh well. I have a > rack any way so I guess I won't be using the midi out much... Ahhhh...! Ripping open not completely healed wounds...! A MIDI OUT MODULE!!!! Just Joking :-) But you're talking about the big frustration of this list. Wout (Did you read that? He just wrote 'it would be cool' Just cool... only cool... Mrflflmprmfl... ... ... Nurse! Nurse! NURSE!!!) From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 13 02:16:18 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:17 2004 Subject: [NM] Getting the nord to act as a midi controller for software References: <621C7BF9-3F1A-11D7-B7E0-0003939B3B7C@sansserif.com.au> Message-ID: <3E4B7072.8040703@wanadoo.nl> andre@sansserif.com.au wrote: > Hi. > ive got a modular keyboard, > im trying to get it to act as a midi controller for REASON.. > i can get it to act as a master keyboard (playing notes) but when i try > to assign the nord knobs to parameters within REASON, REASON does not > seem to pick up any of the midi output while turning the knobs.. Did you assign the Knobs to a Midi CC? If you only want to use the NM as a controller, just take 18 Constant Modules and assign the parameter to a Knob as well as a Midi CC. A better way is taking the Manual and read Page 39 and 40 :-) What you have to do to make it work in Reason, take a look in that Manual... Wout From rydan at kth.se Thu Feb 13 02:21:59 2003 From: rydan at kth.se (Patrik "Rydan" Rydberg) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu><001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> <3E4B63A2.6060608@regebro.nu> Message-ID: <008a01c2d349$c19388a0$8f08ed82@bio> > I would probably need to listen to the whole lecture to form an opinion > if this really is something that outweighs the benefits. And Math really > doesn't have that much impact here, since maths will assume a lot of > perfection that doesn't exist in reality. So even if it's not > theoretically possible to built a 1-bit converter that is as good as a > 16-bit converter, in practice it may very well be. As far as I know, all (or almost all) 24-bit A/D-converters are Sigma-Delta (1-bit), since it's almost impossible to build a qood quantizer for 24-bit resolution. The quantizing steps will be so close together that you'll need ridiculously high quality components and tight tolerances, which in "real life" means that the 1-bit converter will do a better job, since it's technically much easier to build. /Patrik ---- The primary purpose of wings is to prevent flight From eneff at lodinet.com Thu Feb 13 08:20:22 2003 From: eneff at lodinet.com (eneff@lodinet.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] Getting the nord to act as a midi controller for software In-Reply-To: <621C7BF9-3F1A-11D7-B7E0-0003939B3B7C@sansserif.com.au> Message-ID: <000401c2d37b$ee5bd8b0$0b00000a@Aluminum> Did you enable midi controllers in reason? It's one of the menu options. Also, reason will not assign a controller to a knob if something is already assigned to it so watch for movement before you assign. > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com] On Behalf Of > andre@sansserif.com.au > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 10:14 PM > To: nord-modular@code404.com > Subject: [NM] Getting the nord to act as a midi controller > for software > > > Hi. > ive got a modular keyboard, > im trying to get it to act as a midi controller for REASON.. > i can get it to act as a master keyboard (playing notes) but > when i try > to assign the nord knobs to parameters within REASON, REASON does not > seem to pick up any of the midi output while turning the knobs.. > > ive configured reason to work with a midiman Oxygen 8 > controller.. so i > dont know where the problem is.. > > im running mac OSX 10.2.3, Midiman 4x4 interface (latest drivers).. > > any ideas? > > thanks. > > + > lo.rez / hi.rez / and.rez > andre.ruello - sansserifgrafik > http://www.sansserif.com.au > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-> modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From jjclark_music at sympatico.ca Thu Feb 13 09:21:54 2003 From: jjclark_music at sympatico.ca (jjclark music) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM]16bit In-Reply-To: References: <3b.333c019a.2b78edb6@aol.com> <3E47C26F.4080407@regebro.nu> <001201c2d1d9$9bfc8040$0501a8c0@clarkhome> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030213121705.00a92500@pop6.sympatico.ca> At 12:00 AM 2/13/2003 -0700, you wrote: >>>----- Original Message ----- >>>From: "Pedro Monkeyfinger" >>>To: "Nord Modular" >>>Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 4:06 AM >>>Subject: Re: [NM]16bit >>> >>>> >>>> >you considered cost. I'm sure that with enough money you could >>>> >probably make a 1-bit oversampling DAC that sounded just as good as >>>> >a high-quality 16-bit one. :) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> no, math sez you can t >>> >>>Which math is this? >> >> >> >> >>sorry, math that i don t *really* understand fully, but when i went to a >>lecture at the banff center in oct (?) stanley lipshitz explained it all quite > > > >yeah sorry, here s that: >http://www.banffcentre.ca/music/audio/aes_news.asp > > >lipshitz explained it so well that i thought i totally understood it, >except now i can t recall exactly what it was he said. > >it was a really interesting evening, if you can believe it. he talked at >extreme length about it all, and amazingly it was all very >interesting. dammit, i should ve taken notes. he did all of his examples >in 8bit to make everything much more Thanks for the link. You should be aware that he was still talking about sigma-delta converters (and therefore oversampled) that use multibit quantizers and NOT about your standard 8-bit converter. I think I mentioned multi-bit in my original reply as being the current hot area in sigma-delta converter technology. The discussion we were having here on this list was about (1-bit) over-sampled converters vs. 16-bit standard converters. From dpeck at euphonix.com Thu Feb 13 09:34:16 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] Here are some new ones PLUS stupid question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> Actually, the ability to send knob movements (& record them into your midi sequencer) is very handy, depending on the type of music you're doing. You can record a keyboard sequence into the midi sequencer, and then while it plays the NM, you record some knob movements and, then rewind and add more, in effect overdubbing multiple knob movements. You can get some pretty complex modulations going on. It's also handy to have the 18 knobs for controlling other synths you may have in the rack that don't have knobs. I've used the NM knobs to control an Oberheim Matrix-6R and some Emu modules, and it works great. Dave Peck > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of Theo.:. > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 6:07 PM > To: Nord Modular > Subject: Re: [NM] Here are some new ones PLUS stupid question > > > > Midi out sends: > > MidiNotes > > Knob movements if assigned to a parameter which is also assigned to a > > Midi CC. [Manual Page 39 & 40] > > Program Change (Rotary Dial) > > > > Wout > > > Thanks Wout > > it would be cool if there was a way to get it to send out the > sequencer data > (like Max) > So to be able to use it to sequence other instruments. Oh well. I have a > rack any way so I guess I won't be using the midi out much... > > Thanks > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From dhastings at earthlink.net Thu Feb 13 11:10:22 2003 From: dhastings at earthlink.net (Dave Hastings) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] Soundscape in G revisited In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001201c2d393$8e678f40$e16df4d1@hmv5n> After listening to it for a while, I decided it needed a little more. So, here it is. Slight tweaks to the bells and water, replacement of the drone. -------------- Dave Hastings dhastings@earthlink.net "Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read" Groucho Marx -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 01310301A soundscape.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2870 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/27750d20/01310301Asoundscape.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 02050303B soundscape.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 5489 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/27750d20/02050303Bsoundscape.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 01310301C soundscape.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1969 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/27750d20/01310301Csoundscape.obj From emile at foryourhead.com Thu Feb 13 11:25:58 2003 From: emile at foryourhead.com (Emile Tobenfeld (a.k.a Dr. T)) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] Soundscape in G revisited In-Reply-To: <001201c2d393$8e678f40$e16df4d1@hmv5n> References: <001201c2d393$8e678f40$e16df4d1@hmv5n> Message-ID: Thanks Dave -- I've had fun with the last batch. Send me your snail-mail off-list and I'll send you some tracks when I record some that I like. At 11:10 AM -0800 2/13/03, Dave Hastings wrote: >After listening to it for a while, I decided it needed a little more. So, >here it is. Slight tweaks to the bells and water, replacement of the drone. > >-------------- >Dave Hastings >dhastings@earthlink.net >"Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend. > Inside of a dog it's too dark to read" >Groucho Marx One of my favorite tag lines-:) -- " Practice makes perfect, imperfect is better." -- Paul Bley Emile Tobenfeld, Ph. D. Video Producer Image Processing Specialist Video for your HEAD! Boris FX http://www.foryourhead.com http://www.borisfx.com From l---------------------l at inbox.lv Thu Feb 13 12:36:39 2003 From: l---------------------l at inbox.lv (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=95=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=20=95?=) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> Message-ID: <3E4C01D7.CB0B7F6F@inbox.lv> hallo, could a kind soul please help me to understand why i am not able to record midi messages from the modular to emagic amt8 to logic v4.8. [mac + OMS]. the modular recieves ok. editor also o.k. cables ok. use of autolink = yes. i am just not able to record midi events. am i missing something very obvious ? thanks, ek. From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 13 14:24:53 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> <3E4C01D7.CB0B7F6F@inbox.lv> Message-ID: <3E4C1B34.9070906@wanadoo.nl> ?_______________ ? wrote: > i am just not able to record midi events. NM only sends Midi Notes and Knobs assigned to Midi CC. (and Program Change) Wout From l---------------------l at inbox.lv Thu Feb 13 13:41:32 2003 From: l---------------------l at inbox.lv (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=95=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=20=95?=) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> <3E4C01D7.CB0B7F6F@inbox.lv> <3E4C1B34.9070906@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: <3E4C110D.21A61BF2@inbox.lv> hallo, thanks for responding. this is my fustration. i cannot seem to be able to record these Midi Notes and Knobs . any ideas? ek. Wout Blommers wrote: > > ?_______________ ? wrote: > > i am just not able to record midi events. > > NM only sends Midi Notes and Knobs assigned to Midi CC. > (and Program Change) > > Wout From kris at phidelity.com Thu Feb 13 15:13:51 2003 From: kris at phidelity.com (Kris Northern) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> <3E4C01D7.CB0B7F6F@inbox.lv> <3E4C1B34.9070906@wanadoo.nl> <3E4C110D.21A61BF2@inbox.lv> Message-ID: <001101c2d3b5$92dccb40$2c0aa8c0@SLACKER> right click a knob and goto the last entry on the menu and assign it a midi cc # once you do that you should be able to record everything =) ----- Original Message ----- From: "._______________ ." To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:41 PM Subject: Re: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 > hallo, > > thanks for responding. > > this is my fustration. i cannot seem to be able to > record these Midi Notes and Knobs . > > any ideas? > > ek. > > > Wout Blommers wrote: > > > > ._______________ . wrote: > > > i am just not able to record midi events. > > > > NM only sends Midi Notes and Knobs assigned to Midi CC. > > (and Program Change) > > > > Wout > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Thu Feb 13 15:15:14 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> <3E4C01D7.CB0B7F6F@inbox.lv> <3E4C1B34.9070906@wanadoo.nl> <3E4C110D.21A61BF2@inbox.lv> Message-ID: <3E4C2702.2080901@wanadoo.nl> ?_______________ ? wrote: > hallo, > > thanks for responding. > > this is my fustration. i cannot seem to be able to > record these Midi Notes and Knobs . > > any ideas? Could be Emagic Amt8? Does another piece of Midi gear work fine on that input? Does Amt8 receive any messages from the NM? Wout From l---------------------l at inbox.lv Thu Feb 13 14:07:48 2003 From: l---------------------l at inbox.lv (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=95=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=20=95?=) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:18 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <000501c2d386$2180c200$640314cf@euphonix.com> <3E4C01D7.CB0B7F6F@inbox.lv> <3E4C1B34.9070906@wanadoo.nl> <3E4C110D.21A61BF2@inbox.lv> <3E4C2702.2080901@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: <3E4C1734.E41877FA@inbox.lv> > any ideas? > > Could be Emagic Amt8? > Does another piece of Midi gear work fine on that input? it is my only piece of gear :[ > Does Amt8 receive any messages from the NM? well, i can sequence midi into the nord i just cannot record events out. when i attempt to record i appear to get a sysex dump only. ie. 0 1 1 1 sysex 51 80 t.c./clavia 0 1 1 38 sysex 51 80 t.c./clavia 0 1 1 51 sysex 51 80 t.c./clavia 0 1 1 74 sysex 51 80 t.c./clavia 0 1 1 162 sysex 51 80 t.c./clavia 0 1 1 137 sysex 51 80 t.c./clavia etc... so something is getting thru. ______________//________________ right click a knob and goto the last entry on the menu and assign it a midi cc # once you do that you should be able to record everything forgive me again. i am not sure i understand the right click part. ek. . ' From jimmy.m at home.se Thu Feb 13 15:35:44 2003 From: jimmy.m at home.se (Jimmy Myhrman) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular SPDIF out References: <63963627-3DFC-11D7-9F22-000A957654DE@3phase.de><00ae01c2d20d$f13b7a50$f0f90bc1@glass> <007601c2d23c$d4856d60$0300000a@analogue> Message-ID: <003001c2d3b8$a163a320$f0f90bc1@glass> Hi, The schematic isn't final yet I'm afraid. There is a small bug that I need to sort out first; the circuit needs to be reset a few times when virus is powered on, just in order to get the bits "aligned" properly. I don't know why this happens yet....but I'm working on it. I do have some pictures though: http://jm.hemmet.chalmers.se/SPDIF/ not very helpful....only for fun=) The old schematic is there as well, but don't look to much on it......I've changed it slightly already. Only use it to get ideas... /Jimmy.M (http://myhrman.iuma.com) 7uke wrote: >> BTW, I added an SPDIF output to my Access Virus B, and this fact was >> confirmed very well; you can't hear any differencies between the >> analog outs and the digital out at all (except for the lack of >> analog noise from the digital out). > > Hey Jimmy, do you have the details for doing that handy? > I'd like to do it to mine just for convienience sake. > > cheers > > 7uke From john at johntennant.com Thu Feb 13 15:55:52 2003 From: john at johntennant.com (John Tennant) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 In-Reply-To: <3E4C2702.2080901@wanadoo.nl> Message-ID: I had some problems where the logic was receiving data from the programming ports of the modular. Logic didn't like this. Make sure to set up your OMS input mappings to exclude the ports that the programmer uses and only receive and send from/to the midi side of the modular. John On 2/13/03 3:15 PM, "Wout Blommers" wrote: > ?_______________ ? wrote: >> hallo, >> >> thanks for responding. >> >> this is my fustration. i cannot seem to be able to >> record these Midi Notes and Knobs . >> >> any ideas? > > Could be Emagic Amt8? > Does another piece of Midi gear work fine on that input? > Does Amt8 receive any messages from the NM? > > Wout > > > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From l---------------------l at inbox.lv Thu Feb 13 14:50:20 2003 From: l---------------------l at inbox.lv (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=95=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=20=95?=) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: Message-ID: <3E4C212C.49E0BA79@inbox.lv> YYYYYYYYYEAAAAAAH BABY. exklude the ports. you i could absolutely kiss right now!!! thanks . ek. 100% glee. John Tennant wrote: > > I had some problems where the logic was receiving data from the programming > ports of the modular. Logic didn't like this. Make sure to set up your OMS > input mappings to exclude the ports that the programmer uses and only > receive and send from/to the midi side of the modular. > > John > From dpeck at euphonix.com Thu Feb 13 10:44:23 2003 From: dpeck at euphonix.com (Dave Peck) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] three patches Message-ID: <000a01c2d38f$ed8dc330$640314cf@euphonix.com> Hi all, Here's three more. FM Random Timbre uses a partial generator & clocked random generators to select a new FM harmonic tuning & new values for wave wrap amount & FMB amount with each new note. Sort of a bell like tone with variations in the tone as you play each note. Phasemod Drone is a four note drone that uses audio-rate modulation of filter fc & resonance, with phase mod for the modulation oscs. Crank the reverb. Smooth OD pad is another that combines clean & distorted filters. Note that only one osc goes tot eh distorted filter, which helps keep the sound smooth. Also, the sine wave added after both filters to beef up the fundamental. Enjoy! BTW, cool patches here lately. I especially like talk radio and DistSingerLead. Dave Peck Euphonix, Inc. 220 Portage Ave. Palo Alto, CA 94306 650-846-1192 -------------- next part -------------- [Header] Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 12 480 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 [/Header] [ModuleDump] 1 1 1 2 28 3 97 1 19 5 85 2 1 6 22 1 22 7 66 1 24 8 43 1 26 9 33 1 28 4 13 1 11 11 74 1 6 12 33 1 9 13 44 2 4 14 66 2 6 15 43 2 8 16 33 2 10 17 97 1 1 18 13 0 19 19 44 1 14 20 30 1 16 10 49 3 11 22 20 3 19 23 84 3 16 2 5 3 27 [/ModuleDump] [ModuleDump] 0 1 127 0 1 2 94 1 1 3 94 2 1 4 4 1 4 5 4 2 4 [/ModuleDump] [CurrentNoteDump] 64 0 0 64 0 0 [/CurrentNoteDump] [CableDump] 1 1 7 0 0 9 0 1 1 7 1 0 8 0 1 1 6 0 0 7 0 1 1 3 1 0 6 0 1 3 4 0 0 3 0 1 3 18 0 0 3 0 1 1 11 1 0 12 0 1 0 11 0 0 4 0 1 1 14 0 0 16 0 1 1 14 1 0 15 0 1 1 13 0 0 14 0 1 0 13 1 0 11 0 1 0 5 1 0 13 0 1 3 5 0 0 17 0 1 1 19 0 0 20 0 1 0 19 1 0 18 0 1 0 4 1 0 19 0 1 2 22 1 0 1 1 1 2 23 0 0 22 1 0 2 9 0 0 1 1 1 2 12 0 0 1 1 1 2 16 0 0 1 1 1 0 10 1 0 5 0 1 0 22 0 0 10 2 1 1 10 0 0 23 0 1 1 22 3 0 1 2 1 1 23 2 0 22 3 0 0 2 0 0 22 1 1 [/CableDump] [CableDump] 0 0 2 0 0 1 0 1 0 3 0 0 2 0 0 0 4 1 0 2 1 1 0 4 0 0 2 0 1 0 5 1 0 3 1 1 0 5 0 0 3 0 1 [/CableDump] [ParameterDump] 1 2 5 3 127 4 0 3 97 5 64 64 1 0 127 4 13 4 64 64 77 0 5 85 5 64 64 0 89 0 6 22 1 9 7 66 5 0 64 0 90 1 8 43 2 127 0 9 33 2 0 0 10 49 4 74 31 15 59 11 74 2 30 33 12 33 2 0 0 13 44 1 0 14 66 5 0 50 0 70 1 15 43 2 127 0 16 33 2 0 0 17 97 5 64 64 1 0 0 18 13 4 64 64 0 0 19 44 1 1 20 30 1 26 22 20 6 0 0 110 81 97 0 23 84 3 0 115 0 [/ParameterDump] [ParameterDump] 0 1 127 1 0 2 94 3 44 0 0 3 94 3 100 0 0 4 4 3 127 0 0 5 4 3 127 0 0 [/ParameterDump] [MorphMapDump] 105 0 0 0 0 2 1 0 127 0 3 1 0 127 [/MorphMapDump] [KnobMapDump] 1 10 2 2 1 10 3 1 1 22 1 3 1 22 2 4 1 22 4 5 2 1 0 0 [/KnobMapDump] [CustomDump] 1 3 1 0 4 1 0 5 1 0 10 1 0 17 1 0 18 1 0 20 1 1 [/CustomDump] [CustomDump] 0 [/CustomDump] [NameDump] 1 1 Keyboard1 2 Dave Peck 3 MasterOsc1 4 OscSlvE1 5 OscSlvFM2 6 PartialGen1 7 ControlMixer1 8 Constant1 9 ClkRndGen1 10 KN2, 3 11 WaveWrap1 12 ClkRndGen2 13 GainControl1 14 ControlMixer2 15 Constant2 16 ClkRndGen3 17 MasterOsc2 18 OscSlvE2 19 GainControl2 20 LFOSlvE1 22 KN4,5,6 23 AD-Env1 [/NameDump] [NameDump] 0 1 PolyAreaIn1 2 StChorus1 3 StChorus2 4 2 outputs1 5 2 outputs2 [/NameDump] -------------- next part -------------- [Header] Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 4 611 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 [/Header] [ModuleDump] 1 2 4 3 0 3 51 2 6 5 14 1 15 4 7 1 19 7 30 1 26 8 85 1 9 9 74 1 4 10 50 1 0 11 30 1 7 12 30 2 0 13 19 0 9 14 30 0 11 15 11 0 22 16 19 0 15 17 30 0 17 1 97 0 29 6 21 3 26 18 26 1 33 19 30 1 37 20 44 1 29 21 110 1 31 22 1 0 37 23 62 2 15 24 30 2 18 25 49 2 26 26 30 2 35 27 30 2 33 28 66 2 31 29 44 3 12 32 66 3 16 31 30 3 20 30 30 3 22 33 66 3 14 34 43 3 18 35 50 3 6 36 19 3 4 37 43 0 33 38 110 2 2 39 66 2 4 [/ModuleDump] [ModuleDump] 0 [/ModuleDump] [CurrentNoteDump] 50 35 58 36 35 52 57 52 55 50 53 58 43 41 53 [/CurrentNoteDump] [CableDump] 1 3 5 0 0 4 1 1 3 8 0 0 5 0 0 3 15 0 0 4 1 1 1 4 4 0 7 0 1 0 3 2 0 5 0 1 0 9 0 0 8 0 1 0 10 0 0 9 0 1 0 3 0 0 10 0 1 1 9 1 0 11 0 1 0 3 1 0 4 0 1 1 13 2 0 14 0 1 0 8 2 0 13 0 1 1 16 2 0 17 0 1 0 16 1 0 15 0 1 0 13 1 0 16 1 0 0 5 3 0 16 0 1 3 17 0 0 1 0 1 3 14 0 0 17 0 0 3 7 0 0 1 0 1 3 11 0 0 7 0 0 3 12 0 0 11 0 0 3 24 0 0 12 0 0 3 27 0 0 24 0 0 3 26 0 0 27 0 0 3 30 0 0 24 0 0 3 31 0 0 30 0 0 3 38 0 0 12 0 0 1 18 0 0 19 0 1 1 20 0 0 21 0 1 1 20 1 0 18 0 1 1 4 3 0 20 0 1 0 23 0 0 3 0 1 1 23 1 0 24 0 1 0 6 0 0 25 2 1 1 28 0 0 26 0 1 1 28 1 0 27 0 1 1 25 0 0 28 0 1 0 25 1 0 23 0 1 1 32 0 0 30 0 1 1 32 1 0 31 0 1 0 29 1 0 6 0 1 1 33 0 0 32 0 1 1 33 1 0 34 0 1 1 29 0 0 33 0 1 0 36 1 0 35 0 1 0 36 2 0 35 2 1 0 2 1 0 36 0 1 0 2 0 0 2 1 0 0 35 0 0 29 0 1 1 1 0 0 22 0 1 1 1 1 0 37 0 1 1 3 3 0 39 0 1 1 39 0 0 12 0 1 1 39 1 0 38 0 1 [/CableDump] [CableDump] 0 [/CableDump] [ParameterDump] 1 1 97 5 0 64 0 62 108 2 4 3 127 0 0 3 51 10 0 0 31 70 25 60 64 1 22 0 4 7 10 64 64 64 64 3 0 23 0 46 0 5 14 5 64 64 2 0 0 6 21 9 54 27 25 20 30 12 0 0 0 7 30 1 13 8 85 5 64 64 0 0 0 9 74 2 32 40 10 50 3 83 0 0 11 30 1 2 12 30 1 12 13 19 3 127 127 115 14 30 1 10 15 11 4 64 64 0 0 16 19 3 127 127 117 17 30 1 8 18 26 6 95 1 0 27 0 0 19 30 1 31 20 44 1 1 21 110 1 24 23 62 2 51 60 24 30 1 8 25 49 4 72 0 17 34 26 30 1 5 27 30 1 30 28 66 5 0 110 0 89 1 29 44 1 1 30 30 1 6 31 30 1 28 32 66 5 0 111 0 96 1 33 66 5 0 127 0 127 0 34 43 2 86 1 35 50 3 112 12 0 36 19 3 127 127 110 37 43 2 0 1 38 110 1 27 39 66 5 0 116 0 98 1 [/ParameterDump] [ParameterDump] 0 [/ParameterDump] [KnobMapDump] 1 3 3 4 1 9 1 3 1 23 1 5 1 25 0 1 1 25 2 2 1 34 0 6 1 37 0 0 [/KnobMapDump] [CustomDump] 1 1 1 0 3 1 0 4 1 0 5 1 0 7 1 1 8 1 0 10 1 0 11 1 1 12 1 1 14 1 1 15 1 0 17 1 1 19 1 1 21 1 1 24 1 1 25 1 0 26 1 1 27 1 1 30 1 1 31 1 1 35 1 0 38 1 1 [/CustomDump] [CustomDump] 0 [/CustomDump] [NameDump] 1 1 SWEEP = KN1 2 Dave Peck 3 KN5 4 OscA1 5 OscSlvA1 6 Compressor1 7 LFOSlvE1 8 OscSlvFM1 9 KN4 10 FilterC1 11 LFOSlvE2 12 LFOSlvE3 13 Phase mod 14 LFOSlvE4 15 for phasemod 16 Phase mod 17 LFOSlvE5 18 Vibrato 19 LFOSlvE6 20 VibAmtCtrl 21 RandomGen1 22 Keyboard1 23 KN6 24 LFOSlvE7 25 KN2, 3 26 LFOSlvE8 27 LFOSlvE9 28 ControlMixer1 29 Dynamics 30 LFOSlvE8 31 LFOSlvE9 32 ControlMixer1 33 ControlMixer2 34 DRONE=KN7 35 FilterC2 36 Mixer1 37 Rate=KN1 38 RandomGen2 39 ControlMixer2 [/NameDump] [NameDump] 0 [/NameDump] -------------- next part -------------- [Header] Version=Nord Modular patch 3.0 0 127 0 127 2 0 0 8 548 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 [/Header] [ModuleDump] 1 1 1 1 34 2 4 2 33 3 97 0 11 4 11 0 8 5 49 1 0 7 19 0 0 10 18 1 15 11 92 2 0 13 62 2 13 6 20 1 26 15 20 2 19 12 61 2 10 16 19 2 6 17 87 2 8 18 81 2 16 19 66 1 31 20 50 2 24 21 19 2 28 22 18 2 30 8 11 0 5 9 11 0 2 24 19 1 19 23 14 0 19 25 83 1 24 14 80 0 14 [/ModuleDump] [ModuleDump] 0 [/ModuleDump] [CurrentNoteDump] 64 0 0 64 0 0 [/CurrentNoteDump] [CableDump] 1 3 4 0 0 3 0 1 3 8 0 0 4 0 0 3 9 0 0 8 0 0 3 23 0 0 3 0 1 0 5 1 0 7 0 1 2 15 1 0 1 1 1 2 6 1 0 1 1 1 0 16 1 0 11 0 1 0 12 0 0 16 0 1 0 17 0 0 12 0 1 0 13 0 0 12 0 1 0 16 2 0 17 0 1 0 10 0 0 5 2 1 0 10 1 0 18 0 1 0 18 0 0 13 0 1 1 19 0 0 1 2 1 1 6 3 0 19 0 1 0 20 0 0 15 1 1 0 22 0 0 20 0 0 0 21 1 0 20 2 1 0 21 2 0 20 0 1 0 22 1 0 21 0 1 0 2 1 0 22 0 1 0 2 0 0 2 1 0 0 7 0 0 4 0 1 0 11 2 0 4 0 1 4 23 3 0 4 0 1 0 7 2 0 9 0 1 0 7 1 0 8 0 1 0 15 0 0 24 0 1 0 24 2 0 10 0 1 0 24 0 0 23 0 1 1 5 0 0 25 0 1 1 13 1 0 25 0 1 1 11 1 0 13 1 0 1 25 0 0 6 0 1 1 3 1 0 14 0 1 [/CableDump] [CableDump] 0 [/CableDump] [ParameterDump] 1 2 4 3 110 0 0 3 97 5 64 64 1 0 0 4 11 4 64 64 0 0 5 49 4 53 32 80 100 6 20 6 0 0 107 14 106 0 7 19 3 127 112 102 8 11 4 64 56 0 0 9 11 4 64 76 0 0 10 18 2 0 71 11 92 7 41 32 75 0 100 1 0 12 61 3 0 0 0 13 62 2 28 20 14 80 5 100 64 0 1 0 15 20 6 0 28 77 127 90 0 16 19 3 127 127 118 17 87 1 23 18 81 1 32 19 66 5 0 98 0 127 1 20 50 3 112 12 0 21 19 3 127 110 127 22 18 2 0 47 23 14 5 64 64 0 0 0 24 19 3 118 127 127 25 83 1 1 [/ParameterDump] [ParameterDump] 0 [/ParameterDump] [MorphMapDump] 4 114 0 0 1 3 4 0 28 1 13 0 1 59 1 13 1 1 20 1 16 2 1 9 [/MorphMapDump] [KnobMapDump] 1 6 2 3 1 10 1 0 1 11 2 1 1 15 1 7 1 15 4 8 1 19 1 4 1 22 1 5 1 24 0 6 2 1 1 2 [/KnobMapDump] [CtrlMapDump] 2 1 0 1 [/CtrlMapDump] [CustomDump] 1 3 1 0 4 1 0 5 1 0 8 1 0 9 1 0 11 1 0 14 1 1 20 1 0 23 1 0 [/CustomDump] [CustomDump] 0 [/CustomDump] [NameDump] 1 1 Keyboard1 2 Dave Peck 3 MasterOsc1 4 OscSlvC1 5 FilterD1 6 decay=KN4 7 Mixer1 8 OscSlvC2 9 OscSlvC3 10 filtermix=KN1 11 REZZ=KN2 12 Clip1 13 Overdrive2 14 Mono Vib 15 AR=KN8/9 16 CLIP FBACK 17 FilterB1 18 Level match 19 EG Amt=KN5 20 warmth 21 Mixer3 22 warmth=KN6 23 Fundamental 24 SubSine=KN7 25 Linear decay [/NameDump] [NameDump] 0 [/NameDump] From daniel at bomben.se Thu Feb 13 20:14:13 2003 From: daniel at bomben.se (Daniel Wiklander) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1045196052.3e4c6d1502991@bomben.se> I may be dim or something, but I have yet to figure out how to do that. How? Citerat fr?n John Tennant : > I had some problems where the logic was receiving data from the > programming > ports of the modular. Logic didn't like this. Make sure to set up your > OMS > input mappings to exclude the ports that the programmer uses and only > receive and send from/to the midi side of the modular. > > John > > On 2/13/03 3:15 PM, "Wout Blommers" wrote: > > > ?_______________ ? wrote: > >> hallo, > >> > >> thanks for responding. > >> > >> this is my fustration. i cannot seem to be able to > >> record these Midi Notes and Knobs . > >> > >> any ideas? > > > > Could be Emagic Amt8? > > Does another piece of Midi gear work fine on that input? > > Does Amt8 receive any messages from the NM? > > > > Wout > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Nord-Modular mailing list > > Nord-Modular@code404.com > > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > > _______________________________________________ > > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > > may not be redistributed without the express > > consent of the author/creator. > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > > From chsinger at localnet.com Thu Feb 13 20:32:58 2003 From: chsinger at localnet.com (Chet Singer) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] Organ model References: <1045196052.3e4c6d1502991@bomben.se> Message-ID: <001101c2d3e2$296d6520$259428cf@207d511> Hi everyone, Here are some patches I made with a Hammond organ model. This model has nine drawbars, percussion, key click, a variable-curve preamp, and a pair of bi-amped rotating speakers. The rotation speed is controlled by the NM's footpedal. All controls are brought out to the front panel. The mod wheel acts like a crescendo pedal on some old pipe organs. Cranking down the mod wheel shuts off the drawbars, the highest ones first. Thanks to Kofi for finding me a link that described the volume curve of the drawbars (3dB per setting). As you can probably guess, I don't own a decent organ module. Cheers, Chet -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: csB7-88-8000-000.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 6256 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/c50eff89/csB7-88-8000-000.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: csB7-88-8400-080.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 6260 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/c50eff89/csB7-88-8400-080.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: csB7-88-8808-008.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 6260 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/c50eff89/csB7-88-8808-008.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: csB7-88-8888-888.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 6270 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/c50eff89/csB7-88-8888-888.obj -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: csB7-86-4202-468.pch Type: application/octet-stream Size: 6260 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.code404.com/pipermail/nord-modular/attachments/20030213/c50eff89/csB7-86-4202-468.obj From dedear at btinternet.com Fri Feb 14 01:21:21 2003 From: dedear at btinternet.com (dedear@btinternet.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:19 2004 Subject: [NM] Road cases Message-ID: <7229184.1045214481647.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> Hello All, I recemdly got a modular key and have since purchased one of the soft cases by Clavia. I would like to get a decent live road case. Has anyone in the UK or Europe got any recommendations? cheers scott ________________________ http://www.girlinky.com From Terryfunken at aol.com Fri Feb 14 01:41:25 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 Message-ID: <1e8.1dfcc5a.2b7e13c5@aol.com> In a message dated 14/2/03 4:15:19 am, daniel@bomben.se writes: >> I had some problems where the logic was receiving data from the > >> programming > >> ports of the modular. Logic didn't like this. Make sure to set up your > >> OMS > >> input mappings to exclude the ports that the programmer uses and only > >> receive and send from/to the midi side of the modular. > >> Does anyone mac-orientated here, know how to set an mt4 up so one port is exclusive to the NM and the other one can be used for midi i/o to Logic? Ideally I would like to be able to run the NM editor in the background to Logic and be able to switch between applications on the same computer (I'm running Logic 4.7.2 in OS 9.1 here on a G4 Ti 500 powerbook). Tom From Terryfunken at aol.com Fri Feb 14 01:45:22 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] Road cases Message-ID: In a message dated 14/2/03 9:21:48 am, dedear@btinternet.com writes: >I recemdly got a modular key and have since purchased one of the soft cases >by Clavia. I would like to get a decent live road case. Has anyone in the >UK or Europe got any recommendations? > > I don't think you have to buy anything expensive. A metal camera case from Jessops will do fine! Tom :-) From ico at pruts.nl Fri Feb 14 02:00:03 2003 From: ico at pruts.nl (Ico Doornekamp) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] Manual and Wizoo book for whoever wants them In-Reply-To: <7229184.1045214481647.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> References: <7229184.1045214481647.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: <20030214100003.GA9450@pruts.nl> Hi, I bought an extra NM last week and got an extra 2.1 manual with it, which I don't need. I also have a unused wizoo guide lying around. If you're interested in one or both, mail me privately and I'd be glad to send them to you. /Ico From mestrez.pierre at usa.net Fri Feb 14 02:10:35 2003 From: mestrez.pierre at usa.net (Pierre Mestrez) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] Any Beta Tester for OS 4.0 and Editor 4.0 ? References: <7229184.1045214481647.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> <20030214100003.GA9450@pruts.nl> Message-ID: <018701c2d411$50be3350$610c0b0a@EVS.TV> Hello, I would like to know if anybody have receive any Beta version of OS 4.0 and Editor ? Thanks. Pierre. From dedear at btinternet.com Fri Feb 14 02:25:15 2003 From: dedear at btinternet.com (dedear@btinternet.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] Road cases Message-ID: <5086592.1045218315862.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> Thanks Tom. I might just do that. I sent you a message off-group a week or so ago after you mentioned meeting up with another Modular user in Manchester. Did you get it? By the way the soft case for the Modular is very good. Excellent for carrying the modular on the tube. scott > from: Terryfunken@aol.com > date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 09:45:22 > to: nord-modular@code404.com > subject: Re: [NM] Road cases > > > In a message dated 14/2/03 9:21:48 am, dedear@btinternet.com writes: > > >I recemdly got a modular key and have since purchased one of the soft cases > >by Clavia. I would like to get a decent live road case. Has anyone in the > >UK or Europe got any recommendations? > > > > > I don't think you have to buy anything expensive. A metal camera case from > Jessops will do fine! > > Tom :-) > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Fri Feb 14 02:34:59 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] Any Beta Tester for OS 4.0 and Editor 4.0 ? References: <7229184.1045214481647.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> <20030214100003.GA9450@pruts.nl> <018701c2d411$50be3350$610c0b0a@EVS.TV> Message-ID: <3E4CC652.50505@wanadoo.nl> Pierre Mestrez wrote: > I would like to know if anybody have receive any Beta version of OS 4.0 and > Editor ? I would be very surprised... Wout From bacizone at freemail.hu Fri Feb 14 02:47:06 2003 From: bacizone at freemail.hu (Bacizone) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] attach. in digest Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030214114210.0343ebd8@freemail.hu> Just a question: when I got each modular-list message separately, then every *.pch attachments were fine: separated into the attachment directory of my mail client (Eudora). Later I changed to digest mode, and pch attachments are included into the digest as text, not separated. I prefer the digest format, but should I change back to "individaul message" mode or any is there any other solution to get the pch attachments properly separated ? Thanks, Bacizone From blommoo at wanadoo.nl Fri Feb 14 02:50:34 2003 From: blommoo at wanadoo.nl (Wout Blommers) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:20 2004 Subject: [NM] attach. in digest References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030214114210.0343ebd8@freemail.hu> Message-ID: <3E4CC9FA.2070107@wanadoo.nl> Bacizone wrote: > I prefer the digest format, but should I change back to "individaul > message" mode or any is there any other solution to get the pch > attachments properly separated ? You can always go to the Archive at http://www.nordsynth.zevv.nl/ where all the Patches send to the List are filed in 'recent patches'. Just click on the 'date' option and you'll out find which Patches are send that day. Wout From kevcol at comcast.net Fri Feb 14 03:33:14 2003 From: kevcol at comcast.net (Kevin Collins) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Manual and Wizoo book for whoever wants them References: <7229184.1045214481647.JavaMail.root@127.0.0.1> <20030214100003.GA9450@pruts.nl> Message-ID: <005c01c2d41c$dc9106e0$f9de2444@kevincollins> Hi, I could really use both. Thank you Kevin Collins c/o CSC Management 180 Summit Ave Suite 201 Montvale N.J. 07645 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ico Doornekamp" To: "Nord Modular" Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 5:00 AM Subject: [NM] Manual and Wizoo book for whoever wants them > > > Hi, > > I bought an extra NM last week and got an extra 2.1 manual with it, which I > don't need. I also have a unused wizoo guide lying around. > > If you're interested in one or both, mail me privately and I'd be glad to > send them to you. > > /Ico > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From l---------------------l at inbox.lv Fri Feb 14 02:32:01 2003 From: l---------------------l at inbox.lv (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=95=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=20=95?=) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] midi out to logic v4.8 References: <1045196052.3e4c6d1502991@bomben.se> Message-ID: <3E4CC5A1.8E588CA0@inbox.lv> hallo, one can alter 'oms input connections' within logic preferences. unassign ports for programmer / assign actual midi connection to device. viola. i believe this is also possible thru the unitor8 app. thanks again john + wout. ek Daniel Wiklander wrote: > > I may be dim or something, but I have yet to figure out how to do that. How? > > Citerat fr?n John Tennant : > > > I had some problems where the logic was receiving data from the > > programming > > ports of the modular. Logic didn't like this. Make sure to set up your > > OMS > > input mappings to exclude the ports that the programmer uses and only > > receive and send from/to the midi side of the modular. > > > > John From Terryfunken at aol.com Fri Feb 14 04:27:08 2003 From: Terryfunken at aol.com (Terryfunken@aol.com) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Road cases Message-ID: <90.32738b1c.2b7e3a9c@aol.com> In a message dated 14/2/03 10:26:20 am, dedear@btinternet.com writes: >Thanks Tom. I might just do that. I sent you a message off-group a week >or so ago after you mentioned meeting up with another Modular user in Manchester. >Did you get it? Sorry Scott, I probably forgot!- I guess I need to put more tobacco in it eh? hehehe Tom :-) From nostromo at arkaos.net Fri Feb 14 05:14:13 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Sweet controller References: <90.32738b1c.2b7e3a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <013f01c2d42a$f84dfa10$d801a8c0@nostromo> Everyone tried to hook the nord to this ? Seems purrfect for MM users. http://evolution-i.org/u-control/# M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ From johan.boberg at staff.spray.se Fri Feb 14 05:28:10 2003 From: johan.boberg at staff.spray.se (Johan Boberg) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Sweet controller Message-ID: I would like to see a controller that could be put between the MM data in and the computer (not midi in) that would add the "missing" knobs on the MM. That way i wouldn't have to reassign buttons to MIDI CC's. This might be something for clavia to build or something that theoretically could be built after the NM editor cloning project has reverse engineered the protocol between the editor and the box. Johan __ _-? ?-_ - johan -_ _ ? - boberg - ?-_ _-? ?? > -----Original Message----- > From: M-.-n [mailto:nostromo@arkaos.net] > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 2:14 PM > To: Nord Modular > Subject: [NM] Sweet controller > > > Everyone tried to hook the nord to this ? Seems purrfect for MM users. > > http://evolution-i.org/u-control/# > > M-.-n > > http://n0s.10pm.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > Nord-Modular mailing list > Nord-Modular@code404.com > http://code404.com/mailman/listinfo/nord-modular > _______________________________________________ > Patches sent to the Nord-Modular mailing list > may not be redistributed without the express > consent of the author/creator. > From nostromo at arkaos.net Fri Feb 14 05:37:31 2003 From: nostromo at arkaos.net (M-.-n) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Sweet controller References: Message-ID: <014d01c2d42e$395374b0$d801a8c0@nostromo> Yes that make sense. Something that takes Midi CC and transforms them into appropriate SYSEX strings and then merges it into the stream coming from the editor. Is there any existing virtual midi drivers that allow you to merge input streams ? I guess this could be done using cubase mixermaps... but you'd have to have it not running at the same time as the editor. M-.-n http://n0s.10pm.org/ From jweisbin at mindspring.com Fri Feb 14 05:50:54 2003 From: jweisbin at mindspring.com (James Weisbin) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Getting the nord to act as a midi controller for software Message-ID: <5660ABB4-4023-11D7-ADF8-00306578EBA4@mindspring.com> "andre@sansserif.com.au" wrote: > i can get it to act as a master keyboard (playing notes) but when i > try to assign the nord knobs to parameters within REASON, REASON does > not seem to pick up any of the midi output while turning the knobs.. > Go to "preferences", "advanced midi", select your keyboard as midi remote. Jim Weisbin http://www.savagetranscendental.com From 3phase at 3phase.de Fri Feb 14 08:30:26 2003 From: 3phase at 3phase.de (3phase) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Nord Modular Emulation on Reaktor In-Reply-To: <013f01c2d42a$f84dfa10$d801a8c0@nostromo> Message-ID: <9F44B0D8-4039-11D7-BA33-000A957654DE@3phase.de> I just got Reaktor from Native Instruments (btw. the people there call the storys about a project with clavia gossip...but it was the management, maybe they just keep secrets better :-),) Its not a bad Program at all, Patching is not as quick and free as with the Nord, mainly because of the lack of direkt dynamical value entry on structure level. But the Macros are a very nice thing. I wonder if i should built macros that emulate the Nord Modules, This way i could do some patches that are easier to transfer into the Nord. I allways have my Laptop with me...but not the Big Nord. Has anybody tryed this yet? Or are there other Nord users that own Reaktor , that might be interested in collaborating in such a projekt? would save some Time... Sven From valis at ucla.edu Fri Feb 14 08:44:27 2003 From: valis at ucla.edu (valis@ucla.edu) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Road cases In-Reply-To: <90.32738b1c.2b7e3a9c@aol.com> References: <90.32738b1c.2b7e3a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <1045241067.3e4d1cebc72dd@mail.ucla.edu> Quoting Terryfunken@aol.com: > > Sorry Scott, I probably forgot!- I guess I need to put more tobacco in it > eh? > hehehe > _More_ tobacco?? You wacky Europeans! ;) Get a good piece of glass and forget the tobacco altogether... California style! :) :) :) vV From rhordijk at xs4all.nl Fri Feb 14 08:43:40 2003 From: rhordijk at xs4all.nl (Rob Hordijk) Date: Thu Sep 30 16:01:21 2004 Subject: [NM] Sweet controller, Call to Jan Punter In-Reply-To: Message-ID: A Peavey PC1600X should be able to do just that, provided the sysex strings are not too long. Each fader can send a user programmable sysex string with the fader value embedded and the right checksum calculated. I don't recall the max length of the strings, but I remember having programmed strings of about 20 bytes which should be enough. The PC1600X is together with the Kurzweil ExpressionMate still top off my list when it comes to programming flexibility. Both can do things waaay beyond the simple midi knobby box and have been doing it at my place for quite some time now (like the NM). My guess is that you are talking about the 15 knob difference between the MM and NM, right? As the Peavey might also send the strings for _any_ knob, e.g. the knobs on a module that are yet unassigned but rotated by mouse movement in the Editor. Only how to know which fader goes to which knob? So, a call to *Jan Punter*: Jan, do you know the system which surely is there? I mean: when a patch is built and one turns an arbitrary knob with the mouse in the editor, which sysex info is send through the PC ports to effectively change that parameter in the Nord? Is there enough of a system to program a midi fader box to send those strings? Do these knobs get some type of tag when their module is placed in the editor? Or is it all just useless gobbledegook on the PC ports? Greets, Rob > -----Original Message----- > From: nord-modular-bounces@code404.com > [mailto:nord-modular-bounces@code404.com]On Behalf Of Johan Boberg > Sent: vrijdag 14 februari 2003 14:28 > To: Nord Modular > Subject: RE: [NM] Sweet controller > > > I would like to see a controller that could be put